Did Wiggins win the 2009 TDF?

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  • 16simon
    16simon Posts: 154
    nic_77 wrote:
    The top ten from TDF 09, complete with their dodgy associations / rumours / links etc:

    [snip]
    Andy Schleck (Riis / Frank Schleck?)
    [snip]

    Following your fraternal guilt logic, Mark Cavendish is involved in cocaine dealing. Perhaps you should call the police/UCI and notify them of your suspicions :D
  • nic_77
    nic_77 Posts: 929
    16simon wrote:
    Following your fraternal guilt logic
    :lol:
    It should certainly be good enough to condemn the Hamilton twins once-and-for-all
    :lol:
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  • Determination
    Determination Posts: 45
    I really think Bradley is genuine for a few reasons.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3MM-U-MBxo

    Watch from 1.40 on please.

    He has lost a lot of weight to improve his climbing abilities.

    http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/photos/2 ... 455761.jpg

    When you compare this to Lance Armstrong who is nearing 40 years old, and retired for 3 years, and most more importantly, carrying a huge amount of upper muscle weight.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDawlrIeaVM

    I think in 1999, when lance arrived at the tour, he mentioned his sudden increase in his climbing abilities was down to having lost nearly all of his muscle mass on his upper body from his triathalon days through his treatment. So how can he explain being able to climb with the best now, since he is so much older and heavier?

    I have a lot of respect for Lance becouse of his work through Livestrong but I hate being taken for an idiot also.
    What is your opinions?
    “To understand me, you have to meet me and be around me. And then only if I'm in a good mood - don't meet me in a bad mood.”
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    Determination wrote:

    I have a lot of respect for Lance becouse of his work through Livestrong but I hate being taken for an idiot also.
    What is your opinions?

    Are you serious? You're asking for opinions on LA, just read 2 out of every 3 posts on the entire forum..........
  • Determination
    Determination Posts: 45
    dougzz wrote:
    Determination wrote:

    I have a lot of respect for Lance becouse of his work through Livestrong but I hate being taken for an idiot also.
    What is your opinions?

    Are you serious? You're asking for opinions on LA, just read 2 out of every 3 posts on the entire forum..........

    Lol, I probably should have been more precise. I mean't on the whole weighing much heavier but climbing good thing. :wink:
    “To understand me, you have to meet me and be around me. And then only if I'm in a good mood - don't meet me in a bad mood.”
  • paulcuthbert
    paulcuthbert Posts: 1,016
    dougzz wrote:
    LangerDan wrote:
    If you assume for one moment that the others were doped and Wiggins was clean, then in order for Wiggins to have been on the "real winner", Garmin would have to have been capable of defending the yellow jersey and I'm not sure thay'd have been up to it. On top of that, Wiggins 4th place benefited from moves instigated or driven by the "suspect" teams / riders.

    The only way to answer this question would be to ensure the entire field is clean and re-run the event. Maybe Wiggins would win, but equally he might finish outside the top 10.

    +1 - This is always the trouble with just promoting the next person, you get false winners. I think think Bertie may not have won the Tour in 07 if Rasmussen hadn't dragged him along.

    My own view is when people are Dq'd you just go without that place being filled, maybe it means no winner but that's better than false promotion.

    I don't think Oscar Perreiro would ever have won a tour without a disqualification... :lol:
    The most painful climb in Northern Ireland http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs200.snc1/6776_124247198694_548863694_2335754_8016178_n.jpg
  • ratsbeyfus
    ratsbeyfus Posts: 2,841
    Determination wrote:
    dougzz wrote:
    Determination wrote:

    I have a lot of respect for Lance becouse of his work through Livestrong but I hate being taken for an idiot also.
    What is your opinions?

    Are you serious? You're asking for opinions on LA, just read 2 out of every 3 posts on the entire forum..........

    Lol, I probably should have been more precise. I mean't on the whole weighing much heavier but climbing good thing. :wink:

    As I understand it, LA claimed to have lost a lot of weight through his chemo treatment in his books, but actually lost very little, and admitted this when questioned about it many years later. His team mates were amazed how 'buff' he looked when he came in to pre-season training following his treatment. 'fraid I don't have links for all of this (BB, where are you now?) but it's well documented in 'From Lance to Landis' which is a fascinating read.

    I had one of them red bikes but I don't any more. Sad face.

    @ratsbey
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    Determination wrote:

    Lol, I probably should have been more precise. I mean't on the whole weighing much heavier but climbing good thing. :wink:

    Lance to Landis is a really good read, and as rats says it does offer some evidence that the whole weight loss rubbish Lance puts forward is just that, rubbish.

    Apart from the fanboys I think you'll find the general consensus on the forum is Lance's (then) new found climbing ability came from a syringe and blood bags ;)
  • fiftyacorns
    fiftyacorns Posts: 66
    Hi

    I think Wiggos clean but the above list seems to have a fair bit of guilt by association for some riders

    If thats the case then you'd need to include Wiggos having been punted from the tour as part of cofidis a few years back?

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