Philippe GILBERT! IS HE ALL THAT?!?!
littleking02
Posts: 132
He is currently 3rd in the UCI world ranking, and the last time i saw him win a race was at the Tour of Lombardy (plz correct me if I am wrong).
But to the point...is he really the best 3rd racer? in front of the likes of Leon Sanchez, Nibali, Boonen...etc???
But to the point...is he really the best 3rd racer? in front of the likes of Leon Sanchez, Nibali, Boonen...etc???
ITS BY DOING WHAT EVER, THAT YOU BECOME WHOEVER!
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Yes, or better.Mañana0
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Meh, I've had this discussion with guys on here.
He's as good as Boonen/Canc are on cobbles in the hilly classics, but isn't quite there on the cobbled races.
He's no stage racer and Boonen (used to, and only occasionally still does) has a shout in the sprints (green jersey anyone?) and Canc is obviously one of the world's best ever TTers.0 -
Do you think if he was with a 'better' team he would be doing much better at stage races. Even though i belive he is a good one day racer, he would be much better with a different team, i.e. sky or saxo bank.ITS BY DOING WHAT EVER, THAT YOU BECOME WHOEVER!0
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littleking02 wrote:Do you think if he was with a 'better' team he would be doing much better at stage races?
No I don't. He's an excellent specialist one - day racer.0 -
littleking02 wrote:He is currently 3rd in the UCI world ranking, and the last time i saw him win a race was at the Tour of Lombardy (plz correct me if I am wrong).
But to the point...is he really the best 3rd racer? in front of the likes of Leon Sanchez, Nibali, Boonen...etc???
Boonen
He is.
I think only Spartacus has been better this year.0 -
Gazzaputt wrote:littleking02 wrote:He is currently 3rd in the UCI world ranking, and the last time i saw him win a race was at the Tour of Lombardy (plz correct me if I am wrong).
But to the point...is he really the best 3rd racer? in front of the likes of Leon Sanchez, Nibali, Boonen...etc???
Boonen
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Explain yourself.0 -
Tom Boonen
2010
1st Stage 5 Tour of Oman
1st Stage 2 Tirreno–Adriatico
2nd Milan – San Remo
2nd E3 Prijs Vlaanderen
2nd Ronde van Vlaanderen
3rd Overall Tour of Qatar
1st Stage 3
1st Stage 5
5th Paris–Roubaix
Philippe Gilbert
2010
1st Stage 3 Vuelta a España
1st Stage 19 Vuelta a España
1st Giro di Lombardia
1st Stage 1 Tour of Belgium
1st Amstel Gold Race
1st Giro del Piemonte
3rd Gent–Wevelgem
3rd Ronde van Vlaanderen
3rd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
5th Brabantse Pijl
6th La Flèche Wallonne
9th Milan – San Remo
Gilbert has been much better than Boonen this season.Mañana0 -
pb21 wrote:Tom Boonen
2010
1st Stage 5 Tour of Oman
1st Stage 2 Tirreno–Adriatico
2nd Milan – San Remo
2nd E3 Prijs Vlaanderen
2nd Ronde van Vlaanderen
3rd Overall Tour of Qatar
1st Stage 3
1st Stage 5
5th Paris–Roubaix
Philippe Gilbert
2010
1st Stage 3 Vuelta a España
1st Stage 19 Vuelta a España
1st Giro di Lombardia
1st Stage 1 Tour of Belgium
1st Amstel Gold Race
1st Giro del Piemonte
3rd Gent–Wevelgem
3rd Ronde van Vlaanderen
3rd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
5th Brabantse Pijl
6th La Flèche Wallonne
9th Milan – San Remo
Gilbert has been much better than Boonen this season.
Boonen's been out for most of the year with a knackered knee which he had to have surgery on - hardly a fair comparison.
He was really excellent in the early season from MS-R to P-R and, after Canc (who was in a different league), was head and shoulders above everyone else on the cobbles.
2nd in MS-R isn't to be sniffed at either!0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:Boonen's been out for most of the year with a knackered knee which he had to have surgery on - hardly a fair comparison.
He was really excellent in the early season from MS-R to P-R and, after Canc (who was in a different league), was head and shoulders above everyone else on the cobbles.
2nd in MS-R isn't to be sniffed at either!
I think we are getting crossed wires!
No doubt Boonen is a strong rider and perhaps 'better' than Gilbert when they are both on top form, but I dont think its fair to say Boonen has had a better season than Gilbert.Mañana0 -
pb21 wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Boonen's been out for most of the year with a knackered knee which he had to have surgery on - hardly a fair comparison.
