Argument with LBS

Deputy Dawg

Are you just winging that you didn't get a price agreed before hand & then weren't happy with what they charged?

Attacking people for breaking down what's in a labour charge & then saying it should be included in the price (which it obviously was as otherwise the breakdown wouldn't be needed) makes no sense.

I also have no problems with a workshop having a minimum charge. They are in the business to make money after all.

BTW for what its worth, I used to be in the motor trade & my bonus was calculated on the difference between the book times & how quick I could do the job.

Anonymous

yeehaamcgee wrote:

But making money on a service is just as viable as making money by selling products, is it not?

I hope so as that's how I make my living!

But anyway, it all comes down to what they want to charge and what the customer is prepared to pay. Obviously many customers are prepared to cough up as they are not prepared to do it themselves. Much the same as getting your car serviced. Is it a rip off? That's down to you and how you value the service you are getting for the money. The charge based on the time it takes is just a way of accounting for jobs. It's really about the value of the service provided. If you think it's over priced you can vote with your feet, but you need enough people to do that to drive prices down.

MountainMonster

cooldad wrote:

MountainMonster wrote:

yeehaamcgee wrote:

MountainMonster wrote:

My whole point was that the end customer should nto be compensating for overheads, they are built into the price via markup and such, and we should not be compensating any more than we do to keep the business afloat. I won't be any extra because the mechanic or whoever is booking something in is being slow about doing their job. It can be done in a reasonable amount of time, and I won't pay any extra due to laziness.

Service charges are included in that "and such".

No they are not. They should come built into any prices which are paid by the customer via the purchase of a product, or use of a service. The end customer should only be paying for what he she receives, not anything more. It is unfair to be paying for the costs of paper and such when it is already built into their pricing strategies through their services price of physical products available for purchase through a retail outlet.

I normally do my own work, but recently had a BB and crankset fitted by my LBS, as some idiot had rounded out the crank bolts. (Not this idiot - SH bike).
In the end they had to hacksaw the old cranks off.
I bought the bits from CRC.
By your logic, should they have done the work for nothing?

No, in no way did I say they should do the work free. What i'm saying is that the laziness of the employee, or other costs not related to the services I have received should not be charged directly to me. I'm saying that the price of the paper they use, or the given time should be built into the service charges, not extended because of said laziness or lack of will to do something.

Chunkers1980

This thread makes me laugh - 4 pages.

FFS learn to fit stuff yourself and find the time to do so. Otherwise you will be paying £75 to have a product and fitted rather than the 10mins and £35 quid you should have paid.

supersonic

Different shops will charge different prices. Some will cut down labour rates if you know them, buy expensive gear, all sorts of reasons.

Many also publish incredibly high prices to put you off using them! That sounds daft, but small premises filled with 25 bikes all needing a inner tube changed doesn't always work well for that shop.

Also what appears to be an easy job may be a lot harder than you think. In an ideal world changing a brake cable will look like a 5 min job. We used to get customers coming in saying exactly that and expecting us to drop stuff to do it. But look at what may happen... you replace cable, tension it and you find the brake blocks rub the tyre. You adjust the brakes, and the wheel needs truing. But you can't true it beause the hub cones are loose. Of course a good shop will try and forsee as much of this as possible, but sometimes it is not apparent until the mechanic has it in his stand.

As in the other thread, communication is key for both parties, with estimates first and the shop ALWAYS to make contact if problems occur that will cost more.

The LBS is a valuable commodity to many, many people, and often you are paying an experienced mechanic for his time and expertise. Plus you will get some guarantee with the work. It can be a bloody hard job.

Iwingstein

What you need to remember is it's a business, and they make money by either charging for a product and/or service and in this case, both.

Our landlord at work has it spot on with his car garage; when people come in and ask him to do a small "five minute" job.

He says he could do "5 minute" jobs all day and not get paid a bean, so you want a 5 minute job doing you pay for it. It's not unreasonable - he has £5000/week overheads and they don't get paid by fairys:D

ATB

Simon

blablablacksheep

tbh it depends on the person.

In reality most LBS shops arnt doing much during 80% of the week, in reality they looking to sell bikes and gear at their higher than normal RRPs to make money.

their workshop isnt really their main source of income so they charge you useally silly costs as they dont really focus on workshop as income, they want to sell bikes ect.

so for most of the time LBS probally isnt doing much but checking stock doing some cleaning ect and trying to sell bikes.

