Intro & Explanation

Clarion

Hi.

Mods please move if there's a more appropriate place for this.

Some of you may have come across a member called Clarion before. He was vile, obnoxious and puerile.

And more importantly, he's gone. And won't be back.

OK, so who am I then? Well, I used to be known as OGME, but I've been allowed to change my username to Clarion. This is how I'm known on various other fora and, to a large number of people, IRL too. Many of you may know me from elsewhere, though some of you with very good memories will be able to remember OGME from C+ days, since when I've had trouble accessing the forum till recently.

I'm introducing myself in Commuting because the vast majority of my 7500km last year were to & from work. I'm a Yorkshireman living in London & commute partly on the new & disastrous CS7. I'm not very fast, but getting faster. I have five and a half bikes - all 531, and I share some tandems with my partner, Butterfly, and my sons, who ride to a greater or lesser extent.

lost_in_thought

Hello again. I did wonder what other clarion was doing on here so much!

What's a CS7, and why is it disastrous?

Clarion

CS7 is the Cycling Superhighway.

It's not super

It's not a highway

and it's not that good for cycling.

lost_in_thought

Why the 7?

Clarion

Route 7 is, bizarrely, one of the first two to be opened, this summer, from Merton, via Tooting, where I join it, to Elephant & Castle, where I turn off, and on to the City. So far, it's a lot of ill-thought out blue paint.

lost_in_thought

Ahhhhh, I see!

It's a shame there's not some way commuters could group together and tell Boris to stop wasting our money painting things blue, really.

Is it just blue cycle lanes? I haven't seen any of it.

Clarion

The LCC is probably the best way we have of getting our voice heard, but there's definite frustration from those quarters that they are being ignored, despite engaging in planning exercises and meetings aplenty.

Here's a youtube linky to part of CS7. Gaz is pretty active on fora - he may be on here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQDNIalvoqQ

Here's a more recent one I hadn't seen before

http://www.youtube.com/user/gaz545#p/u/3/vkJlLJIjFoU

lost_in_thought

Yep, gaz is on here.

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

Clarion

I have no idea. Like Gaz, I find myself riding outside the blue lanes for safety in the primary position. I dread being told to 'get in the cycle lane' :roll:

Useless load of crap making my commute more dangerous.

I didn't vote for Boris.

Specialized Needs

lost_in_thought wrote:

Yep, gaz is on here.

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

Nobody else has noticed. [/Emperor's new clothes]

lost_in_thought

Specialized Needs wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

Yep, gaz is on here.

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

Nobody else has noticed. [/Emperor's new clothes]

I am disappointed, I have to say. I was expecting more! Wasn't there some plan of making the A40 part of it? Or did I make that up?

Clarion

I've no idea what's going on over that way. Too depressed with number seven

There were all sorts of fancy promises, but they seem to have been lost at the bottom of a bucket of paint.

stuaff

Nice to see you over here under your usual forum name, glad you got rid of the troublemaker.

Clarion

Thanks for the welcome.

_Brun_

Clarion wrote:

...I'm a Yorkshireman living in London...

Pity, it was going quite well until you let that slip. Good luck getting any sort of respect round here now.

gaz545

lost_in_thought wrote:

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

They are going to be:

Direct and continuous with easy to follow, clearly marked routes.

Improved road surfaces so you can pedal more comfortably.

Easy to find - Will have a clear and unique identity.

Blue surfaces will also increase driver awareness.

Safe - Will be at least 1.5m wide and provide continuous cycle lanes at junctions, advanced stop boxes, and signals.

Although at present it's less that promising. My videos have been published by the CTC and LCC. And also appeared on many bike related blogs, Boris Johnson has replied to the criticism they are getting.

And welcome Clarion

prj45

lost_in_thought wrote:

I am disappointed, I have to say. I was expecting more! Wasn't there some plan of making the A40 part of it? Or did I make that up?