He was really excellent in the early season from MS-R to P-R and, after Canc (who was in a different league), was head and shoulders above everyone else on the cobbles.
2nd in MS-R isn't to be sniffed at either!
I think we are getting crossed wires!
No doubt Boonen is a strong rider and perhaps 'better' than Gilbert when they are both on top form, but I dont think its fair to say Boonen has had a better season than Gilbert.
Fair enough.
Gilbert will never win on cobbles, and, as well, Gilbert needs races to be selective enough so he can win from a (very) small group. He's basically stuck with hiller one-day races and the odd finish on a hill in a GT.
Boonen nowadays is always a big favourite for MS-R through to P-R and can win the odd smaller bunch sprint (but has a palmares which Gilbert is get to get near), but is tactcally more flexible in the finishes with his sprint, (though he could do with a stronger QS - who's powers have been waining at the same rate as Boonen's win rate - coincidence?)
Boonen would have LOVED this year's worlds' course. Such a shame he was out.
I'm excited at the prospect of a Boonen, Canc, Hushovd 3 way in Flanders next year - maybe Ballan can re-kindle some former glory.
But no, all things considered, I rate Gilbert probably as good as Boonen in their respective diciplines, but Canc sits above them.
And i'll ignore comparing them to stage racers because it's pretty much a different discipline alltogether and barely comparable.0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:pb21 wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Boonen's been out for most of the year with a knackered knee which he had to have surgery on - hardly a fair comparison.
He was really excellent in the early season from MS-R to P-R and, after Canc (who was in a different league), was head and shoulders above everyone else on the cobbles.
2nd in MS-R isn't to be sniffed at either!
I think we are getting crossed wires!
No doubt Boonen is a strong rider and perhaps 'better' than Gilbert when they are both on top form, but I dont think its fair to say Boonen has had a better season than Gilbert.
Fair enough.
Gilbert will never win on cobbles .
Would you like to re-consider that last bit?___________________
Strava is not Zen.0 -
From wiki:
The Omloop, with the start and finish in Ghent, uses many of the climbs in the Ronde van Vlaanderen, ... It is characterised by cold weather and short cobbled climbs
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Strava is not Zen.0 -
I would say he is a better all round rider than anyone at the moment and can place in any of the Classics. However, the OP seems to be asking if he is better than riders who are mainly GT contenders and to be honest I don't think it's an answerable question. The rankings in any sport will never be perfect but they usually give a reasonable assessment. The GT riders will generally have consistent results throughout a stage race and the occassional stage win, it's just a case of whether that is better than winning regularly in one day races.
Not quite sure what the post about about him being better in a better team "like Sky" means though, are they any better than Pharma?0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:Gazzaputt wrote:littleking02 wrote:He is currently 3rd in the UCI world ranking, and the last time i saw him win a race was at the Tour of Lombardy (plz correct me if I am wrong).
But to the point...is he really the best 3rd racer? in front of the likes of Leon Sanchez, Nibali, Boonen...etc???
Boonen
.
Explain yourself.
Now or after school sir? :roll:0 -
I think we all noticed that omission.
But since when was it Pick on Rick day? He's got his opinions which are (that comment aside) fair enough.
Gilbert and a fully fit Boonen are pretty closely matched, close enough as makes no difference. Using this season to denounce Boonen is like using last weekend's Premiership results to call Chelsea sh*t, for example.
Also, the whole question is a little flawed, as the OP says Gilbert's not up to much because he's not won since Lombardy? Surprised no one's mentioned that yet0 -
Also, the whole question is a little flawed, as the OP says Gilbert's not up to much because he's not won since Lombardy? Surprised no one's mentioned that yet
I assumed that was just badly worded but yes, most of the pro peloton are over-rated as they haven't won since before Lombardy 0 -
calvjones wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Fair enough.
Gilbert will never win on cobbles .
Would you like to re-consider that last bit?
Yeah, *sighs* that one did escape my memory.
I'd suggest we could put that particular 50km escape down to what is often the case at Het Volk - that the form had come to soon?
He wasn't a big player in any of the big races that year?0 -
Gazzaputt wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Gazzaputt wrote:littleking02 wrote:He is currently 3rd in the UCI world ranking, and the last time i saw him win a race was at the Tour of Lombardy (plz correct me if I am wrong).
But to the point...is he really the best 3rd racer? in front of the likes of Leon Sanchez, Nibali, Boonen...etc???
