USADA about to rip US domestic cycling a new one
Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
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This is old, but cracks me up:
"The evidence included a photo of Leogrande holding EPO vials and a note that read: “Joe, 2 boxes G. 100 iu; 7 boxes E. 60,000; $500. I owed you! Thanks, Kayle.”
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Lucky USA cycling, they get to tear it down and rebuild it better (maybe). Fingers crossed the same happens over here.0
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It seems there a quite of lot of guys using "old" methods, think Belgium in the 1980s, with cortisone and steroid abuse. Good that they get caught.0
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iainf72 wrote:
This blows a rather large hole through puppet Pat's theory that doping is more-or-less restricted to riders from the 'Mafia European nations', with any 'Anglo Saxon' who is caught doping being a victim who was dragged into doping by those untrustworthy types who don't speak English as a first language...One veteran of the domestic peloton, who requested anonymity, said he knew of the impending sanctions. While the North American peloton is generally seen as cleaner that the European peloton, the veteran said “the U.S. scene has not been remotely clean for a while now.”
“People see Europe as where the hard-core doping is happening, but at least in Europe they are testing at races, out of competition; they have the biological passport, and they target riders,” he said. “Here in the U.S. it’s sort of the Wild West. The testing hasn’t evolved much past 10 years ago. Once every blue moon USADA shows up and administers a pee test. That’s about it..."
Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...0 -
Rather blows a hole in the theory that the word of a confessed doper can't possibly be credible or truthful either
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BikingBernie wrote:iainf72 wrote:One veteran of the domestic peloton, who requested anonymity, said he knew of the impending sanctions. While the North American peloton is generally seen as cleaner that the European peloton, the veteran said “the U.S. scene has not been remotely clean for a while now.”
“People see Europe as where the hard-core doping is happening, but at least in Europe they are testing at races, out of competition; they have the biological passport, and they target riders,” he said. “Here in the U.S. it’s sort of the Wild West. The testing hasn’t evolved much past 10 years ago. Once every blue moon USADA shows up and administers a pee test. That’s about it..."
Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...
YOU "recall ONE poster on here.....". And this is what you base all your theorys on - one poster? C'mon BB get real. Now you're claiming that YOU know "the true level of doping in US bike racing"??? Why do I have my doubts? I should take your word for it? Yes?
You are all seeing and all knowing? Right? If you know it all could you give me next weeks WINNING lotto numbers? I'd really be grateful and splt the winnings with you.0 -
micron wrote:Rather blows a hole in the theory that the word of a confessed doper can't possibly be credible or truthful either
What about someone who hasn't confessed to doping? Can they possibly be "credible
or truthful" according to you? Or do you have to confess to something to be considered
a "credible or truthful" person?0 -
Anglo Saxon Nations?
Mafia European Countries?
Rasmussen Denmark, Vino, Kazakhstan, Jan, Germany, Bjarne, Norway,
Those are definitely misnomers.
Big sport nowadays without much money is Ultra Running, probably a largely clean sport, per book "Born to Run" landmark classic by MacDougall (or McDougal), Chris.
But surely, most Track and Field and Marathoners, Olympic Competitions, are not widely trusted no matter where they are from.
In fact, with exceptions, I think US Runners in the past are thought to have been a 'dirty' bunch of athletes, drug wise, Marion Jones, Carl Lewis, so really, Bernard seems to be off the point a ways.
We all know going back to the LA Olympics, '84, that is when the US Cyclists reportedly blood doped, not illegal then but of course, unethical.0 -
"Sources: anti-doping authorities preparing cases against up to two-dozen domestic racers."
Hey everyone! They've just got to sound like they "mean business!"
Someone said some cyclist from the USA use to come to this forum or someething, I go to that VN story, there is Joe Papp, he's an active poster in one of the internet forums, either roadbikereview or cycling, one of the main big forums and he'd sign using his own name.0 -
dennisn wrote:micron wrote:Rather blows a hole in the theory that the word of a confessed doper can't possibly be credible or truthful either
What about someone who hasn't confessed to doping? Can they possibly be "credible
or truthful" according to you? Or do you have to confess to something to be considered
a "credible or truthful" person?
