Piti bites again

1246

Comments

  • DaveyL
    DaveyL Posts: 5,167
    For some reason I'm hearing the voice of the Hooded Claw when I read that McQuaid quote....
    Le Blaireau (1)
  • ms_tree
    ms_tree Posts: 1,405
    Just thought I'd add my twopennoth -not that anyone cares. It's always struck me as strange that he rode the Tour that went into Italy knowing that the Italians had the results of the blood. If he was dodgy wouldn't he have 'staged a convenient accident 'as someone suggested earlier BEFORE he got into Italy. Just a musing.
    I just like watching him ride frankly. No point in watching if all you think is someone is doping. Life's too short.
    'Google can bring back a hundred thousand answers. A librarian can bring you back the right one.'
    Neil Gaiman
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    Frenchie me ol' china, can you hear that fat Doris singing? :)
  • ms_tree
    ms_tree Posts: 1,405
    It also amazes me that people on here gripe and moan and slag off certain riders - and them pick them for their PTP. Bit two-faced IMHO.
    'Google can bring back a hundred thousand answers. A librarian can bring you back the right one.'
    Neil Gaiman
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    Ms Tree wrote:
    It also amazes me that people on here gripe and moan and slag off certain riders - and them pick them for their PTP. Bit two-faced IMHO.

    Not really. PTP is about who you think will win, not who you'd like to win. Quite different things.
  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    Ms Tree wrote:
    It also amazes me that people on here gripe and moan and slag off certain riders - and them pick them for their PTP. Bit two-faced IMHO.

    Cos PTP is who you think will win, not who you would wish to.
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • Pokerface
    Pokerface Posts: 7,960
    Ms Tree wrote:
    It also amazes me that people on here gripe and moan and slag off certain riders - and them pick them for their PTP. Bit two-faced IMHO.



    Well - I may not like Chelsea or Man U - but I'm always going to bet them to win games.

    Not two-faced at all. PTP isn't a popularity contest.
  • Pokerface
    Pokerface Posts: 7,960
    HAHAHAHAHA. Everyone jumped on that PTP comment pretty fast, huh?
  • Pokerface
    Pokerface Posts: 7,960
    frenchfighter wrote:
    Don't you think it would make sense for this 'blood' to be tested in a few independent laboratories around Europe to both match it to him and to run it for dope (assuming this is possible and no spoiling, contamination, tampering etc has taken place)?


    No. The tests have been done. DNA has been matched. There is a 99.9999% certainty that it was his blood and that it was tainted with EPO.

    He has not denied that the blood was tainted with EPO. I don't think he currently even denies that the blood is his. Instead, his lawyers simply try and say that it was obtained illegally and therefore can't be used.

    If he was innocent - he would offer up his blood freely for DNA matching. But he doesn't.


    Many people have asked you if you agree that he WAS doping in 96 or was seriously intending to.

    Why do you decline to answer that question?
  • afx237vi
    afx237vi Posts: 12,630
    edited May 2010
    Ms Tree wrote:
    Just thought I'd add my twopennoth -not that anyone cares. It's always struck me as strange that he rode the Tour that went into Italy knowing that the Italians had the results of the blood. If he was dodgy wouldn't he have 'staged a convenient accident 'as someone suggested earlier BEFORE he got into Italy. Just a musing.
    I just like watching him ride frankly. No point in watching if all you think is someone is doping. Life's too short.

    Well what is the timeline with that? From memory, I thought CONI obtained the blood from Serrano after the Tour had gone through Italy.
  • cal_stewart
    cal_stewart Posts: 1,840
    RichN95 wrote:
    frenchfighter wrote:

    Don't you think it would make sense for this 'blood' to be tested in a few independent laboratories around Europe to both match it to him and to run it for dope (assuming this is possible and no spoiling, contamination, tampering etc has taken place)?

    It's good enough for murder and rape cases. They don't send DNA tests all round Europe to several places. The police do the test in their own labs.

    +1
    eating parmos since 1981

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  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    afx237vi wrote:
    Ms Tree wrote:
    Just thought I'd add my twopennoth -not that anyone cares. It's always struck me as strange that he rode the Tour that went into Italy knowing that the Italians had the results of the blood. If he was dodgy wouldn't he have 'staged a convenient accident 'as someone suggested earlier BEFORE he got into Italy. Just a musing.
    I just like watching him ride frankly. No point in watching if all you think is someone is doping. Life's too short.

    Well what is the timeline with that? From memory, I thought CONI obtained the blood from Serrano after the Tour had gone through Italy.

    That was my reading. They had his swab, and waited til the judge responsible was on holiday to request evidence from Spain.
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    When people post some stupid picture to try and say something I'm afraid for you it reflects badly on you.

    As for the useless comments, save your time. They serve as clutter to the thread and little else. If you cannot try and debate, however 'wrong' someone thinks your viewpoint is, I think it better to refrain from posting.

    At the end of the day, if Valverde gets banned he will come back at the young age of 32 and win again and again and again and you guys will sit there not enjoying it all as you will think he is doing it doped.

    As for Fat Pat, why is he still in a job.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Pokerface I will answer that question shortly. Didn't avoid it, just busy.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,114
    frenchfighter wrote:
    When people post some stupid picture to try and say something I'm afraid for you it reflects badly on you.
    Do you have even one iota of self awareness? :shock:
  • DaveyL
    DaveyL Posts: 5,167
    In the words of Mr T, I Piti the fool...
    Le Blaireau (1)
  • moray_gub
    moray_gub Posts: 3,328
    frenchfighter wrote:
    When people post some stupid picture to try and say something I'm afraid for you it reflects badly on you.

