andre greipel

le_patron

dennisn wrote:

pedro118118 wrote:

dennisn - by definition, winning the general classification of a major stage race = a multi-dimensional rider - capable of being very good on the flat, in the hills and against the clock. Therefore, your reference to multiple GC wins in Grand Tours is simply ridiculous.

In terms of classics? Well, I would suggest someone like Leif Hoste is as equally one-dimensional as Greipel or Cav.

What really gets me is that people come on here and talk down this or that rider for this or that reason, yet they themselves have never, repeat never, I say again never, ever come even close to riding in a Pro race. How zero dimensional is that. They're like movie critics. Never made a movie in their life yet claim to know all about how to do it and what people should see. Just like all the fat slob "fans" who sit on the sidelines swilling beer and complaining about how "their" team is losing and all the time claiming to know exactly how to win. Yet they, more than likely, have never set foot on a playing field.

c'mon Dennis...remember where we got to...I was going to quote you next time you started this 'what are you discussing cycling for' line again.

conceptual_primate

dennisn wrote:

I would guess that this guy goes a long way in proving that weight training will help your cycling. Seems to be a few people on this site that think, for whatever resaon, that weight training will not help you. Hmmmmmmm, let's see now. Pro rider - check, pro race winner - check, weight trainer - check. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, what might that mean?

dennisn wrote:

What really gets me is that people come on here and talk down this or that rider for this or that reason, yet they themselves have never, repeat never, I say again never, ever come even close to riding in a Pro race. How zero dimensional is that. They're like movie critics. Never made a movie in their life yet claim to know all about how to do it and what people should see. Just like all the fat slob "fans" who sit on the sidelines swilling beer and complaining about how "their" team is losing and all the time claiming to know exactly how to win. Yet they, more than likely, have never set foot on a playing field.

So the only valid opinions on this forum are from current or ex pro-racers? Ergo, what qualifies you to have an opinion on weight training? ... just out of curiosity?

dennisn

le patron wrote:

dennisn wrote:

pedro118118 wrote:

dennisn - by definition, winning the general classification of a major stage race = a multi-dimensional rider - capable of being very good on the flat, in the hills and against the clock. Therefore, your reference to multiple GC wins in Grand Tours is simply ridiculous.

In terms of classics? Well, I would suggest someone like Leif Hoste is as equally one-dimensional as Greipel or Cav.

What really gets me is that people come on here and talk down this or that rider for this or that reason, yet they themselves have never, repeat never, I say again never, ever come even close to riding in a Pro race. How zero dimensional is that. They're like movie critics. Never made a movie in their life yet claim to know all about how to do it and what people should see. Just like all the fat slob "fans" who sit on the sidelines swilling beer and complaining about how "their" team is losing and all the time claiming to know exactly how to win. Yet they, more than likely, have never set foot on a playing field.

c'mon Dennis...remember where we got to...I was going to quote you next time you started this 'what are you discussing cycling for' line again.

I know what you're saying. It's just that it really p*sses me off when people who don't play the game are critical of those who are able and out there doing it. It's sort of a "who the h*ll do you think you are?" type of thing with me. You're not good enough to be carrying water bottles for these guys yet you have to nerve to .................

dennisn

conceptual_primate wrote:

dennisn wrote:

I would guess that this guy goes a long way in proving that weight training will help your cycling. Seems to be a few people on this site that think, for whatever resaon, that weight training will not help you. Hmmmmmmm, let's see now. Pro rider - check, pro race winner - check, weight trainer - check. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, what might that mean?

dennisn wrote:

What really gets me is that people come on here and talk down this or that rider for this or that reason, yet they themselves have never, repeat never, I say again never, ever come even close to riding in a Pro race. How zero dimensional is that. They're like movie critics. Never made a movie in their life yet claim to know all about how to do it and what people should see. Just like all the fat slob "fans" who sit on the sidelines swilling beer and complaining about how "their" team is losing and all the time claiming to know exactly how to win. Yet they, more than likely, have never set foot on a playing field.

So the only valid opinions on this forum are from current or ex pro-racers? Ergo, what qualifies you to have an opinion on weight training? ... just out of curiosity?

Never said anyone couldn't have an opinion. But if I think they stink I'm gonna let ya know.

dennisn

pedro118118 wrote:

dennisn - by definition, winning the general classification of a major stage race = a multi-dimensional rider - capable of being very good on the flat, in the hills and against the clock. Therefore, your reference to multiple GC wins in Grand Tours is simply ridiculous.

I didn't catch what dictionary you got that from???

Garz

dennisn wrote:

I would guess that this guy goes a long way in proving that weight training will help your cycling. Seems to be a few people on this site that think, for whatever resaon, that weight training will not help you. Hmmmmmmm, let's see now. Pro rider - check, pro race winner - check, weight trainer - check. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, what might that mean?

