Best single exercise for core strength?

robbiedont

Why not do plank to side plank?

dennisn

robbiedont wrote:

Most who people knock squats do so because they lack the balls to do them

A few previous post's have show this to be true. I have no balls a big as the guy in the photo.
Seriously, I do believe you're right about the people who put them down. Not the balls part, but I've spent some time in gyms and have heard lots of people tell me the hate squats. I understand. They are very hard and these people simply don't have the drive to do them. Even most hardcore bodybuilders will tell you they hate them. I hate them, but the benefits are enormous in overall body strength and injury prevention gains.

neeb

I've next to no experience of squats because I don't really do gyms, but I've followed the debates on this and other threads with interest. I've always wanted to be able to do a "pistol" - when I try it I get ominous knee twinges though, so I guess I'd at least need tuition.

Do Contador, Andy Schleck etc. really do squats? It's somehow hard to imagine... I'd be less surprised if they can do pistols though, maybe without even having practiced.

But I'm reassured that just riding hard is good for the core. Part of the reason I asked is that I can feel my core muscles being strained when I'm riding hard up short hills etc, and I read somewhere about cyclists having injuries and/or imbalances caused by putting a lot of power through the legs without having sufficient core strength to properly support it.

ben16v

swiss ball not a load of toss just you dont know what your doing on them. basically anything that will upset you balance will bring core muscles into use.
that pic of the fella doing squats on one is very impressive, just doing a standing squat on one with no weight is very difficult, shows very good core stability, speak to an instructor down at you local gym or come to mine i`ll give you a free session with one of our guys

Pokerface

Sex. But you have to do it right. 8)

specializedone

Methinks there is a degree of self delusion going on. Riding does not strengthen your core muscles imho. Great for legs and cardio but try doing sit ups; burpees; pressups etc.

You will be amazed at how weak you are.

Two weeks ago I saw a commuting/MTB rider do a fitness test. He could barely lift his back off the ground to do sit ups even though I was holding his ankles.

I was the same in October last year - now I can do 46 press ups in 2 mins; 2mins rest; 40 sit ups in 2 mins; then another 2 mins rest followed by 48 burpees and then a 1km run in 3min 47 secs.

Check out the www.forcesfit.co.uk for the test I am talking about...

Now I am not going for the Olympics or the World Cup but I do have a solid core and I certainly benefit while riding - oh, and I am 60 yrs young.

jp1985

ride_whenever wrote:

jp1985 wrote:

The best single exercise would probably be the plank but tbh static exercises aren't great because that's not how you're using your muscles.

On a bike and in most sporting situations it is exactly the way the (core) muscles are working!

Not really, during exercise they're rarely working to hold one position very carefully. You're better off doing an exercise that forces your core muscles to react to an input, the same way they do when you're riding your bike. That's what i mean by not working that way.

hence the current shift in coaching practices from static core work to dynamic core work.

It's a bit like doing isometrics to strengthen your pedalling, yes it'll work, but it isn't the same as doing say a squat which is a movement.


As for squats, they're fine as long as you do them properly, incorrect squatting tends to lead to muscle imbalances across the quads/knee which leads to a whole world of pain.

OK I think I agree with you on this. I would stand by my point that core muscle primarily work in an isometric manner, but their activation in response to limb movement / force production is important and dynamic core exercises are the best means of achieving this. Hence the recommendation of exercises such as squats / deadlifts in my first post.

jp1985

neeb - what do you mean by a pistol?

The initial discussion was on the best core stability exercise. As a core stability exercise squats have been shown to activate core muscles far more greatly than traditional core exercise which is why they were mentioned. I'm not necessarily saying that Andy Schleck does or should start squatting heavy weights.

neeb

neeb - what do you mean by a pistol?

A one-legged squat (without weights), as here.

Actually, I just discovered that I can do this from the squatting => standing position as pictured, and without any knee strain, I just can't start from standing and go fully down into this position without something in my knee feeling dodgy.

jp1985

swiss ball not a load of toss just you dont know what your doing on them. basically anything that will upset you balance will bring core muscles into use.
that pic of the fella doing squats on one is very impressive, just doing a standing squat on one with no weight is very difficult, shows very good core stability, speak to an instructor down at you local gym or come to mine i`ll give you a free session with one of our guys

Look at the research!

