Child benefit cuts

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Comments

  • alexj2233
    alexj2233 Posts: 381
    tenured workers had to ask permission to have kids of their landlord back int he day.

    In any case even if it is your god given right to have kids why is it your government given right to have some one pay you to have them - thats the nonsense of that arguement - its irrelevant to child benefits innit.

    Good Point. Well Made.
  • CraigXXL
    CraigXXL Posts: 1,852

    I a half decent accountant (quarter maybe) though not a tax accountant and while self employed man can work the system to maximise his income the average earner even a 40% earner does not have that many options available to them to avoid tax - delay it maybe but not avoid altogether.

    Sure there is the old off shore account and so on but those only avoid tax if you have gone through some pretty cmlicated tax avoidance measures to set them up in the first place.

    Maybe if there are any true tax accountants on here they could tell me otherwise but generally if you and your partner have a joint income of say 100k you are paying tax on most of it bar your pension subs.

    Depending on you trade, work location and how your expenses are repaid you can reclaim tax on many items of expenditure that enable you to do your job which are deducted from your salaried earnings through a self assessment return which would provide you with a tax refund. As already mentioned you have good and bad accountants just like any other profession. If you've got the knowledge then bypass the accountant and do it yourself but if you get it wrong then you have no comeback.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    Maybe if there are any true tax accountants on here they could tell me otherwise but generally if you and your partner have a joint income of say 100k you are paying tax on most of it bar your pension subs.
    I'm pretty sure if there were any tax accountants on here, who openly explained ways of avoiding tax, then they would not be tax accountants for much longer :lol:
  • d87heaven
    d87heaven Posts: 348
    Stevo 666 wrote:
    Sort of - I wanted to see if he had any idea about what he was spouting off about, other than what he'd read in the red tops. Probably not, as he's gone very quiet :)
    Im back :D didn't sift through all the replies.
    Being part of a small business I know a little bit about the massive amount of taxation documentation. Lets be real.........the more money you have the easier it is to employ a good accountant to get you off paying some tax. My ex girlfriends father had a very large sum stashed abroad which the tax man doesn't (yet) know about. Ironically his daughter worked for the inland revenue. I hear they were/are offering people the chance to cough up and agree a settlement otherwise its going to be a bit more of a serious going over. My point was that it seems its the man in the middle that gets shafted again.
    -Got nothing, don't want to work but want to pop out kiddies?.....no problem help yourself to some benefits.
    - Earning money and paying tax....contribute more and when you need help you can sod off. Self employed and no work...........HA don't waste our time
    - Raking in money.............who cares what you do. By the way you couldn't donate some money to the tory/lib/labour party?
    Bit simplified but its how I feel...well and truly fed up :D
    But I have digressed.
    Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals! Except the weasel
  • Daz555 wrote:
    What about education? Why should non-parents subsidise the education of other peoples children? Or for that matter pay for their healthcare?

    The answer is that well educated children are a requirement for a healthy society. We can go further - children are a requirement for a healthy society and there is some logic that all members of society should contribute to their welfare.

    I had no problem subsidising child benefit before I even considered being a parent and I have no problem with it now.

    As for the Govs proposals. Blimey George is utterly barking mad. Cutting it off for single wage familes on £44k but dishing it out to dual earners bringing home £87k. Utterly barking.

    I really hope you were actually drink when you posted most of that. Well educated children are a must, I agree, as well as healthy children free of disease. But for some reason i suspect the entire purpose of peoples arguments have flown right above your head, or you generally fail to realise what they mean. I pay taxes, I have no problem with it when it goes to pay healthcare, or for school because those are for the greater good.

    But are you actually arguing that you have no problem paying for someone elses irresponsible behavior in terms of their living conditions. For example, having a house or flat that is more expensive then they can afford, or buying things they have no business buying just because they have the money. I personally find it dispicable the amount of people who leech on the welfare systems in both the U.S. and the U.K. You may be alright with a large chunk of your taxes to pay some lazy lowlife scum to sit on their butt at home drinking beer and smoking weed, because they don't feel like working to feed themselves or their kid, but i'm not ok with it. But at the end of the day, you seem to not realise how people actually are that on housing benefit and child benefits for the most part. Not everyone is like that, but quite a few are.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    CraigXXL wrote:


    Depending on you trade, work location and how your expenses are repaid you can reclaim tax on many items of expenditure that enable you to do your job .

    can i claim for hair cuts, boot polish, razors, shaving foam/oil and washing powder?

    i have to wash my uniform, polish my boots and cut my hair according to my employer's specification at my own cost to avoid going to jail so they are pretty essential (unless i want to go to jail of course)

  • can i claim for hair cuts, boot polish, razors, shaving foam/oil and washing powder?

    i have to wash my uniform, polish my boots and cut my hair according to my employer's specification at my own cost to avoid going to jail so they are pretty essential (unless i want to go to jail of course)

    I think you can claim a lime and a string, but no boot polish.
  • alexj2233 wrote:

    Really? Can you conclusively prove that? We evolved from primates, which live in a society, albeit not as sophisticated as ours. The whole of mankind could not be possible without society and the co-operation of people working towards a common aim.