Yup, but I do know many that don't think this is a good idea as a whole, and I must say I agree, riding alongside that road you'd need ear defenders.

_Brun_

gaz545 wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

They are going to be:

Direct and continuous with easy to follow, clearly marked routes.

Improved road surfaces so you can pedal more comfortably.

Easy to find - Will have a clear and unique identity.

Blue surfaces will also increase driver awareness.

Safe - Will be at least 1.5m wide and provide continuous cycle lanes at junctions, advanced stop boxes, and signals.

Although at present it's less that promising. My videos have been published by the CTC and LCC. And also appeared on many bike related blogs, Boris Johnson has replied to the criticism they are getting.

Let me get this straight: Your very own videos show how useless these cycle lanes are, yet you're still buying into the promises which clearly haven't been delivered?

Wish I was less cynical.

Cafewanda

Brun you are too harsh. We have to be patient and wait a little longer. I'm sure Boris will deliver on CS7 and the section of blue paint that now goes through the previously allowed parking bays in Balham will be widened to accommodate cyclists, I'm sure :roll:

EKE_38BPM

I was driving today and my travels took me to Tooting so I got to see the "Cycling Superhighway" in all of its mediocrity for myself.
What a waste of time, effort, money and blue paint. Is it really supposed to make cycling safer for us and encourage new cyclists that it is safer and easier to ride on the road than they feared it would be? Bus stops, parking bays, pinch points etc in a dedicated cycle lane? What a crock!

Most of the roads in London are just too small for dedicated Cycling Superhighways as touted, so better driver (and, dare I say it, cyclist) training, leading to better and safer integration are the key.
Unless London is destroyed by bombs or fire, we are stuck with narrow roads that are not suited to 21st century traffic, so all road users need to learn how to share this inadequate road network safely. Intermittent stretches of blue paint just ain't gonna be enough.

My favoured method for dedicated cycle lanes would be massive and very expensive, but it would be great (imho). "What is it?" I hear you ask, cycles paths next to overground railway lines and canal/river towpaths (coz they're flatish, pretty direct and away from traffic). Even with the paths I dream of, drivers of tin boxes still need to learn to give us the space we need and deserve.
Never going to happen, but I can dream.

Rant over.

lost_in_thought

gaz545 wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

They are going to be:

Direct and continuous with easy to follow, clearly marked routes.

Improved road surfaces so you can pedal more comfortably.

Easy to find - Will have a clear and unique identity.

Blue surfaces will also increase driver awareness.

Safe - Will be at least 1.5m wide and provide continuous cycle lanes at junctions, advanced stop boxes, and signals.

Although at present it's less that promising. My videos have been published by the CTC and LCC. And also appeared on many bike related blogs, Boris Johnson has replied to the criticism they are getting.

And welcome Clarion

Do you have linky links to Boris's responses? I have to say, your video examples don't fill me with hope for the future of blue lane cycling in London...

rjsterry

lost_in_thought wrote:

Ahhhhh, I see!

It's a shame there's not some way commuters could group together and tell Boris to stop wasting our money painting things blue, really.

Is it just blue cycle lanes? I haven't seen any of it.

It's not even as good as a blue cycle lane. Just have a look on Youtube for various bits of helmetcam footage..

kurako

Does the blue paint even count as a cycle lane? I thought cycle lanes had to be bounded by white markings (dashed for advisory, solid for compulsory). This really is just a splash of blue paint.

CometGirl

There is a single splash of blue paint near me.

I'm not sure whether it's the beginnings of a cycling superhighway or Na'vi roadkill.

rjsterry

gaz545 wrote:

lost_in_thought wrote:

They really are just blue cycle lanes. What's the point?

They are going to be:

Direct and continuous with easy to follow, clearly marked routes.

Improved road surfaces so you can pedal more comfortably.

Easy to find - Will have a clear and unique identity.

Blue surfaces will also increase driver awareness.

Safe - Will be at least 1.5m wide and provide continuous cycle lanes at junctions, advanced stop boxes, and signals.