Training on unstable environments e.g. use of swiss balls does not result in greater activation of core muscles, it reduces peripheral muscle activation, it compromises force generating capacity (especially rate of force development - very important for injury prevention), the pattern of muscle activation is not the same as in stable conditions which may explain why there doesn't appear to be any transferable benefit to performance in stable conditions and it has been shown to increase injury rates.

http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2008/01000/Trunk_Muscle_Activity_During_Stability_Ball_and.15.aspx
http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2004/08000/The_Effect_of_Short_Term_Swiss_Ball_Training_on.23.aspx
http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2006/11000/Isometric_Squat_Force_Output_and_Muscle_Activity.31.aspx
http://www.dynamic-med.com/content/4/1/6
http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstr ... ic.22.aspx
http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2007/05000/The_Effects_of_Ten_Weeks_of_Lower_Body_Unstable.47.aspx

dennisn

O.K. here's whats probably a really stupid question. Someone name the, so called, core muscles that everyone is talking about. I'm not following what seperates a core muscle from a regular muscle.

jp1985

dennisn wrote:

O.K. here's whats probably a really stupid question. Someone name the, so called, core muscles that everyone is talking about. I'm not following what seperates a core muscle from a regular muscle.

Core is a bit mis-leading as a term and there isn't a set definition as to what is meant by it.

There are a number of muscles that support the lumbar (lower) spine, pelvis and hip in order to stabilize the spine. Its these muscle and the ability to stabilise the spine that I am referring to when I mention core stability/strength but others may have different definitions.

These muscles can be separated into "local" and "global" muscles.

Local muscles are usually deep lying (attached directly to the spine) and usually do not cause marked spinal movement. These are activated at low resistance levels and are pre-activated by limb movement, they are active in posture, endurance and power activities. The two primary examples of this type of muscle are transverse abdominus and multifidis.

Secondly there are Global muscles that are more superficial and are activated at higher resistances (>40% max force) which are most active in power type activities. The primary examples of these muscles being rectus abdominus and erector spinae.

There are many many more muscles that are involved though. I think there is something like 29/30 pairs of muscles that are active over the lumbar-pelvic-hip complex.

paul.k

core excersizes squats and deadlifts ,you dont kneed to got to heavy ,also clean and jerk`s are a good one for core muscles.

macondo01

Picked up on the planks suggestion here to see if strengthening my core would help. I've had piriformis syndrome for months and months, pain in buttock and knee - the stretching helped but the pain has doggedly crept back. The relief from doing half a dozen planks was immediate. May be it put something into place somewhere, I don't know. But hey thanks for the planks I am virtually pain free.

Homer J

Dennis, lumbar multifidus is one of the one's next to the spin. From what i've read it gets worked by drawing in the abdominal wall, not from lifting weights. I understand it that there are two groups, movement and stabalization muscles, the movement ones being abs, and obliques, the likes of multifidus is stabalization. This link knows way more than i ever will

http://www.back-exercises.com/Segmental-Stabilization.html

madona

[url= http://www.trainwithmeonline.com/stretc ... cises.html ]stretching exercises t[/url

Rouge Penguin

Ok, so heres a question.

in the garage, next to the turbo is a barbel with the following.

4x 10kg
2x 4.5kg
8x 2.3kg

How the hell do i do squats of over 40kg? i can snatch it, but getting it over my head and onto the shoulders is tough, and even harder to back over again once youv'e done the reps (which in themselves arent that tough as in the gym i can do 70kg).

Better to lower weight, higher reps?

Rouge Penguin

oh and +1 on the push ups.

I started barely able to do 20 in the spring. I now do 120-160 good quality push ups every morning. Takes 15 minutes max and is a great exercise.

Dont just bang them out, you need to make sure you do them correctly. It gets easier week on week, just add 2-5 more to each set each week, even if its a struggle.

huuregeil

Clean it and do front squats instead.

