Sugar Crash?

welkman

Right, I have been meaning to ask about this for about a month.

I have a bit of a history of having what I can only describe as ‘sugar crashes’. This has happened to me when I have been walking, climbing and cycling. It normally occurs after several hours of exercise and is completely debilitating.
I have been riding to work and back (20 miles) every day for the last six months and have managed to drop my weight down from 17.5 Stone to 13 st 9lb as well as getting much fitter, however the sugar crash thing keeps happening to me. It never happens on the way to work , but does happen on the way back from work after 5 miles or so. I eat enough at work to make sure I have the calories for the ride back, for example a typical day: Weetabix, milk, cereal bar, apple (breakfast), apple and banana (mid morning), cereal bar two ham sandwiches, banana (lunch) and a banana just before I go on the ride back.

When I get a crash I go from averaging 17-20 mph comfortably to really struggling to reach 10mph and feeling like I need to get off the bike and collapse.
I have really got into riding now and want to start doing some long rides at weekends for four to five hours, however the thought of having a massive sugar crash is really worrying me.

For a bit of extra info, I have been following the weight watchers program and have recently changed to monitoring calories on livestrong.com and am aiming to lose another stone. I have been told I have a low blood pressure (100/60) but a very strong pulse, and my day job is a secondary school teacher.

So the question is, is this normal and can I do anything to stop it?

getonyourbike

I'm really not a expert, but perphaps just take something like jelly beans with you and eat them just beore you normally have the sugar crash should get you home.

turnerjohn

right first thing .... get your doc to check you out and get a diabetic test...sounds like you are having a "lower" and thats potentially fatel...let aloan if your on the bike and have it ! It sounds as if your not getting enough basic sugar to the brain / muscles and thats why you "bonk" (running term!) and feel like you want to stop....we've all done it and it does happen; usually when youve not eaten enough.
Weight Watchers doesn't suite your lifestyle...thats a far bit of riding (and not slow riding either) which requires more calories (carbs) or your body will just shut down.
I recon your weak blood preasure maybe having effects as well. Have you been using a Heart Rate monitor ? if you have low blood preasure but a strong pulse and push hard, your going to be working your heart harder then most people and hence could be causing issues.
I'd advise going to your docs and get a propoer checkup. It could be several things but without tests your not going to be certain. I'd say take it easy a few times on the way back, and also give your body at least one day of rest a week (your jobs not exactly relaxing either!).
Good luck and go careful !

Ginjafro

You appear to miss out on a mid-afternoon snack. My typical daily diet (excluding evening meal) is:

Breakfast - Jordans Crunchy, toast or egg, tea
Mid morning snack - 100g mixed nuts, fruit, coffee
Lunch - pasta/cous cous/rice with chicken or fish, fruit, tea
Mid afternoon snack - some cottage cheese or yogurt, fruit, tea
Banana before ride home if I feel necessary.

I keep bread to a maximum of 2 slices in a day and occasionaly zero. I notice you have 2 cereal bars, they are quite calorie laden and sugary so maybe you should consider some alternatives there. I am no expert but I do believe in the "6 small meals a day routine" to keep me fueled, alert and avoid sugar crashes, It works for me.

danowat

Weetabix, milk, cereal bar, apple (breakfast), apple and banana (mid morning), cereal bar two ham sandwiches, banana (lunch) and a banana just before I go on the ride back.

Even though its a lot of fruit, which is good, there is a SERIOUS amount of carbs in the way of the sugar in the fruit, bananas in particular are very high in sugar, infact me being diabetic means I have to be careful of eating them, this amount of sugar would certainly attribute to having the body crave more sugar.

Also, dump the cereal bars, full of sugar too, I'd image, if you totted up the amount of carbs you were having, and where they came from, you'd be way, way over the recommeded amount.

I'd question, especially at 17.5 stone, weather you need all that in a day TBH, I commute 36 miles I day, and I have about half that.

Certainly get it checked out by the doc, but I wouldn't imagine its diabeties, because if you were diabetic, and having this amount of sugar, you'd be pissing 24/7!!!

welkman

Thanks for the replies. I think following weight watchers has trained me to eat loads of fruit and sugar and virtually no fat. Im still losing weight by keeping my calories to the reccomended amount on livestrongs daily plate program but if Im not getting the calories I need from fruit/bread then where should I be looking? I was under the impression that fats and protien in large amounts were bad for you.