    If you cannot try and debate, however 'wrong' someone thinks your viewpoint is, I think it better to refrain from posting.

    Coming from a guy who often says "i refuse to discuss this anymore" that is quite some statement. As Kleber said stop digging a hole for yourself you are just coming across as a fanny.
    Gasping - but somehow still alive !
  • moray_gub
    moray_gub Posts: 3,328
    DaveyL wrote:
    In the words of Mr T, I Piti the fool...


    :lol:
    Gasping - but somehow still alive !
  • Pokerface
    Pokerface Posts: 7,960
    If we can stop the FF-bashing for a moment and get back on topic....

    Very interesting development. It seems a spanish court is now SUPPORTING CONI's use of Puerto evidence.

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/valverd ... er-support

    "The ruling effectively supports the action taken by CONI in banning Valverde from competing on Italian soil until 2011. The organisation has been pushing for that ban to be extended to the rest of the world."


    Tick Tock Alejandro. Tick Tock.
  • flattythehurdler
    flattythehurdler Posts: 2,314
    Roscobob wrote:
    It's OK to dope if uncle pat likes you.
    Fixed that for you. :wink:
    Dan
  • calvjones
    calvjones Posts: 3,850
    flattythehurdler wrote:
    Roscobob wrote:
    It's OK to dope if you pwn uncle pat .
    Fixed that for you. :wink:

    Fixed that for you :wink:
    ___________________

    Strava is not Zen.
  • SpaceJunk
    SpaceJunk Posts: 1,157
    FrenchFighter,

    Sorry to bug you mate, but I'm still waiting on an answer to whether you think Valverde did in fact use the services of Dr Fuentes or not.

    Please advise

    Cheers

    SpaceJunk
  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    I'm still waiting on him answering whether or not he should be sanctioned for Puerto... I asked for a yes or no and got a load of waffle.
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Space:

    Read comment to Poker, I will write it up. Pretty busy with work atm

    I would have replied yday buit too much bombardement from others made me miss it
    Contador is the Greatest
  • oscarbudgie
    oscarbudgie Posts: 850
    frenchfighter wrote:
    Space:

    Read comment to Poker, I will write it up. Pretty busy with work atm

    I would have replied yday buit too much bombardement from others made me miss it

    You have time to write 30 words saying why you can't write one?
    Cannondale Supersix / CAAD9 / Boardman 9.0 / Benotto 3000
  • frenchfighter
    frenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Do I think he doped pre puerto? NO. Why, well quite simply because he never got caught doping and his performance then was inferior to the last four years. I would use this basic logic for pretty much all riders - who am I to cast aspersions and suspiscions based on what? some media release and opinions of people.

    Do I think he was going to dope? YES. Why, well basing this solely on the fact that apparently plasma belonging to Valverde has epo in it, and that Basso admitted it and Valverde was involved at the same time with the same Dr. I see no other reason to have epo in your blood, although if there was an explanation, I wouldn't have a problem accepting it.

    Do I think he doped post puerto? NO. Why, as reasoned in a previous post.

    A question for you - do you think he doped to win post puerto? If so, what is your reasoning?
    Contador is the Greatest
  • DaveyL
    DaveyL Posts: 5,167
    frenchfighter wrote:
    Do I think he doped pre puerto? NO. Why, well quite simply because he never got caught doping and his performance then was inferior to the last four years.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YczUgIbP91A
    Le Blaireau (1)
  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    Thanks for your responses FF I'll answer your question

    I don't think it matters whether he doped post Puerto or not. There's a bag of his EPO infused blood (Which must had the EPO infused while it was still in his body) with the investigators. He should cop the same ban as Basso.

    I know it's terrible debating but may I answer your other questions with a question? If he didn't dope before Puerto, and he didn't dop after Puerto, why did he decide to give it a go, in you opinion?
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,158
    frenchfighter wrote:
    Do I think he doped pre puerto? NO. Why, well quite simply because he never got caught doping and his performance then was inferior to the last four years. I would use this basic logic for pretty much all riders - who am I to cast aspersions and suspiscions based on what? some media release and opinions of people.

    Do I think he was going to dope? YES. Why, well basing this solely on the fact that apparently plasma belonging to Valverde has epo in it, and that Basso admitted it and Valverde was involved at the same time with the same Dr. I see no other reason to have epo in your blood, although if there was an explanation, I wouldn't have a problem accepting it.

    Do I think he doped post puerto? NO. Why, as reasoned in a previous post.

    A question for you - do you think he doped to win post puerto? If so, what is your reasoning?

    So if he never doped, but was only planning to, how did the EPO get in his blood?

    (I'm pretty sure you don't inject it into the blood bag after extraction and leave it to mature like some sort of Vampire's Homebrew)
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • Kléber
    Kléber Posts: 6,842
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance
    An early version of cognitive dissonance theory appeared in Leon Festinger's 1956 book, When Prophecy Fails. This book gave an inside account of belief persistence in members of a UFO doomsday cult, and documented the increased proselytization they exhibited after the leader's "end of the world" prophecy failed to come true. The prediction of the Earth's destruction, supposedly sent by aliens to the leader of the group, became a disconfirmed expectancy that caused dissonance between the cognitions, "the world is going to end" and "the world did not end." Although some members abandoned the group when the prophecy failed, most of the members lessened their dissonance by accepting a new belief, that the planet was spared because of the faith of the group.

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