Apparently, we might have gone too far!

rake

zanes wrote:

rake wrote:

car or bike or walking it doesnt matter. do you still grip the wheel with both hands and shuffle it through?

No. Obviously this is the same as "ripp(ing) the rule buck (sic) up" :roll:

You're making the classic mistake cyclists and drivers are two mutually exclusive groups.

no. im saying the opposite like.moving forward im saying it doesnt matter particularly what you are doing some people are determined to do stupid things, i dont see how a simple test would change that when riding on a bike, most road accidents are caused by young drivers who have passed the test more recently than most.

mididoctors

bails87 wrote:

lochindaal wrote:

Without trying to start a scrap I think as cyclists we sometimes bring this upon ourselves by jumping red lights, etc

I get pissed off when joyriders steal cars and drunk drivers run people over, but I doubt many drivers (myself included) are saying "come on guys, we bring it on ourselves"

you have it there

a road user is a person not the vehicle...

people who organise their thinking of whats right and wrong road use based on the vehicle don't get it ...

you have a responsibility to more than just yourself using the roads

mididoctors

DesWeller wrote:

Ands wrote:

Most of the incidents I encounter with motorists are nothing to do with control of a vehicle or situation, and everything to do with attitude.

OK, so it's not perfect. Very little is. The point I was trying to make is that road cyclists are not required to learn any basic skills before being allowed to take to the road - and that can't be right or even logically justifiable.

i think the big difference is the potential to kill someone else is a lot less on a bike...

"these cyclists are a menace" types blow a lot of hot air mainly because "cyclists" are getting themselves killed rather than anybody else...

as for a test or compulsory training

teaching everyone not to get trapped on the inside left of over-sized vehicles would be a start

i would settle for TV add campaigns as progress

desweller

mididoctors wrote:

i think the big difference is the potential to kill someone else is a lot less on a bike...

"these cyclists are a menace" types blow a lot of hot air mainly because "cyclists" are getting themselves killed rather than anybody else...

as for a test or compulsory training

teaching everyone not to get trapped on the inside left of over-sized vehicles would be a start

i would settle for TV add campaigns as progress

True enough. Many drivers feel that cyclists have a lot of potential to cause accidents though. Lots of riders' sense of self-preservation seems to get left at home as soon as they saddle up.

garrynolan

downfader wrote:

DesWeller wrote:

rake wrote:

i get mad when people cut roads up on a bike with no lights in front of my car. some pedestrians cross slowly round here to wind up car drivers. idiots do allsorts of stupid things i dont undertand why thats attributed to how theyre conveying themselves along.

Drivers have to pass tests in order to qualify for a licence. Now, although most of us will have experienced some sort of incident as a result of poor driving, the fact is that, without these tests, the standard of driving in the UK would be far poorer.

As you say, some people are just idiots, but that can be mitigated somewhat with training. That training is compulsory for cars; it isn't for bikes. Therefore you will have a wider spread of capability of cyclists than you will for car drivers. So it can be argued that the former mode of conveyance has a generally lower standard of road skills than the latter.

NB If you've ever driven anywhere that does not require a test then you'll know how chaotic it can be. Driving on the wrong side of the road, random u-turns in the middle of a six-lane carriageway, driving the wrong way up a motorway slip road cos there isn't an off-ramp, just an on-ramp... It all gets a bit mental! So you should know that the standard of driving in the UK is actually quite good!

I look at cars in the same way I look at the heavy machinery I use at work. Machinery needs training in order to be safely used, cycles are quite uncomplicated. :?

Re: the last four words... an axe is uncomplicated, but used incorrectly you will hurt yourself or someone else!

downfader

garrynolan wrote:

downfader wrote:

DesWeller wrote:

rake wrote:

i get mad when people cut roads up on a bike with no lights in front of my car. some pedestrians cross slowly round here to wind up car drivers. idiots do allsorts of stupid things i dont undertand why thats attributed to how theyre conveying themselves along.

Drivers have to pass tests in order to qualify for a licence. Now, although most of us will have experienced some sort of incident as a result of poor driving, the fact is that, without these tests, the standard of driving in the UK would be far poorer.

As you say, some people are just idiots, but that can be mitigated somewhat with training. That training is compulsory for cars; it isn't for bikes. Therefore you will have a wider spread of capability of cyclists than you will for car drivers. So it can be argued that the former mode of conveyance has a generally lower standard of road skills than the latter.

NB If you've ever driven anywhere that does not require a test then you'll know how chaotic it can be. Driving on the wrong side of the road, random u-turns in the middle of a six-lane carriageway, driving the wrong way up a motorway slip road cos there isn't an off-ramp, just an on-ramp... It all gets a bit mental! So you should know that the standard of driving in the UK is actually quite good!

I look at cars in the same way I look at the heavy machinery I use at work. Machinery needs training in order to be safely used, cycles are quite uncomplicated. :?

Re: the last four words... an axe is uncomplicated, but used incorrectly you will hurt yourself or someone else!

I've used axes a fair few times. Though I do think they are irrelevant to this conversation. They dont get you from a-b

deptfordmarmoset

I've used axes a fair few times. Though I do think they are irrelevant to this conversation. They dont get you from a-b Wink

They do when you're in France though....les grands axes are principal routes

downfader

deptfordmarmoset wrote:

I've used axes a fair few times. Though I do think they are irrelevant to this conversation. They dont get you from a-b Wink

They do when you're in France though....les grands axes are principal routes

:shock: 8)

Matt the Tester

spen666 wrote:

RichK wrote:

bails87 wrote:

"1-in-5 cyclists riding roughshod over the law". And what proportion of drivers have ever broken the speed limit, and so also ridden (driven?) roughshod over the law? :roll:

Beat me to it.

I read somewhere recently that something like 82% of drivers admit to exceeding the speed limit. (wish I kept the link)...

[Edit] Here's one report of it... http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/123217
[/Edit]

And of the remaining 18%, 17.9% of them tell lies

lol yee