So point is, a 5 min job or even a 20 min job probally isnt to much to ask for and i been into a rare few bike shops and guy said "il fit that for you pick it up later on today".

and no charge to fit the parts, just the parts charged.


what im saying is, most LBS dont do much most days as most of us know it selling the products not fixing or repairing things where you make money, and personally id rather be doing stuff during the day than not doing anything.

i know a LBS that made a living based on good service, ie free fittings on most parts within reson, people all flocked to the shop and he made good money as parts were where you make money

tsenior

SS said:

"Many also publish incredibly high prices to put you off using them! That sounds daft, but small premises filled with 25 bikes all needing a inner tube changed doesn't always work well for that shop."

small rubbish jobs (as i imagine fitting a mech is) dont pay, i will sometimes quote megabucks for fiddly little jobs that look like more hassle than they are worth, if they still want to go for it at least i'm making money

nickfrog

Just to clarify that the issue has been sorted a while ago to the satisfaction of both parties. I am happy to have paid £15 labour to fit a £45 SLX rear mech (even CRC charge £40 for a GS btw).

I don't have to justify the details of my busy diary to anyone BTW .

Thanks for the mostly useful input.

END OF THREAD

Petethebogmonster

blablablacksheep wrote:

never buy stuff from a LBS, sorry to say this but LBSs alwlays rip you off with goods as this their only way to make cash, they tend to not buy in bulk so tend to get bad deals.

In turn they sell you stuff way over the typical RRP you get from internet,

id say £20 is typical price to fit a small part sadly, but i wouldnt at all say £50 a hour is fair as that plain stupid,.

it best to buy parts online then ask them how much to fit before you agree.


I think LBS are going to suffer a lot in the "current times" as people exspect prices based on what they see online , end of the day i have some sadness for them going under but this the way of a competitive market if you cant survive or be competitive then you kind of deserve to go under.

A good bike shop with good people can have decent prices and service costs and still make good money.. lots of small companys out there doing well.

What planet do you live on? How many local shops do you think have the capacity to stock a wide range of components in sufficient quantities (requiring storage and payment) to qualify for bulk discounts from a supplier and at the same time pay premium rent and rates on their premises?

What do you mean by RRP from the internet? RRP is RRP, large online distributors don't usually store their stock in high street premises. Your online 'shop' aren't usually in a position to service or repair your bike either. Try posting your bike to CRC or the likes to get the bottom bracket faced to fit the new part they've supplied at a generously discounted price, ain't gonna happen...

Sorry for the rant. A good LBS should always keep you informed of the situation and carry out work to the highest possible standard. But to do this they do have to factor in their overheads (which includes specific customer orders from suppliers). Whilst they may be able to bulk the every day stuff, buying 20 SLX rear mechs to get a good price from their supplier isn't always an option.

There is good and bad service out there, just don't pay a premium for the bad!

thebikechain

tbh it depends on the person.

In reality most LBS shops arnt doing much during 80% of the week, in reality they looking to sell bikes and gear at their higher than normal RRPs to make money.

their workshop isnt really their main source of income so they charge you useally silly costs as they dont really focus on workshop as income, they want to sell bikes ect.

so for most of the time LBS probally isnt doing much but checking stock doing some cleaning ect and trying to sell bikes.

So point is, a 5 min job or even a 20 min job probally isnt to much to ask for and i been into a rare few bike shops and guy said "il fit that for you pick it up later on today".

and no charge to fit the parts, just the parts charged.


what im saying is, most LBS dont do much most days as most of us know it selling the products not fixing or repairing things where you make money, and personally id rather be doing stuff during the day than not doing anything.

i know a LBS that made a living based on good service, ie free fittings on most parts within reson, people all flocked to the shop and he made good money as parts were where you make money

Please tell me you aren't actually serious?

If you are then i reckon you should go open a bike shop. You are quite obviously a total business mastermind.

Anonymous

Just been on a shopping trip to my LBS - and paid the exact same price for things as CRC charge. Except, I got to try before I bought.

geoff93

I work at a LBS and we would charge around £14 for a full gear index, removing old, putting on new, adjusting, indexing, £20 seems fair to me.