    You too are and idiot. A petrified hobbesian retard.
    The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
    momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    c ool, that might save me about 4 grand a yr!!!!
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 62,045
    d87heaven wrote:
    Im back :D didn't sift through all the replies.
    Being part of a small business I know a little bit about the massive amount of taxation documentation. Lets be real.........the more money you have the easier it is to employ a good accountant to get you off paying some tax. My ex girlfriends father had a very large sum stashed abroad which the tax man doesn't (yet) know about. Ironically his daughter worked for the inland revenue. I hear they were/are offering people the chance to cough up and agree a settlement otherwise its going to be a bit more of a serious going over. My point was that it seems its the man in the middle that gets shafted again.
    Fair play :)

    The bit about having a good accountant etc is true, but the banks and the 'rich elite' are in a different league altogether. The fact that they will have companies/business interests in multiple countries and are internationally mobile to a reasonable degree means that they can legitimately save huge amounts of tax. Keeps me in a job anyway :wink:

    BTW your ex's father will get more than a slap on the wrist if he doesn't 'fess up in time and gets caught. We are talking possible criminal prosecution and big fines which are multiples of what he's not paid - in case he doesn't already know...
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]

  • You too are and idiot. A petrified hobbesian retard.


    No I believe you are the dousche canoe floating in a river of gay here. Primates, which we have evolved from, have always been social animals. in order to be social, that requires a minimum of some form of hierarchical structure which in and of itself, is a society. For millions of years, monkeys have lived in societies, and congratulations, we evolved from them. The first humans, albeit primitive forms, also lived in societies.

    So it does appear to me as if you are the uneducated tosser in this instance.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    my balls are very social, they want to meet your chin.
  • my balls are very social, they want to meet your chin.

    I'll social your balls in a minute.

    Hmm, I failed. Best I could do. Sorry daddy, I won't tell mommy about it.
  • Daz555
    Daz555 Posts: 3,976
    edited October 2010
    I personally find it dispicable the amount of people who leech on the welfare systems in both the U.S. and the U.K. You may be alright with a large chunk of your taxes to pay some lazy lowlife scum to sit on their butt at home drinking beer and smoking weed, because they don't feel like working to feed themselves or their kid, but i'm not ok with it. But at the end of the day, you seem to not realise how people actually are that on housing benefit and child benefits for the most part. Not everyone is like that, but quite a few are.
    I agree with you about dole scroungers and work shy lowlifes. However, I was talking about child benefit. Something which is very important to many hardworking tax paying families.

    2 kids results in about £1700 in child benefit. For a family earning £44,000, losing this is equivalent to taking a paycut of over £3,000. Plenty of people on here would find themselves in serious trouble if they lost that sort of money, kids or no kids.
    I have no problem with it when it goes to pay healthcare, or for school because those are for the greater good.
    Children are for the greater good. You just try running a society without them and see how long you last. :wink:
    You only need two tools: WD40 and Duck Tape.
    If it doesn't move and should, use the WD40.
    If it shouldn't move and does, use the tape.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    children need beating twice a day whether they have dne anything wrong or not, they dont need my moneys and from now on i refuse to give them any of my money.


  • No I believe you are the dousche canoe floating in a river of gay here. Primates, which we have evolved from, have always been social animals. in order to be social, that requires a minimum of some form of hierarchical structure which in and of itself, is a society. For millions of years, monkeys have lived in societies, and congratulations, we evolved from them. The first humans, albeit primitive forms, also lived in societies.

    So it does appear to me as if you are the uneducated tosser in this instance.

    You can't have a society without language. Language predates us all. Predates, as logic dictates, even the linguistic abstract of society. Get an A level or two, get to university, come to one of my lectures and we'll just how far your argument will get you a degree. Again I put the argument that hobbesian tossers, like yourself are confusing social living, that is cooperative groupos with the notion of society. Co-operation can behaviourally be proven to be an actualite, society, is an abstract, the most obvious absentee from Plato's republic. I look forward to seeing you in my class.
    The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
    momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.
  • my balls are very social, they want to meet your chin.
    :D:D:D


    I'm getting a t shirt with this on.
    The dissenter is every human being at those moments of his life when he resigns
    momentarily from the herd and thinks for himself.
  • Anonymous
    Anonymous Posts: 79,665
    the most obvious absentee from Plato's republic is my balls on socrates' chin
  • Kiblams
    Kiblams Posts: 2,423
    I put it to you that no one person earning £44k+ a year will struggle to support a child unless they are spending every other penny they earn on silly luxuries :shock:
  • alexj2233
    alexj2233 Posts: 381

    You can't have a society without language. Language predates us all. Predates, as logic dictates, even the linguistic abstract of society. Get an A level or two, get to university, come to one of my lectures and we'll just how far your argument will get you a degree. Again I put the argument that hobbesian tossers, like yourself are confusing social living, that is cooperative groupos with the notion of society. Co-operation can behaviourally be proven to be an actualite, society, is an abstract, the most obvious absentee from Plato's republic. I look forward to seeing you in my class.

