OT: Go Saints

suzyb

cjcp wrote:

JonGinge wrote:

Greg66 wrote:

JonGinge wrote:

Greg66 wrote:

There are rules about when playing the man off the ball is permissible and when it becomes impermissible that I don't understand.

'Pass interference' is generally frowned upon, pretty much anything else goes*.


* my knowledge is probably woefully outdated.

I'm thinking of times when I've seen a flag for some really obscure thing done when the lines of scrimmage engage. Even with the replay I can't tell what's wrong. Bit like the intricacies of front row scrummaging... :?

Hmm, dunno. Been a while since I've seen much. Defense moving too early maybe (just a wild guess)

Is that a "false start"?

Think so. It happened a couple of times last night and I noticed on one replay you could see the guy moving his shoulder no more than an inch forward.

jonginge

I was a Redskins fan (go figure). Joe Theismann: legend

Agent57

cjcp wrote:

What happened to Mick Luckhurst?!

Dunno, but Gary Imlach's obviously still on TV.

greg66_tri_v2.0

Jaysus. Just wasted some wiki time.

CJ is right about forward/backwards passing, at least in Am Football.

There's a large section devoted to the differences between CF and AF, one of which is the passing rule, and one of which is that there is the difference in number of players is one, rather than two.

It's all very complicated.

lost_in_thought

It sounds very stop-start, and relatively similar to Rugby League, aka stupid rugby.

So, they line up head to head at point X in the pitch, do all of each side have to be their side of point X?

So a little fellow can leg it down the side for a quarterback or kicker to boot/chuck it after him? And then he gets mullered by a bunch of fat blokes?

And the defence are basically trying to cut down the offence before a pass can be made?

What causes a turnover? Intercepted passes? Tackles? Knock-ons?

It doesn't sound like it demands a huge amount of fitness from some of the players.

Why do they wear such epic amounts of protection? Are they just wusses?

So many questions.

Oddjob62

When a pass is in the air but the reciever and the defensive player marking him are allowed to go for the ball. You cannot play the man (ie grabbing them, tackling them, pushing them) until they have made contact with the ball.

What a defensive player can do however is bump the reciever a the line. There is a 5 yard (from the line of scrimage) "bump zone" in which the defensive player can block the reciever in order to try to put him off his route and mess up the all important timing between QB and receiver.

Eau Rouge

You are allowed pass the ball backwards as often as you like, from wherever on the field you like, as in rugby. There are youtube video's of high school and college games where teams pass the ball a silly number of times right at the end of the game. You can only throw 1 forward pass, and then only from behind the line of scrimmage.

The best way to follow American sports is the internet. For various reasons American sports are light-years ahead in terms of using the interent than European sports. You can watch games live in HD or watch any game after it's over. I used to do this with baseball games a few years ago, and the quality has only got better since. If you want to follow a specific team, finding the online version of the local paper is a good move too.

cjcp

A question for the followers of the sport:

Who would you rather have running at you: Christian Okoye or Jonah Lomu?

(Either way, I think this is a Dommsday scenario and that I'd burst into tears long before they hit me.)

greg66_tri_v2.0

Eau Rouge wrote:

college games

are unbelievable.

By which I mean I've seen televised college games in huge stadia, with a lot if not most of the "trimmings" that come with the real thing. The amount of money sloshing around at college level football is obscene; it is the seed-bed for the NFL, but even so, it's just unreal.

By contrast, I can't think of any University level football games that are televised here (and footy has by far and away the most TV revenue of any sport in England) or even played in those sorts of surroundings. In fact, the only Uni level televised sports events I can think of are the RU Varsity match and the Boat Race.

