ASL full of Motorcycles/High level exhausts

brixtonbiker66

As the weather is improving and with the increase in Motorcycle use,I am finding that the ASL is so full of motorcycles i cannot get into it.

This morning at Trafalgar square for example. Motorcycles took up all the spaces.

If you wait at the back of the motorbikes you get a mouthful of toxic fumes.

To make matters worse most of the sports bikes now have high level exhausts.

As a biker myself i know that most sports bikes have the catalytic converter removed to increase performance so the exhaust gases are very dirty.

What can be done about this??

el_presidente

not a lot. Wait behind them, you might lose 10 seconds. Re the gases, any harm done by breathing it in is far outweighed by the exercise benefits of cycling.

bigmat

I'm sick of the c***s. Had one try to follow me into ASL box at London Bridge last night I stopped right at the box thinking he might get the message but he tried to manoeuvere past me so I had to slowly cut him up. He eventually pulled alongside me but wouldn't make eye contact, was tempted to have a word but really what's the point?

Headhuunter

I just pull through the ASL and in front of them, if there's a ped crossing then I cross to the other side of this. If the junction is clear I simply RLJ. Job done. Until the police tidy up ASLs and cycle lanes as they are supposed to, I feel vindicated....

zanes

The way the good weather motorcyclists are riding round here at the moment, I can only see this being a problem for a few weeks, after which most of them will have removed themselves from the gene pool

kelsen

I don't really see the point of an ASL that spans the entire width of the road. Ok, there are situations where it might be useful like making right turns, but in most cases it just encourages cyclists and bikers to barge to the front of the queue.

As a cyclist, what's the point of plonking yourself in front of a car or motorbike, then just get overtaken again when the lights change, and holding up traffic in the process?

Would it not make more sense to keep the ASL the same width as the cycle lane? This might also discourage drivers and motorcyclists from going past the normal stop line. The reason they go into the ASL in first place is because it's there.

bails87

kelsen wrote:

As a cyclist, what's the point of plonking yourself in front of a car or motorbike,

To get to where you're going?

kelsen

bails87 wrote:

kelsen wrote:

As a cyclist, what's the point of plonking yourself in front of a car or motorbike,

To get to where you're going?

I've always been able to get to where I'm going without being a plonker

W1

Headhuunter wrote:

I just pull through the ASL and in front of them, if there's a ped crossing then I cross to the other side of this. If the junction is clear I simply RLJ. Job done. Until the police tidy up ASLs and cycle lanes as they are supposed to, I feel vindicated....

Unbeatable logic!

Headhuunter

kelsen wrote:

I don't really see the point of an ASL that spans the entire width of the road. Ok, there are situations where it might be useful like making right turns, but in most cases it just encourages cyclists and bikers to barge to the front of the queue.

As a cyclist, what's the point of plonking yourself in front of a car or motorbike, then just get overtaken again when the lights change, and holding up traffic in the process?

Would it not make more sense to keep the ASL the same width as the cycle lane? This might also discourage drivers and motorcyclists from going past the normal stop line. The reason they go into the ASL in first place is because it's there.

The point of an ASL is to put you, as the most vulnerable road user, in a highly visible spot in front of motor traffic. If you're sat in teh middle of the traffic you're open to left hooks, traffic changing lanes without warning etc as drivers are often more concerned about getting through the junction as quickly as possible than whether or not they're about to side swipe a cyclist.

In any case I don't get overtaken by cars at junctions (OK perhaps by motorbikes). I can easily make it across most crossroads on my bike faster than most cars. OK, yes, if the road ahead is clear, they pass me once we have cleared the junction itself, but if I'm stuck somewhere to the rear or the middle of a queue of traffic at a junction, I get held up by cars not the other way round.

fnegroni

kelsen wrote:

I don't really see the point of an ASL that spans the entire width of the road. Ok, there are situations where it might be useful like making right turns, but in most cases it just encourages cyclists and bikers to barge to the front of the queue.

As a cyclist, what's the point of plonking yourself in front of a car or motorbike, then just get overtaken again when the lights change, and holding up traffic in the process?

+1

gtvlusso

The reason the exhausts on sportsbikes is high, is to allow the motorcycle more clearance when tipping into a corner - i.e. lean it in more. On bikes with a low level exhaust you tend to catch it on the ground.

However, I agree - I see motorcyclists in cycle lanes all over Bristol - I think there are allot more motorcyclists who are simply using it as a commuting tool and therefore don't really give a crap (a real, old skool long timer will always filter up the middle of the traffic and probably go ahead of the ASL or just behind it!) - Bikes are so cheap now, I think allot of riders don't even get a licence - particularly on mopeds - just wing it that they won't be caught.