    For someone who seems to think they are incredibly intelligent why do you feel the need to enforce your argument with petty insults.

    Language, in your belief, pre-dates society. There is no empirical evidence that this is actually true. Maybe communication pre-dates society but this does not neccersarily translate into language.
  • I put it to you that no one person earning £44k+ a year will struggle to support a child unless they are spending every other penny they earn on silly luxuries

    44K year = 2450 a month after £243 nursary vouches deducted before tax (another family friendly perk under threat).

    Mortgage = £1150 (I am on 1.2% tracker currently, this will increase loads when interest rates raise)
    Council tax = £175
    More nursary = £150
    Petrol (I live 40 miles from work so £80 miles a day) = £280
    Electicity / Gas £144
    Water rates = £54
    House ensurance £40
    Life insureance (you want this when you have a mortgage and kids) £62
    Car insurance £30

    Leaves around £90 a week a buy food, clothes, nappies, save a few quid for car tax etc

    My wife works 3 days a week which brings in another £600 per month, saved for a family holiday (£20 Sun job this year) pays for her car + petrol, kids birthdays and xmas and try a save a little for a rainy day (in truth with nursary and petrol it is barely worth her working but we try to do the right thing)

    So I'm not complaining, I chose to move out of the city, chose to live in the country, chose to to try and bring up my kids in the nicest environment I can but there aint no silly luxuries there and losing £134 a month will be a blow, make no mistake about it
  • Briggo
    Briggo Posts: 3,537
    Blah blah blah, look at me I think I'm something special

    Have a wank for christ sakes.
  • Chaz.Harding
    Chaz.Harding Posts: 3,144
    Briggo wrote:
    Have a wank for christ sakes.
    He probably will when he reaches puberty... :roll:
    Boo-yah mofo
    Sick to the power of rad
    Fix it 'till it's broke
  • CraigXXL
    CraigXXL Posts: 1,852
    edited October 2010
    Lovepasty, are you telling us that you took out a £250k mortgage on £44k salary and want to blame the government for things being tight. I feel for you but you need to shoulder some of that blame too.
  • Briggo
    Briggo Posts: 3,537
    CraigXXL wrote:
    Are you telling us that you took out a £250k mortgage on £44k salary and want to blame the government for things being tight. I feel for you but you need to shoulder some of that blame too.

    Dependant on the area he lives, that may be the normal price for a house large enough for his family.
  • CraigXXL
    CraigXXL Posts: 1,852
    Still reckless borrowing, should have moved somewhere he could afford to live.
  • Briggo
    Briggo Posts: 3,537
    CraigXXL wrote:
    Still reckless borrowing regardless, should have moved somewhere he could afford to live.

    Then the salary might not be as good, salary to average houseprices usually scale hand in hand, although not always ;)
  • CraigXXL
    CraigXXL Posts: 1,852
    He lives 40 miles from his job, I know he moved for a better standard for the kids but clearly when the mortgage repayments are such a high percentage of the take home it was beyond his finances.
  • Mortgage isnt £250,000, house I bought in the country was the same price as I sold my 2up 2down tiny victorian house for in the crap part of the city, so the only extra cost is the petrol.

    Sacrifices have to be made, my choice...I can afford it and accept the need to cut benefits, my point was that with a £44k salary I dont spend loads of disposable income on silly luxuries as had been aluded to in a previous post

    (I bought a new bike today, maybe this is a silly luxury but for the £400 needed to buy my entry level carrera was raised through e-baying many luxury top of the range fishing items I bought before I had kids and recieved child benefit....those were the days!)

  • You can't have a society without language. Language predates us all. Predates, as logic dictates, even the linguistic abstract of society. Get an A level or two, get to university, come to one of my lectures and we'll just how far your argument will get you a degree. Again I put the argument that hobbesian tossers, like yourself are confusing social living, that is cooperative groupos with the notion of society. Co-operation can behaviourally be proven to be an actualite, society, is an abstract, the most obvious absentee from Plato's republic. I look forward to seeing you in my class.

    Hmmm while you're argument of get an A-Level or 2, go to university and join your lectures does entice me, I fill I may have already surpassed your expectations, now having finished a bachelors degree in Business and working on a Masters in Diplomatic Relations. But then again these are REAL topics to be learning, rather than philosophy or whatever "useful" thing you are teaching.

    As far as your other points, language doesn't predate us, you fail to account for the simple notion of body language, and using that as a means of communication before the first spoken and written languages came about. Based off of proper imperical knowledge, not some poncy philosophy BS, the notion of society was around since the beginning, it was just not very advanced or developed, if at all.

    If intersubjectivity has taught us anything in the field of science, it abolsutely destroys your philosophical outlook on things, and welcome to the 21st century were imperical knowledge ( things we can experience or observe, such as yourself being a TWOT) is the only true knowledge, not some BS doxa of yours.

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