Sounds like someone wants to believe that their weight training is justified.. :roll:

On another note just 'cos he wins a bunch sprint with regard to the best lead out train, you wont see him winning KotM or a hilly climb anytime soon carrying all that beef. :P

emadden

dennisn wrote:

By this one dimensional reasoning I guess ... Sean Kelly(only won classics)? .....t????
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Oh my God

dennisn

Garz wrote:

dennisn wrote:

I would guess that this guy goes a long way in proving that weight training will help your cycling. Seems to be a few people on this site that think, for whatever resaon, that weight training will not help you. Hmmmmmmm, let's see now. Pro rider - check, pro race winner - check, weight trainer - check. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, what might that mean?

Sounds like someone wants to believe that their weight training is justified.. :roll:

On another note just 'cos he wins a bunch sprint with regard to the best lead out train, you wont see him winning KotM or a hilly climb anytime soon carrying all that beef. :P

Not really trying to justify anything. Just saying that there seem to be people on this site
who think that weight training is cr*p. Yet to look at the cycling magazines it seems that there is always a picture or two of a pro cyclist lifting weights. Hincapie, LA, Simeoni, to name a few. I'm not one way or another about whether someone lifts or not. Up to them.
But to put it down as, nothing worthwhile, to me, seems really short sighted. I sort of get the impression the some people think that if they lift weights they will end up looking like Arnold, which to me is like saying if I ride a bike around I'll be like Eddy or Sean. A bit more to it than that.
As for winning bunch sprints. Are you saying that he is not worthy because that's all he's done, so far? He's supposed to win it all to satisfy your cravings for whatever?
He's wining races on the PRO TOUR, yet people who have done nothing more than stand by the side of the road as he came past see fit to demand more and criticize him because he hasn't won "everything".

afx237vi

PinkBianchi wrote:

I don't think dennisn meant it was a personal attack on Greipel, but more the (mainly) british mentality where you love riders/athletes who does good, and if they make a mistake or don't do so well they're suddenly total failures etc. They don't have support no matter how well they do, but only if they do well...

But I might be wrong...

Seriously, this forum is utterly bizarre at times. Who has even hinted that Greipel, or any rider for that matter, is a total failure?

Every rider who makes it as a pro has my respect. Everyone here talks about cycling because they like it, but it is literally impossible to talk about cycling for the length of time we do with mentioning some negative aspects (whether they're about races, riders, teams, whatever).

If people think Greipel is being slated because I called him one-dimensional, then I really think their perspective is a little wonky.

london-red

Neither let us forget that the man on the terraces who's never played, or the guy on this forum who has never won a pro tour race still have the right to an opinion. At the end of the day, we're the ones that pay for professional sport and that definitely gives us the right to sit down with a pint (even if it is virtual) and call a pro rider one dimensional.

dennisn

London-Red wrote:

Neither let us forget that the man on the terraces who's never played, or the guy on this forum who has never won a pro tour race still have the right to an opinion. At the end of the day, we're the ones that pay for professional sport and that definitely gives us the right to sit down with a pint (even if it is virtual) and call a pro rider one dimensional.

Never implied that anyone couldn't have an opinion. It's just that when people say "unflattering"(for lack of a better word) things about celebrities or whomever that they shouldn't take offence to someone saying "unflattering" things about them. If you "knock" people, well, I'm gonna "knock" you. Just the way I am. And I've been slammed for it many times.

The Prodigy

Who was knocking Griepel? What the hell are you talking about Dennis.

All I can see is a Griepel appreciation thread.

He's a one dimensional rider........ thats not knocking him, at the moment its fact. He only wins flat sprint stages.

cal_stewart

The Prodigy wrote:

Who was knocking Griepel? What the hell are you talking about Dennis.

All I can see is a Griepel appreciation thread.

He's a one dimensional rider........ thats not knocking him, at the moment its fact. He only wins flat sprint stages.

+1

blazing_saddles

In fact, Dennis seems to have managed to turn a thread about a German, into a thread about An American who isn't Lance Armstrong.

Bizarre is the word.

dennisn

Blazing Saddles wrote:

In fact, Dennis seems to have managed to turn a thread about a German, into a thread about An American who isn't Lance Armstrong.

Bizarre is the word.

I will admit to taking this a bit too far, but I do believe that "afx371vi"'s post about him being "one dimensional" was not intended as a compliment. Anyway that's how all this started.

afx237vi

dennisn wrote:

Blazing Saddles wrote:

In fact, Dennis seems to have managed to turn a thread about a German, into a thread about An American who isn't Lance Armstrong.

Bizarre is the word.

I will admit to taking this a bit too far, but I do believe that "afx371vi"'s post about him being "one dimensional" was not intended as a compliment. Anyway that's how all this started.