As for removing cat's - well, personally I have never done that - but I have always fitted loud sports exhausts onto bikes - removing the cat would severely screw up the ECU on a bike, they are quite finely set as bikes can rev up to 14,000 rpm and japanese emission laws are some of the strictest in the world!;

I have fitted loud exhausts because;

A, because it is cool (especially a Ducati with 50mm Termi's)

B, people also drive with their ears (why do Police cars have sirens?!) - I would rather someone heard that I was around them!

fnegroni

Headhuunter wrote:

The point of an ASL is to put you, as the most vulnerable road user, in a highly visible spot in front of motor traffic.

Then, you only need space for one bike, as the safest spot would be directly in front, not to the side. And that would not be the case if there was a huge lorry there. either.

If you're sat in teh middle of the traffic you're open to left hooks, traffic changing lanes without warning etc as drivers are often more concerned about getting through the junction as quickly as possible than whether or not they're about to side swipe a cyclist.

Middle of traffic is a bit misleading: you can be in a primary position in the traffic lane, which is a very prominent position and already discourages the behaviour you are trying to avoid using an ASL.

In any case I don't get overtaken by cars at junctions (OK perhaps by motorbikes). I can easily make it across most crossroads on my bike faster than most cars. OK, yes, if the road ahead is clear, they pass me once we have cleared the junction itself, but if I'm stuck somewhere to the rear or the middle of a queue of traffic at a junction, I get held up by cars not the other way round.

The general advice from more experienced cyclists than me, is to wait one or two cars behind the front of the queue, to allow for the impatient driver at the front, yet not cause any distress and at the same time not being held up too long, plus giving the ability to avoid other vehicles RLJing.

W1

fnegroni wrote:

The general advice from more experienced cyclists than me, is to wait one or two cars behind the front of the queue, to allow for the impatient driver at the front, yet not cause any distress and at the same time not being held up too long, plus giving the ability to avoid other vehicles RLJing.

I do that much more often now - it gives many of the benefits of the ASL without getting in the way and peeving drivers as much. However it's frustrating to wait two cars back and then see the nodders grind their way to the front and the miss the lights changing anyway so you have to overtake them again, although It's easier to do that, in my opinion, when you're already well within "your lane" rather than having to merge into the traffic stream to overtake slow bikes. it's what I tend to now do going eastbound at the Vauxhall Bridge lights for example.

Porgy

It's when I want to use the ASL to change lanes I have the problem - it's often the only safe time to do so in heavy London traffic - but when full of motorcycles or cars it's often impossible to maneuovre yourself to where you want to be....though I usually end up having to put myself in front of the motor vehicles and make it very clear that I want to turn left - or whatever - otherwise I get cut up - sometimes I get cut up anyway. :evil:

bigmat

fnegroni wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

The point of an ASL is to put you, as the most vulnerable road user, in a highly visible spot in front of motor traffic.

Then, you only need space for one bike, as the safest spot would be directly in front, not to the side. And that would not be the case if there was a huge lorry there. either.

If you're sat in teh middle of the traffic you're open to left hooks, traffic changing lanes without warning etc as drivers are often more concerned about getting through the junction as quickly as possible than whether or not they're about to side swipe a cyclist.

Middle of traffic is a bit misleading: you can be in a primary position in the traffic lane, which is a very prominent position and already discourages the behaviour you are trying to avoid using an ASL.

In any case I don't get overtaken by cars at junctions (OK perhaps by motorbikes). I can easily make it across most crossroads on my bike faster than most cars. OK, yes, if the road ahead is clear, they pass me once we have cleared the junction itself, but if I'm stuck somewhere to the rear or the middle of a queue of traffic at a junction, I get held up by cars not the other way round.

The general advice from more experienced cyclists than me, is to wait one or two cars behind the front of the queue, to allow for the impatient driver at the front, yet not cause any distress and at the same time not being held up too long, plus giving the ability to avoid other vehicles RLJing.

Great plan - sit in the traffic sucking up fumes while a HGV pulls up on your right indicating left. I can't for the life of me think why anybody would want to get ahead of the traffic... :roll:

rjsterry

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

Headhuunter

MatHammond wrote:

fnegroni wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

The point of an ASL is to put you, as the most vulnerable road user, in a highly visible spot in front of motor traffic.

Then, you only need space for one bike, as the safest spot would be directly in front, not to the side. And that would not be the case if there was a huge lorry there. either.

If you're sat in teh middle of the traffic you're open to left hooks, traffic changing lanes without warning etc as drivers are often more concerned about getting through the junction as quickly as possible than whether or not they're about to side swipe a cyclist.

Middle of traffic is a bit misleading: you can be in a primary position in the traffic lane, which is a very prominent position and already discourages the behaviour you are trying to avoid using an ASL.

In any case I don't get overtaken by cars at junctions (OK perhaps by motorbikes). I can easily make it across most crossroads on my bike faster than most cars. OK, yes, if the road ahead is clear, they pass me once we have cleared the junction itself, but if I'm stuck somewhere to the rear or the middle of a queue of traffic at a junction, I get held up by cars not the other way round.