Danowat I was 17.5st and am now down to 13.9st. I have tried eating less than this but if I do I virtually guarantee a sugar crash on the way home. Also Its funny what you say about pissing all the time, I do seem to go more than the average person. I have been to the doctors about this and they said 'drink orange juice' there was no talk of testing for anything. Maybe I should see if I can get some tests done privatley? Also I find that I am seriously tired most of the time but just attribute it to the job, recently I have been in bed by 2030 to get up at 0545 and have still felt shattered.

Cheers

turnerjohn

welkman wrote:

Thanks for the replies. I think following weight watchers has trained me to eat loads of fruit and sugar and virtually no fat. Im still losing weight by keeping my calories to the reccomended amount on livestrongs daily plate program but if Im not getting the calories I need from fruit/bread then where should I be looking? I was under the impression that fats and protien in large amounts were bad for you.

Danowat I was 17.5st and am now down to 13.9st. I have tried eating less than this but if I do I virtually guarantee a sugar crash on the way home. Also Its funny what you say about pissing all the time, I do seem to go more than the average person. I have been to the doctors about this and they said 'drink orange juice' there was no talk of testing for anything. Maybe I should see if I can get some tests done privatley? Also I find that I am seriously tired most of the time but just attribute it to the job, recently I have been in bed by 2030 to get up at 0545 and have still felt shattered.

Cheers

Healthy balanced diet is the key. The guys here are correct; fruit does have a lot of sugar (albet natural) ; Ive always found bananas dont agree with me ! Anyway fat is still important as long as its good fat ie; Omega 3, not saturated etc... its also good (along with protein) for slowing down the absortion of sugar into the body (sugar rush that you basically dont want in one go!). Protein is a must for keeping your muscles build up; the body will happily burn muscle faster then fat, and your muscles need extra to re-build themselves. Protein and good fats are a must for active people...Id re-think your diet...oh and the guys are correct in that cerial bars generally have a lot of sugar...fine for when your doing a long ride but not great to snack on.
I would get checked by a proper doc ! drinking orange juice is fine if you need a pick up from you "low" but orange juice has tons of sugar in it and wont help your diet one bit...avoid ! You can get blood sugar test kits from Boots etc... for not much money...it would be worth measuring your bloody sugars regularly to find out if you have any probs.
Sounds like your doing to much...over training ! Id kick back for a bit; take the car and let your body recover. Your feel miles better for it. Take at least one day off a week as well.

danowat

welkman wrote:

I was under the impression that fats and protien in large amounts were bad for you.

Large amounts? yes, but its a common myth that all fats are bad, both fat and protien are VERY important in a balanced diet.

Danowat I was 17.5st and am now down to 13.9st. I have tried eating less than this but if I do I virtually guarantee a sugar crash on the way home. Also Its funny what you say about pissing all the time, I do seem to go more than the average person. I have been to the doctors about this and they said 'drink orange juice' there was no talk of testing for anything. Maybe I should see if I can get some tests done privatley? Also I find that I am seriously tired most of the time but just attribute it to the job, recently I have been in bed by 2030 to get up at 0545 and have still felt shattered.

Has the doctor given you a blood glucose test?, get one done, if your doctor won't do it, ask to see another doctor.

Do you think much water?, hows your thirst?

welkman

Thanks again for your responces:

I reckon I am thirsty a lot. Since using the livestrong thing I have averaged about 4 liters during the day and probally another 2-4 liters when I get home. I have not done a glucose test, I shall book into the doctors next week. My mate rides a similar distance everyday and really doesnt have to think about diet, he just eats a small lunch and some porridge for breakfast, he has never 'bonked'. It does seem to come on wordse if i attack the first part of my ride hard, but not having a HR monitor I have no idea just how hard I am working. I wonder if it could be due to going anerobic and using up all me glycogen?