Again, you missed the bit where I wrote "great at what he does". Fact is, sprinters don't need to be multi-dimensional. They're paid to win long, flat stages, not dance up hills.

Greipel's muscular physique works for him, but it's not going to work for a climber, a classics rider or a normal domestique who is expected to do a bit of everything. That was my point. Whether you think that is a slight on Greipel is entirely up to you, but it certainly wasn't intended as one.

oldwelshman

Pross wrote:

How long will he be prepared to stay in Cav's shadow there though? Is he better taking advantage of the well drilled machine and picking up wins when Cav isn't about or going somewhere else and being top dog? Maybe staying put will give him top dog status if Cav goes to Sky?

As long as he is in his wheel and not fast enough to beat him

thamacdaddy

YEah I agree. It's not like he is in cav's shadow because of some team orders when he is actually faster it's because when the team orders were for cav to be his lead out man (remember greipel was their star sprinter) they worked out cav was faster.

I guess we will get to see at the worlds this year the two go head to head, though it might then be commented who has the better leadout train.

moray_gub

The Prodigy wrote:

Who was knocking Griepel? What the hell are you talking about Dennis.

All I can see is a Griepel appreciation thread.

He's a one dimensional rider........ thats not knocking him, at the moment its fact. He only wins flat sprint stages.

I suspect a few riders wish they could "only win flat sprint stages"

frenchfighter

shockedsoshocked

Jesus. Those legs.

pontarlier_pete

ShockedSoShocked wrote:

Jesus. Those legs.

Is he related to Ivan Drago?

pedro118118

Personally, I find Ivan Drago a little one-dimensional.

Don't get me wrong, he's good at what he does. Sure he's big, powerful and very fit, but only tends to excel in exhibition bouts against 'has-been' champions, who dance to James Brown, where he can apply his sole approach of 'death from above'.

When he comes up against stiffer competion, such as the Italian Stallion, he finds it tough going. Like hitting a price of Iron.

Then again, if he can change. And Rocky can change. And the audience can change. We can all change.

daveclow

Cal_Stewart wrote:

The Prodigy wrote:

Who was knocking Griepel? What the hell are you talking about Dennis.

All I can see is a Griepel appreciation thread.

He's a one dimensional rider........ thats not knocking him, at the moment its fact. He only wins flat sprint stages.

+1

make that +2

The Prodigy

Moray Gub wrote:

The Prodigy wrote:

Who was knocking Griepel? What the hell are you talking about Dennis.

All I can see is a Griepel appreciation thread.

He's a one dimensional rider........ thats not knocking him, at the moment its fact. He only wins flat sprint stages.

I suspect a few riders wish they could "only win flat sprint stages"

Obviously. Your point is?

prawny

PinkBianchi wrote:

I don't think dennisn meant it was a personal attack on Greipel, but more the (mainly) british mentality where you love riders/athletes who does good, and if they make a mistake or don't do so well they're suddenly total failures etc. They don't have support no matter how well they do, but only if they do well...

But I might be wrong...

You are us Brits only support the Plucky UnderdogTM

zippypablo

dennisn wrote:

London-Red wrote:

Neither let us forget that the man on the terraces who's never played, or the guy on this forum who has never won a pro tour race still have the right to an opinion. At the end of the day, we're the ones that pay for professional sport and that definitely gives us the right to sit down with a pint (even if it is virtual) and call a pro rider one dimensional.

Never implied that anyone couldn't have an opinion. It's just that when people say "unflattering"(for lack of a better word) things about celebrities or whomever that they shouldn't take offence to someone saying "unflattering" things about them. If you "knock" people, well, I'm gonna "knock" you. Just the way I am. And I've been slammed for it many times.

so if someone says something unflattering about a celebrity then you'll "knock" them? No wonder you get slammed. What's that all about?

redddraggon

I wish I ride a bike as well as Griepel. He's still one dimensional though.

dulldave

It does get on my nerves when people can't discuss a rider's weaknesses (or day I say criticise them) without someone else coming along telling them that they're nowhere near as good a cyclist.

If we were as good we'd be out doing it, not talking about it here. Do these people write into newspapers telling the journalists that they have no right to criticise a performance unless they could do better? It really is quite a pathetic argument.

Let's just all take it for granted that with the exception of Robert Millar, nobody on this forum is or was as good as anyone we're talking about.

Can we now move on?

Moomaloid

pedro118118 wrote:

Personally, I find Ivan Drago a little one-dimensional.

Don't get me wrong, he's good at what he does. Sure he's big, powerful and very fit, but only tends to excel in exhibition bouts against 'has-been' champions, who dance to James Brown, where he can apply his sole approach of 'death from above'.

When he comes up against stiffer competion, such as the Italian Stallion, he finds it tough going. Like hitting a price of Iron.

Then again, if he can change. And Rocky can change. And the audience can change. We can all change.

Genius!! Best post of the year so far!