I wonder lets speculate here............ what about someone who lets just say goes to great lenghts to deny their doping even duping people to contribute to an innocent fund then after the swindle they suddenly fess up..............now if that ever happened would this person be a credible witness ?Gasping - but somehow still alive !0 -
BikingBernie wrote:iainf72 wrote:
This blows a rather large hole through puppet Pat's theory that doping is more-or-less restricted to riders from the 'Mafia European nations', with any 'Anglo Saxon' who is caught doping being a victim who was dragged into doping by those untrustworthy types who don't speak English as a first language...One veteran of the domestic peloton, who requested anonymity, said he knew of the impending sanctions. While the North American peloton is generally seen as cleaner that the European peloton, the veteran said “the U.S. scene has not been remotely clean for a while now.”
“People see Europe as where the hard-core doping is happening, but at least in Europe they are testing at races, out of competition; they have the biological passport, and they target riders,” he said. “Here in the U.S. it’s sort of the Wild West. The testing hasn’t evolved much past 10 years ago. Once every blue moon USADA shows up and administers a pee test. That’s about it..."
Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...
Nah, "Bernie". Riders of all nations dope. We could maybe say though, that the US federation is taking action when presented with evidence, whereas the "mafia European nations" just attempt to sweep it all under the carpet when presented with same. *cough* Puerto *cough*Le Blaireau (1)0 -
As I was saying, McQuaid was talking out of his arse (again) when he tried to argue that doping was not a major problem for the 'Anglo Saxon' nations.DaveyL wrote:Nah, "Bernie". Riders of all nations dope.0 -
BikingBernie wrote:
As I was saying, McQuaid was talking out of his arse (again) when he tried to argue that doping was not a major problem for the 'Anglo Saxon' nations.DaveyL wrote:Nah, "Bernie". Riders of all nations dope.
This news just in folks - McQuaid talks out of his arse...Le Blaireau (1)0 -
dennisn wrote:BikingBernie wrote:Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...
YOU "recall ONE poster on here.....". And this is what you base all your theorys on - one poster? C'mon BB get real. Now you're claiming that YOU know "the true level of doping in US bike racing"??? Why do I have my doubts? I should take your word for it? Yes?
You are all seeing and all knowing? Right? If you know it all could you give me next weeks WINNING lotto numbers? I'd really be grateful and splt the winnings with you.
Er, Dennis, wasn't the one poster, in fact, you? :?
I'm sure that you posted about amateur crit riders riding dangerously and getting into fights, shortly after an incident involving Rock Racing's Bahati, after BB posted about American attitudes to racing and winning.0 -
Moray Gub wrote:I wonder lets speculate here............ what about someone who lets just say goes to great lenghts to deny their doping even duping people to contribute to an innocent fund then after the swindle they suddenly fess up..............now if that ever happened would this person be a credible witness ?
When I began to read this, I thought: Wtf? Moray has done a complete "U" turn...........right up until his final 3 words. "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.0 -
while it's good that they are going after dopers it seems the usual case of bust a few local and lower down people and let the big people do what they like.0
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johnfinch wrote:dennisn wrote:BikingBernie wrote:Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...
YOU "recall ONE poster on here.....". And this is what you base all your theorys on - one poster? C'mon BB get real. Now you're claiming that YOU know "the true level of doping in US bike racing"??? Why do I have my doubts? I should take your word for it? Yes?
You are all seeing and all knowing? Right? If you know it all could you give me next weeks WINNING lotto numbers? I'd really be grateful and splt the winnings with you.
Er, Dennis, wasn't the one poster, in fact, you? :?
I'm sure that you posted about amateur crit riders riding dangerously and getting into fights, shortly after an incident involving Rock Racing's Bahati, after BB posted about American attitudes to racing and winning.