Although at present it's less that promising. My videos have been published by the CTC and LCC. And also appeared on many bike related blogs, Boris Johnson has replied to the criticism they are getting.

And welcome Clarion

So that's a sort of (direct, but not continuous on account of the parking bays and bus stops)/yes/yes (but only by virtue of their blueness)/doubtful/no they are not a minimum of 1.5m wide. 2 1/2 out of 5 isn't bad. Sorry Clarion we seem to have turned your intro into a rant about the CSHs. Morning, by the way.

Clarion

No problem. The crap that went on when a loony was impersonating me (very badly) is pretty boring, so rant away.

gaz545

lost_in_thought wrote:

Do you have linky links to Boris's responses? I have to say, your video examples don't fill me with hope for the future of blue lane cycling in London...

http://www.lcc.org.uk/index.asp?PageID=1819

_Brun_ wrote:

Let me get this straight: Your very own videos show how useless these cycle lanes are, yet you're still buying into the promises which clearly haven't been delivered?

Wish I was less cynical.

I'm not buying into anything at present. I stand where i stand, and that is i can't see these being as succesful for cyclists as we all hope. I've done what i can to show how bad they currently are and i got some good publicity doing it. But until it's finished Boris will just keep coming back that it's got 40 something days to go.

Clarion

Yup. There may be some wonderful thing about to happen, that will transform these into usable facilities.

But I doubt it.

Let's wait & see.

Citizen Smith

Welcome back to these parts Clarion.

CometGirl wrote:

There is a single splash of blue paint near me.

I'm not sure whether it's the beginnings of a cycling superhighway or Na'vi roadkill.

As it happens, I join the CS7 at Tooting Broadway and the jury is definitely still out on this one. I guess we should wait to see the finished article.

I think someone else noted that they have changed tact midway thru the process, replacing blue paint for the original blue tarmac or the like.

I was working from home yesterday but did anyone experience it in the rain? Any issues?

DonDaddyD

I'm sorry but I commute by bicycle from Wimbledon to Chacery Lane everyday and as such ride through Tooting High street along the blue bicycle lane and it has made things worse!

Posted during one of my more constructive days

Superhighways attempt to make 4 lanes mostly on roads where there were previously two. It does this however, without increasing the size of road so effectively it just creates less space. The irony is that the number of road users is increasing so this just compounds the problem. It could be argued that currently Superhighways are a great example of an over-subscribed London's inabilty to handle and effectively manage being over-subscribed.

Where the Highways become useful is if you are a unsure cyclist or out for a pootle. The wide lane causes you not to rid in the gutter and feel secure riding within a bright blue lane.

Since the Highways have emerged I've noticed that groups form on it. Reason being overtaking is a nightmare. Cyclist can be as far as 3quarters of the way into a single lane you either go with the cars to overtake, sit behind the person infront or use the small gap between crashing into the cyclist on the left or vehicle on the right to overtake. If you make it through, like I did, you'll spend your time looking back to make sure the person you pass hasn't wobbled into a crash as passing them so closely is likely to startle them.

The third (of four) lanes on a two lane road also means there is many many many times vehicles have to drive into the Highway as they drive up the road.

Tooting bec - broadway: forget the lane ride mainly in the centre of the road unless it's safe to take the cycling primary - which isn't often.

I'll even go one step further, yesterday there were several cars stopped along the 'super-highway' and because there is less space for cars on either side this meant they gave less room to move around the parked cars.

The best cycle lanes in London are bus lanes. With a proposed reduced number of buses going to be in circulation (public spending savings), bus lanes could become even safer and ultimately even better. That's spending/saving at its best.

rjsterry

I'm going to try a route variation this evening that cuts out Upper Tooting Road - yes, it's got that bad. If I turn left at Tooting Bec Tube, I think I can then swing right alongside the common and end up halfway along Tooting Broadway. I'll let you know if it's any improvement.