Boonen
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Explain yourself.
Now or after school sir? :roll:
I can't help but be the Boonen fanboy on here....0 -
Rick Chasey wrote:Yeah, *sighs* that one did escape my memory.
I'd suggest we could put that particular 50km escape down to what is often the case at Het Volk - that the form had come to soon?
He wasn't a big player in any of the big races that year?
One? Your memory is shot today Rick, Gilbert has won Het Volk twice, 2006 and 2008.
I think he's the most complete one day rider in the peleton, as he, uniquely of the current generation, has the ability to win all five monuments (Cancellara will never win Lombardy or Liege).0 -
andyp wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Yeah, *sighs* that one did escape my memory.
I'd suggest we could put that particular 50km escape down to what is often the case at Het Volk - that the form had come to soon?
He wasn't a big player in any of the big races that year?
One? Your memory is shot today Rick, Gilbert has won Het Volk twice, 2006 and 2008.
I think he's the most complete one day rider in the peloton, as he, uniquely of the current generation, has the ability to win all five monuments (Cancellara will never win Lombardy or Liege).
I guess it is.
I can't see Gilbert winning Flanders or Roubaix if he's up against any of the cobbled specialists. For me, he's as good on the cobbles as Leukemans.
He's still yet won a proper spring Classic, and as I've said elsewere, Lombardy nowadays just doesn't remotely have the same level of competition to be rated on the same level as monuments in spring.
Edit: I also think Canc is more likely to do the 5 than Gilbert, even if Pip has time on his side. Pip's one 0 so far, Canc on 3, and his performance in Switzerland and Bejing suggests Canc could do it.0 -
I'd bet any amount of money that Cancellara will never win Lombardy. I'd probably be tempted to wager half of that on him never winning Liege too.
Gilbert will win Liege before he's done and I think he'll win Flanders too, especially as he's podiumed twice there already (which suggests he isn't as lame on the cobbles as you think.0 -
andyp wrote:Rick Chasey wrote:Yeah, *sighs* that one did escape my memory.
I'd suggest we could put that particular 50km escape down to what is often the case at Het Volk - that the form had come to soon?
He wasn't a big player in any of the big races that year?
One? Your memory is shot today Rick, Gilbert has won Het Volk twice, 2006 and 2008.
I think he's the most complete one day rider in the peloton, as he, uniquely of the current generation, has the ability to win all five monuments (Cancellara will never win Lombardy or Liege).
fancy betting on that one?0 -
Yes - see my posting above yours.0
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According to the greats Gilbert will be able to win every Classic.
He also provides some of the best photos in my album.Rick Chasey wrote:littleking02 wrote:Do you think if he was with a 'better' team he would be doing much better at stage races?
No I don't. He's an excellent specialist one - day racer.
According to Merckx, he is more likely to get a better placing in a GT than VDB. Saying he needs to lose some kgs and focus entirely on it.Contador is the Greatest0 -
Assuming Cancellara gets to the top of the descent with the leaders, he can descend better than anyone then TT the last part, although he may get caught back on the final climb. WOuld be hard but I could see him winning.Contador is the Greatest0
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my bad didn't read it properly but if he decides that he wants to win either of those race i think you would be a very brave/stupid man to bet against him0
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my bad didn't read it properly but if he decides that he wants to win either of those race i think you would be a very brave/stupid man to bet against him0
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ozzzyosborn206 wrote:my bad didn't read it properly but if he decides that he wants to win either of those race i think you would be a very brave/stupid man to bet against him
I disagree. He's never won a hilly one day race. Both Lombardy and Liege are normally won by puncheurs, riders who can climb and have a finishing kick. Cancellara has yet to demonstrate he has this. He also weighs 80 kgs which is a massive disadvantage on a hilly course against riders like Gilbert, either Schleck, Gesink who are more than 10 kgs lighter.0 -
I think Canc may have a poor season after leaving Riis. Just a Hunch.
Watch now as he wins PR and Liege 8)___________________
Strava is not Zen.0 -
andyp wrote:I'd bet any amount of money that Cancellara will never win Lombardy. I'd probably be tempted to wager half of that on him never winning Liege too.
Gilbert will win Liege before he's done and I think he'll win Flanders too, especially as he's podiumed twice there already (which suggests he isn't as lame on the cobbles as you think.
Agreed, 100%!!
I think he's pretty limitless, and always impresses how he can taper to perfection for the events he wants. plus he's without doubt the most exciting racer to watch right now.0