Oddjob62

lost_in_thought wrote:

So, they line up head to head at point X in the pitch, do all of each side have to be their side of point X?
Yes

So a little fellow can leg it down the side for a quarterback or kicker to boot/chuck it after him? And then he gets mullered by a bunch of fat blokes?
Usually they get hit by other smaller fast blokes

And the defence are basically trying to cut down the offence before a pass can be made?
Generally. the line will attack the QB or RBs, while the defensive backs will mark the receivers. Linebackers do a bit of both depending on what defense they are running

What causes a turnover? Intercepted passes? Tackles? Knock-ons?
Interception, Fumble, Turnover on downs (ie you fail to make the 10yards on your 4th down), punt to the opposition (normally done on 4th down if you can't make the 10 yards)

It doesn't sound like it demands a huge amount of fitness from some of the players.
You can be 350lbs and need oxygen after 2 shorts sprints if you are good enough at what you need to do

Why do they wear such epic amounts of protection? Are they just wusses?
This was introduced due to too many injuries/deaths in the game. Just means you can run head first into each other instead of having to put your head to one side

So many questions.

cjcp

Never have "got" the college-game thing.

_Brun_

Greg66 wrote:

Eau Rouge wrote:

college games

are unbelievable.

By which I mean I've seen televised college games in huge stadia, with a lot if not most of the "trimmings" that come with the real thing. The amount of money sloshing around at college level football is obscene; it is the seed-bed for the NFL, but even so, it's just unreal.

By contrast, I can't think of any University level football games that are televised here (and footy has by far and away the most TV revenue of any sport in England) or even played in those sorts of surroundings. In fact, the only Uni level televised sports events I can think of are the RU Varsity match and the Boat Race.

You can't make any reasonable comparisons between US college sports and anything associated with British universities. When a country of 300+ million only has 28 'professional' teams, it's no surprise that whatever form the second tier takes, it's gonna be pretty substantial.


Edit: I'm sure it used to be 28, but the NFL seems to now have 32. Point still stands tho'.

Eau Rouge

lost_in_thought wrote:

It sounds very stop-start, and relatively similar to Rugby League, aka stupid rugby.

So, they line up head to head at point X in the pitch, do all of each side have to be their side of point X?

So a little fellow can leg it down the side for a quarterback or kicker to boot/chuck it after him? And then he gets mullered by a bunch of fat blokes?

And the defence are basically trying to cut down the offence before a pass can be made?

What causes a turnover? Intercepted passes? Tackles? Knock-ons?

It doesn't sound like it demands a huge amount of fitness from some of the players.

Why do they wear such epic amounts of protection? Are they just wusses?

So many questions.

It's very stop-start, and often various players on both sides will sub in and out for each restart. College football spends less time stopped than the NFL games, and so is a little easier to watch.
Only some of them line up head to head. The runners tend not to, and the defence will have guys standing well behind covering any moves.
You can't catch a kicked ball and keep possesion. If your kicker kicks the ball and you get control of it, thats where the opposition will start from.
To stop play the guy with the ball has to touch the ground with somehting other than his feet, so he gets mullered. They wear protection because they still get some nasty injuries from all this even with the protection. Without it they would not last long.
The defense are trying to stop the guy with the ball by getting him onto the ground, or catch the ball instead of him if it's thrown to him.
Turnovers are caused by the attackng team kicking the ball, the attacking team not making 10 yards in their 4 goes, or the defensive team catching the ball on a throw or a fumble.
The big guys lineing up next to each other maybe don't need to be fit, but the guys running, and the backs marking them, are usually seriously fast sprinters. It's a sprinters game more than endurance though.

DonDaddyD

What's a "sack"?

Oddjob62

DonDaddyD wrote:

What's a "sack"?

When the QB is tacked behind the line of scrimmage.

Cheshley

A lot of the stop/starting in NFL games is because of the TV coverage and they stop the game during commercial breaks. We were at the Wembley game a couple of years back and couldn't understand what was going off until some American guy sitting behind us explained that there was nothing happening on the pitch because CBS were at commercials.

Clever Pun

Oddjob62 wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

What's a "sack"?

When the QB is tacked behind the line of scrimmage.

Blitz ftw

I played a couple of times as a kid... mainly to destroy the QB

Eau Rouge

DonDaddyD wrote:

What's a "sack"?