The general advice from more experienced cyclists than me, is to wait one or two cars behind the front of the queue, to allow for the impatient driver at the front, yet not cause any distress and at the same time not being held up too long, plus giving the ability to avoid other vehicles RLJing.

Great plan - sit in the traffic sucking up fumes while a HGV pulls up on your right indicating left. I can't for the life of me think why anybody would want to get ahead of the traffic... :roll:

Yep, ahead of the traffic where you're really obvious is always safest as far as I'm concerned. I don't understand the logic for having space for only 1 bike in the ASL.... huh?? What happens when, as in London during the summer, there are about 20 cyclists at the junction. Sounds prety stoopid to me are they all supposed to squeeze into the single ASL space?

As for waiting in primary further back, that may be fine as long as you keep your position in the traffic but if you're a bit slower you still risk some loony left hooking you/trying to squeeze past. Also I find that invariably you end up stuck behind a load of traffic as it jostles past cars trying to turn. I can easily get across a busy junction faster than most cars.... easily.

spen666

rjsterry wrote:

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

+1 - at last another person who uses their brain to think for themselves and adapts to the situation around them

andy83

ride the rural routes down country lanes

simples

fnegroni

MatHammond wrote:

Great plan - sit in the traffic sucking up fumes while a HGV pulls up on your right indicating left. I can't for the life of me think why anybody would want to get ahead of the traffic... :roll:

I yet have to see an HGV able to shift sideways in stationary traffic.

fnegroni

Headhuunter wrote:

I can easily get across a busy junction faster than most cars.... easily.

Most drivers thinks so too unfortunately... especially the ones who RLJ directly in front of you.

spen666

rjsterry wrote:

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

+1 - at last another person who uses their brain to think for themselves and adapts to the situation around them

Headhuunter

spen666 wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

+1 - at last another person who uses their brain to think for themselves and adapts to the situation around them

To be honest, if I see a "loon in a blacked out Nova" I feel even more like I need to get ahead. Especially if the driver is being an @rse and blocking the ASL...

spen666

Headhuunter wrote:

spen666 wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

+1 - at last another person who uses their brain to think for themselves and adapts to the situation around them

To be honest, if I see a "loon in a blacked out Nova" I feel even more like I need to get ahead. Especially if the driver is being an @rse and blocking the ASL...

WHY?

If you get ahead of him, then he is likely to have to pass you again (unless you are turning off or he is), whereas if you stay behind him then you are not likely to inter react with him again

fnegroni

Headhuunter wrote:

To be honest, if I see a "loon in a blacked out Nova" I feel even more like I need to get ahead. Especially if the driver is being an @rse and blocking the ASL...

Yep, who needs the Police when vigilantes abound.
Let's teach them all!

kelsen

rjsterry wrote:

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

Agree also. I think most experienced cyclists can operate fine with or without ASL by applying a little common sense and planning. The point I was trying to make is that ASLs gives some people the idea that they should always be at the front of the queue at traffic lights regardless of the circumstances. Those people might then find themselves in the middle of the road trying to get back to the left hand side again with traffic impatiently zooming by them. Fine for the Cavendishes amongst us, but not ideal for the slower and more inexperienced riders.

Porgy

spen666 wrote:

rjsterry wrote:

You don't think that just possibly different situations call for a different response? Sometimes I pull up to the ASL as I can see it will benefit me, and sometimes, say, when there's a loon in a blacked-out Nova revving his engine at the front, I'll sit a couple of cars back to let him sort out his inadequacy issues first. A one size fits all approach is a little simplistic don't you think?

+1 - at last another person who uses their brain to think for themselves and adapts to the situation around them

I think we all do - it's only when confronted with a question on the internet that people retreat to their pet theories and argue their corner as if their life depended on it. :roll:

Porgy

fnegroni wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

To be honest, if I see a "loon in a blacked out Nova" I feel even more like I need to get ahead. Especially if the driver is being an @rse and blocking the ASL...

Yep, who needs the Police when vigilantes abound.
Let's teach them all!

If that's vigilante action then I'm surprised anyone bothered watching Deathwish when it came out - must have been a pretty boring film....wife raped by nasty gang members? I know I'll go and park my bike in front of them.

kelsen

Porgy wrote:

I think we all do - it's only when confronted with a question on the internet that people retreat to their pet theories and argue their corner as if their life depended on it. :roll:

You're wrong! And I'll bet my life on it!

Headhuunter

Porgy wrote:

fnegroni wrote:

Headhuunter wrote:

To be honest, if I see a "loon in a blacked out Nova" I feel even more like I need to get ahead. Especially if the driver is being an @rse and blocking the ASL...

Yep, who needs the Police when vigilantes abound.
Let's teach them all!

If that's vigilante action then I'm surprised anyone bothered watching Deathwish when it came out - must have been a pretty boring film....wife raped by nasty gang members? I know I'll go and park my bike in front of them.

It's death or glory as far as I'm concerned. If I go down, I'll make sure I do some serious damage to that damn Nova... None of you have got any fight in you!