I need to ride everyday as I do not have a car, but i do rest at the weekends.

redvee

You need to eat the banana 1/2 hour before the ride home as they release energy slowly. Something a bit more quickly absorbed into the body as you leave work or eating earlier for the ride home is one suggestion.

welkman

Thanks for the tip revee. I am already employing the banana method :shock: , and I have tried to eat more of my calories during the day. To give you an example I rode back on friday having had my usual two sandwiches, cereal bars, two bananas and three apples at around about 1400. I left work at 1545 and was planning to go to a mates house. I got ten miles into my ride back and just couldn't spin the pedals. I thought I would need to get off to push the bike on a flat section. When I got home I was cold and shaking, I needed to eat some high sugar food to stop this reaction and I was fine again after 20 mins. When I was very young (8yrs) I was hospitalised with this same condition and told if it happens again I need to eat a mars bar or drink some full fat coke. The thing is I know i am getting more than enough energy during the day to avoid a massive deficit.

dmch2

I find if i have sugar before riding i go quicker and then slow down after half an hour. I'm much better with slow release carbs like porridge or cereal or oats.
Can you try a bowl of cereal or flapjack an hour before you leave for home and have a bit less straight sugar from the fruit etc?

Tom Butcher

At least one of the big chemist chains will do you a blood sugar test while you wait. Forget what they call themselves now - it's not boots (though they may do so too). Just fast overnight and then don't eat anything in the morning. They just take a pin prick of blood and do you the test there and then. This may set your mind at rest re. diabetes rather than having to wait for a doctors appointment.

welkman

Re the tests for diabetes I think you can buy a home testing kit so I may order one and try that. Also Im thinking of experimenting with a bit of pasta or rice for lunch rather than the usual quick sandwich and fruit.

I reckon I burn a lot of calories in the working day being on my feet and teaching, my pulse is normally elevated due to the associated stress! Do you think I would qualify as 'very active' when working out calorie consumption ? I currently allow myself 1985 calories a day plus around 800 extra for my commute. I am aiming to lose around 2lb a week to reach a target weight around 13 st (am now 13st 11). Is this a realistic calorie target?

welkman

It has just occured to me that I have a load of glucose testing strips at work for when I make lactose free milk with my A Level students. I think I will have a quick pee on one tomorrow and see if there is any glucose in my urine.

turnerjohn

welkman wrote:

It has just occured to me that I have a load of glucose testing strips at work for when I make lactose free milk with my A Level students. I think I will have a quick pee on one tomorrow and see if there is any glucose in my urine.

be careful not to pee on your hand ! lol

danowat

welkman wrote:

It has just occured to me that I have a load of glucose testing strips at work for when I make lactose free milk with my A Level students. I think I will have a quick pee on one tomorrow and see if there is any glucose in my urine.

You really want to get a blood glucose test done, rather than a water one, and you shouldn't need to pay, this is what we have GP's and the NHS for, don't be fobbed off, tell them you have symptoms and you want to be tested.

welkman

Ok willl pop over the road to the doctors next week and feedback on my results! Thanks for the help so far. Oh and i will be careful not to wee on my hand, not a great look!

Tom Butcher

As I say if you want it done quicker just visit a Lloyds pharmacy - they do a bloodtest and give you the results while you wait.

danowat

Tom Butcher wrote:

As I say if you want it done quicker just visit a Lloyds pharmacy - they do a bloodtest and give you the results while you wait.

Yes, you can, the point is, you shouldn't have to

evans6854

Err... correct me if i'm wrong but the diagnosis of diabetes is associated with high blood sugars. The insulin cells in the pancreas are destroyed by the immune system thus rendering the removal of sugar from the blood impossible without injecting insulin. Therefore it is highly unlikely that your low blood sugars are caused by diabetes. If you were diabetic - type 1 - you;d know about it by now. It happens suddenly rather than over a prolonged period of time. I'm talking weeks. And you'd probably not have the energy to do your commute anyway.

So well... my point... the likely hood of being a type 1 or type 2 diabetic is very very slim from the sysmptoms you describe.

redvee

welkman wrote:

It has just occured to me that I have a load of glucose testing strips at work for when I make lactose free milk with my A Level students. I think I will have a quick pee on one tomorrow and see if there is any glucose in my urine.