When the QuarterBack has the ball and is tacked and hits the ground, which stops play just as it does when any other player is tacked and hits the ground. The QB though has taken the ball a few feet back from where it started and most probably taken another 10 steps backwards from there to try and find a pass to throw, so the next restart his team will have all that ground to make up as well as whatever they previously had, and one less "down" to do it in.

I didn't get the college thing for a while until I watched some games. It's way better to watch for one thing, more things happen and there are less stops. In a lot of places the college team will be the biggest team for many miles, and it is essentially just one step down from the NFL. They can be large money spinners for some colleges. In other cases the college team is all but ignored in favour of a local NFL franchise or because they just aren't any good.
Think of it as being more like the Coca-Cola Championship in football rather than Manchester Uni vs Bath Uni.

Agent57

Oh my God, the quarterback is toast!

Wish I'd had a team near me when younger. I'm a bit old for it now (41). Up until last year or so, a friend of mine played for a local team (Lancashire Wolverines). But his knees are screwed so he can't play any more. Still coaches the Wolverines and Chorley Buccaneers though.

I still have my London Monarchs T-shirt.

Oddjob62

Here is a good reason for padding.

In rugby if you are chasing the guy with the ball, unless somone blatently cheats you are not going to get hit.

In Amfoot however....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yD-6mflD_WA

greg66_tri_v2.0

The sack is most spectacular when the QB doesn't see it coming.

Imagine from the line of scrimmage, you're the QB. The ball is snapped back to you and you retreat 15 feet. As you do, your defensive line "bends" around you into a horse-shoe shape. So far so good.

The play that's been called requires you to throw long and to the left - between 10 and 11 o'clock. However, the defensive lineman on the right hand end of the horseshoe has let his man slip.

You're standing, looking left, waiting for your receiver to appear free so you can let rip the pass, and POW! out of nowhere, and well outside your field of vision on your right, a 280lb gorilla charges you and grinds you into the astro-dirt.

Clever Pun

DDD, Lit I do suggest you watch a bit of rugby league, it's quite akin to american footy (as you mentioned lit) and can be really exciting.. again it's just a case of getting into how the tactics work

Oddjob62

DDD

I'm sure you'll find this game more interesting

http://lingeriefootballleague.sportscastlive.com/

cjcp

Greg66 wrote:

The sack is most spectacular when the QB doesn't see it coming.

E.g. Joe Montana getting clattered in, I think, the 1991 or 92 NFC Championship game against the NY Giants. Result = knackered shoulder (and I'm not sure he ever played again; certainly wasn't the same bloke). Was it Lawrence Taylor who was the sackor?

Oddjob62

cjcp wrote:

Was it Lawrence Taylor who was the sackor?

Strange... was just watching this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NLRrjtmBno

lost_in_thought

Oddjob62 wrote:

Here is a good reason for padding.

In rugby if you are chasing the guy with the ball, unless somone blatently cheats you are not going to get hit.

In Amfoot however....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yD-6mflD_WA

So people are allowed to tackle you if you don't have the ball? Are there rules to prevent random fights breaking out?

lost_in_thought

Clever Pun wrote:

DDD, Lit I do suggest you watch a bit of rugby league, it's quite akin to american footy (as you mentioned lit) and can be really exciting.. again it's just a case of getting into how the tactics work

I've watched it, even played a bit of it. Just plain not as good as Union, or 'proper rugby' as it's so rightly called...

DonDaddyD

I have issues with guys of anykind running into me for the purpose of taking me down.

oscarbudgie

Agent57 wrote:

Oh my God, the quarterback is toast!

I can't believe I had to look that up! Nice one
Personally I find the existence american football, basketball and baseball three excellent reasons to like living in Britain....
The Tour of Quatar seems to be over before it started

Oddjob62

lost_in_thought wrote:

So people are allowed to tackle you if you don't have the ball? Are there rules to prevent random fights breaking out?

Not tackle... block. You can't grab them or wrap your arms round them.