Yes, it was me and I did talk about a couple of incidents of fighting and dangerous riding, but I don't recall "...packed with loonies high on....." or "..the true level of doping...". I'm pretty sure BB is either trolling(quite possibly) or really does "....know the true level..."(I have my doubts) or actually believes that ONE person saying something on a cycling forum makes it true(that's a tough one to swallow also).0 -
For the Beijing Olympics, both of the top women's riders of Spain and Italy got caught through the International controls, one being the World Champion at the time. I think that says a lot.
2 dozen riders really doesn't seem like many at all actually.0 -
To be fair, whilst Dennis did go into some detail about the aggressive nature of American bike racers, even at the lowest levels, I have probably conflated what Dennis said with some comments I read on the cyclingnews.com 'clinic' forum which did make specific references to the part doping plays in such behaviour.johnfinch wrote:
Er, Dennis, wasn't the one poster, in fact, you? :?BikingBernie wrote:Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...
I'm sure that you posted about amateur crit riders riding dangerously and getting into fights, shortly after an incident involving Rock Racing's Bahati, after BB posted about American attitudes to racing and winning.0 -
BikingBernie wrote:
To be fair, whilst Dennis did go into some detail about the aggressive nature of American bike racers, even at the lowest levels, I have probably conflated what Dennis said with some comments I read on the cyclingnews.com 'clinic' forum which did make specific references to the part doping plays in such behaviour.johnfinch wrote:
Er, Dennis, wasn't the one poster, in fact, you? :?BikingBernie wrote:Then again, the true level of doping in US bike racing has hardly been a secret. For example, I recall one poster on here with first-hand experience of racing in the US who noted that even the average American amateur crit is packed with loonies high on everything from amphetamines to steroids who in their desire to win will happily put you in to the barriers...
I'm sure that you posted about amateur crit riders riding dangerously and getting into fights, shortly after an incident involving Rock Racing's Bahati, after BB posted about American attitudes to racing and winning.
I was talking about a few experiences I had with racers in our local club. I sort of disagree that this(fighting, reckless riding, etc.) is limited to American riders. It would be a guess but I would have to assume that bike racers of all nationalities get into these "altercations", if you will. I don't see people from "over there" being any different than people "over here".0 -
I think anyone generalising about the 'quality' of US crit-racing perhaps hasn't experienced Kermis racing in Belgium - Pot Belge wasn't developed for club runs!Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..0
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Moray Gub wrote:
I wonder lets speculate here............ what about someone who lets just say goes to great lenghts to deny their doping even duping people to contribute to an innocent fund then after the swindle they suddenly fess up..............now if that ever happened would this person be a credible witness ?
Yes.Scottish and British...and a bit French0 -
dulldave wrote:Moray Gub wrote:
I wonder lets speculate here............ what about someone who lets just say goes to great lenghts to deny their doping even duping people to contribute to an innocent fund then after the swindle they suddenly fess up..............now if that ever happened would this person be a credible witness ?
Yes.
I'm going to cast my vote for "maybe". Nothing is set in stone. Least of all a persons honesty or dishonesty.0 -
dennisn wrote:dulldave wrote:Moray Gub wrote:
I wonder lets speculate here............ what about someone who lets just say goes to great lenghts to deny their doping even duping people to contribute to an innocent fund then after the swindle they suddenly fess up..............now if that ever happened would this person be a credible witness ?
Yes.
I'm going to cast my vote for "maybe". Nothing is set in stone. Least of all a persons honesty or dishonesty.
Particlularly when they have used that dishonesty to swindle people out of cash.Gasping - but somehow still alive !0 -
Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.0
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iainf72 wrote:
But would any of the big boys have used Papp I wonder?___________________
Strava is not Zen.0 -
I can't work out what to make of Papp, he tries to be open about things but wherever there's money to be made by doping, up he pops, again and again.0
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he comes across well but maybe that is is writing \ journo background he has taken up that helps there.
He says he is anti doping but then did he reveal who his clients were from his website ? So far he hasn't0