Guy Kesteven

I've not read through the whole thread, but the best off season training I've found for full body conditioning and the only thing to have completely sorted my abs (vanity) and back (persistent problems for 20 years) is swimming a couple of times a week. Obviously its not an isolator for just core muscles but get yourself a couple of coaching lessons to get your technique OK and 30 mins twice a week works wonders for me in terms of a wet stretch and full body work through in one hit.

dilemna

Chin ups or pull ups, lots. Rotation of hips and spine whilst hanging. Lifting legs out in front.
Then,
Crunches straight and diagonal, not full sit ups
Press ups
Squat thrusts.

cyclopsbiker

neeb wrote:

I know that most core strength routines involve a series of different exercises, but to be honest, I'm just not going to get around to doing any at all unless maybe there is one which is simple and reasonably effective on its own.

Any ideas?

core training takes dedication and regular hard work. if you're not prepared to do that then you may as well not bother and accept your body as it is. sorry. but true.
can you really not find 10-15 minutes each day??

neeb

core training takes dedication and regular hard work. if you're not prepared to do that then you may as well not bother and accept your body as it is. sorry. but true.
can you really not find 10-15 minutes each day??

With all of the other things I have to fit into my day, probably not. It's not the time it takes, it's the time it takes to find the time. But I'm reasonably happy with my body the way it is. I think the pull ups work for me, and seem to be a good way of getting several benefits out of one quick exercise - some core strength, some upper body strength, some development of back/spine supporting musculature.

Actually I don't accept your premise that a little is as good as none - I think the trick with a lot of things in life is to do what you can, given your priorities, habits and other commitments, and that a little can go a long way.

NJK

I think to work all planes of motion would be a good start e.g wood chops, rotational med ball work and traditional crunches, not forgetting lower back work. Squats maybe a problem to cyclists initially due to lack of flexiblity, so a front squat with barbell bar on shoulders would be a good option. Another key point montitor the position of lower back when doing the squat.

Fastlad

Slimbods wrote:

little upstart wrote:

Ride yer bike, ride yer bike, ride yer bike.

...up hills

Nail on the head! WTF is that plank doing on a swiss ball with a barbell?

Ride your bike on lots of hills and stay seated for as long as possible and hey presto....you will have an excellent core!!

simon_e

specializedone wrote:

I am not going for the Olympics or the World Cup but I do have a solid core and I certainly benefit while riding - oh, and I am 60 yrs young.

But have the sit-ups helped your cycling? And how? I don't see the connection.

Yoga, pilates and so on are likely to be good for you, particularly for anyone who has a sedentary life or a desk job (I'm considering yoga because I'm not supple enough, I need to stretch more). I would have thought that 'core' exercises would be particularly beneficial for individuals with a specific weakness or trained athletes looking to reduce the risk of injury or to gain something over their rivals.

I'm not convinced that exercises with a large ball or doing squats in the gym is going to provide much to improve for my cycling, though it's good for the sales of equipment and gym membership. I'd echo the suggestions made by little upstart/Slimbods.

neeb

Fastlad wrote:

Slimbods wrote:

little upstart wrote:

Ride yer bike, ride yer bike, ride yer bike.

...up hills

Nail on the head! WTF is that plank doing on a swiss ball with a barbell?

Ride your bike on lots of hills and stay seated for as long as possible and hey presto....you will have an excellent core!!

Yup, when I started this thread (several months ago) I wasn't really intending to start a big discussion on hard-core-core-strength development exercises - I'm a cyclist, not a body builder or gym fanatic. I've no reason to believe there's anything wrong with my core strength and I do ride hard up plenty hills. Actually, it was partially because I 'd noticed mild muscle soreness in the lower back/abdominal area after some serious hill climbing that I thought about core strength to begin with. But of course that slight ache is probably just the core muscles being used and developed!

I can now do full unweighted one-legged squats ("pistols", or whatever). So I guess my core muscles can't be total mush...

kieranb

Rouge Penguin wrote:

oh and +1 on the push ups.

I started barely able to do 20 in the spring. I now do 120-160 good quality push ups every morning. Takes 15 minutes max and is a great exercise.

Dont just bang them out, you need to make sure you do them correctly. It gets easier week on week, just add 2-5 more to each set each week, even if its a struggle.

so what was your training plan? Did you do them every day?