A(n?) urine test does Ketones and these only show when the blood sugar level reaches a certain limit. Think of Ketones as an overflow tank, once the blood glucose reaches a certain level then it starts showing up in urine tests. Thats the story I was given by my doctor when I said I wanted urine tests rather blood tests.

evans6854

Ketones are a product of ketoacidocis (sp) essentially when the blood sugars are too high the body starts to break down fat rather than glucose resulting in ketones.

Though why we are discussing the merits of high blood sugars when the OP is having symptoms of a low blood sugar is a little beyond me. Pre diagnosed diabetics can't have a hypo. They have little if no insulin in their body to allow any sugar to be transfered from the blood into the muscles.

danowat

I think the term "sugar crash" by the OP is using could be misleading, it is entirely possible for undiagnosed diabetics to get very strong feelings of weakness and fatigue.

I can remember feeling completely blitzed at times, pre-diagnosis.

evans6854

The OP is commuting 20 miles a day and is fine in the morning and has experienced this 'sugar crash' over the past few months. I doubt very much he'd be able to do this if diabetes were the cause.

In addition he is following a weight watchers programme. Surely the most logically and least alarmist explaination is too little food. I know on my commutes I fly into work and am pretty exhausted on the way back. Standing up all day after commuting in can sometimes make you tired.

Tom Butcher

..

Tom Butcher

danowat wrote:

Tom Butcher wrote:

As I say if you want it done quicker just visit a Lloyds pharmacy - they do a bloodtest and give you the results while you wait.

Yes, you can, the point is, you shouldn't have to[/quote

You don't have to - it's just another choice. They didn't charge when I had it done - don't know if that has changed.

smithy1.0

Ok... it sounds like what you are experiencing here is not diabetes, it is hypoglycemia - aka low blood sugar. Hypoglycemics tend to fair better with more fat in their diet and less fast acting carbohydrates. There is plenty on the net about it if you search. Basically if you are perceiving a lot of up/downs and feel tired then there is something wrong.

I've had similar issues in the past. I've always been a bit of an up/down person as far as blood sugar and energy levels go, despite a good diet, and being fit enough to race at a high level. My problems with it got real bad last year after a hard season of racing and despite visiting the doctors for blood tests etc to no avail, I eventually found solution to my problems once I visited a nutritionist who diagnosed me with severe zinc deficiency, and also identified some foods I was allergic to which were making the problem even worse. White spots on fingernails are a tell-tale sign. After supplementing zinc and removing foods I was allergic too, my problems were solved - energy levels are great now and no severe up/downs!

Your issues may be caused by something completely different however, as it does sound like you are far worse than I was, but bear in mind that it could be a mineral deficiency or food allergy that is causing it.

danowat

Regardless, IMO, its still better to go and see a GP for a proper diagnosis, its not normal to be feeling like this.

I commute 36 miles a day, and probably eat less than the OP

I'd also call into question just how someone can be hypoglycemic on......

Weetabix, milk, cereal bar, apple (breakfast), apple and banana (mid morning), cereal bar two ham sandwiches, banana (lunch) and a banana just before I go on the ride back.

For a 10mile each way commute :roll:

smithy1.0

danowat wrote:

I'd also call into question just how someone can be hypoglycemic on......

Weetabix, milk, cereal bar, apple (breakfast), apple and banana (mid morning), cereal bar two ham sandwiches, banana (lunch) and a banana just before I go on the ride back.

For a 10mile each way commute :roll:

Well the fact that it's mostly carbs/fruit sugars and little protein and fat is exactly what makes hypoglycemia worse. Hypoglycemics just don't operate well on carbs. It's always hard to understand when you haven't experienced it for yourself but if you had bad hypoglycemia, your energy and perception of blood sugar would be up and down like a yo-yo on that diet.

Agreed that he should visit a doctor/GP though.

welkman

I am determined to get to the bottom of this so may well try a barage of tests this week. I am going to give the doctors a call in the morning and sort out a blood test. I really want to start doing some club rides out of colchester soon so I hope it can be sorted.

Its very interesting what you say about eating too many carbs. I would say my diet is >80% carbs, very low fat and a moderate amount of protien, this is how I have been 'trained' to eat by the weight watchers program over the last year. I think I may well need to have a real diet rethink.

Thanks for all the input.