Golden Cheatah

chrisw12

I know people have mentioned it in threads but it has no topic started on it so...

Just downloaded this to take a look and it has some nice features (and it's free)

At first glance it seems very good at analysing an individual ride, seemed to give more stuff than wko and the graphs look a lot nicer. It also has quadrant analysis (for free) which means I'm going to have to read about it :twisted:

Don't know if it's going to be better than wko for analysis over a time period as I'm pretty addicted to the wko metrics (golden ch seems to be offering something SIMILAR.)

Anyway take a look. http://goldencheetah.org/

jibberjim

There's a new version available shortly which does a lot more, including a PMC and more. Like lots of open source software you can compile it yourself to see the result, or if you look on the mailing list see advance builds getting advertised by people - you do of course risk all sorts of bugs then though.

lloydy75

I've tried this on my MacBook a few times and it always crashes, wonder if the new version is any better?

liversedge

Hey Chris,

Thanks for looking, like Jim says the new release is due at the tail end of this week/next week and will include support for intervals, a PMC and a 3d chart for analysing data in all sorts of ways. It will also include support for turning any ANT+ power meter into a Computrainer, and Computrainer support too, which is really quite exciting (i.e. realtime feedback and recording on the turbo via ANT+ and a USB stick plugged into your PC).

I've been contributing to the project for a little while now and currently developing the long term charts for analysing performance over time rather than just a ride by ride basis. We're also working on internet racing via that ANT+/Computrainer support.

Some folks are working on an Aerolab for calculating Cda etc using Virtual Elevation and some very complicated maths.

It is being developed aggressively at the moment and worth looking at the mailing lists....

Thanks for the plug!

Mark

liversedge

lloydy75 wrote:

I've tried this on my MacBook a few times and it always crashes, wonder if the new version is any better?

Ya! that was my impression too when I got into Golden Cheetah, if you haven't looked for a while it is definitely worth another go. There has been quite a blitz on those kind of bugs over the last few months.

I'd say wait till 1.3 comes out and give it a go!

chrisw12

Looks like some great things on the way.

I've had a play with Alex's spreadsheet with ve and it really could be a very useful tool.

Keep up the great work then guys.

hopper1

I'm just beginning to scratch at the surface of WKO+, but this Golden Cheatah seems to have more evaluation points and screens, or perhaps I've just found them easier in this format!
Looks like it may well keep me busy when I get home...

amaferanga

I downloaded this and uploaded a turbo session recorded on my FR310 (HR + cadence only). Unfortunately it was garbage. My average speed was allegedly 65mph and I was allegedly only active for a fraction of the 46min session. Garmin TC and training peaks got it right though. My suspicion is that it may be related to smart recording (which can't currently be disabled on the 310xt though fortunately power is always recorded at 1s intervals).

I hope it will work with my 310xt when I start recording power as it does look very useful and intuitive.

amaferanga

I downloaded this and uploaded a turbo session recorded on my FR310 (HR + cadence only). Unfortunately it was garbage. My average speed was allegedly 65mph and I was allegedly only active for a fraction of the 46min session. Garmin TC and training peaks got it right though. My suspicion is that it may be related to smart recording (which can't currently be disabled on the 310xt though fortunately power is always recorded at 1s intervals).

I hope it will work with my 310xt when I start recording power as it does look very useful and intuitive.

EDIT: Just to clarify - the upload to GC was preceded by downloading the session from my device to Garmin TC and then saving as .tcx before uploading to GC. I've tried another session with similar results.

jibberjim

amaferanga wrote:

I downloaded this and uploaded a turbo session recorded on my FR310 (HR + cadence only).

Not related to smart recording, but almost certainly to the fact you only had HR and Cadence, this wasn't handled well - it may be handled better in the current release candidate, although if you had some distance info, it suggests you may have had some places where it did get a GPS signal.

Posting the file to the GoldenCheetah mailing list will likely help peoople debug!

amaferanga

jibberjim wrote:

amaferanga wrote:

I downloaded this and uploaded a turbo session recorded on my FR310 (HR + cadence only).

Not related to smart recording, but almost certainly to the fact you only had HR and Cadence, this wasn't handled well - it may be handled better in the current release candidate, although if you had some distance info, it suggests you may have had some places where it did get a GPS signal.

Posting the file to the GoldenCheetah mailing list will likely help peoople debug!

The distance is from the GSC10 sensor (GPS was definitely disabled). Its a little weird in GC as the graphs look identical to TC and TP, but the summary page is confused. The Distance and Workout Time are correct in the Totals list, but the Time Riding is typically ~1/3 of the Workout Time when it should be the same (I've uploaded a few workouts now). In the Averages list the Speed is way too high - its using the Distance divided by the Time Riding, which as I've said is wrong.

In the intervals list the Duration and Distance are wrong, but the Avg Speed is right.

It's confusing as all the correct information is actually there, but there's the other random stuff as well. Are there tags in the .tcx that are perhaps confusing GC?

I'll have a go posting this to the GC mailing list when I get a minute. Thanks Jim.

amaferanga

The latest release seems to have sorted it

lloydy75

I've just reinstalled Golden Cheetah on my MacBook and I can't work out the quick way to import PowerTap data from my Garmin 705 When I click import from device the 705 does not appear and if I try import from file it stalls at stage 3 of 4.

Please can anyone help?

Cheers

RChung

lloydy75 wrote:

can anyone help?

http://groups.google.com/group/golden-cheetah-users

doyler78

liversedge wrote:

Hey Chris,

Thanks for looking, like Jim says the new release is due at the tail end of this week/next week and will include support for intervals, a PMC and a 3d chart for analysing data in all sorts of ways. It will also include support for turning any ANT+ power meter into a Computrainer, and Computrainer support too, which is really quite exciting (i.e. realtime feedback and recording on the turbo via ANT+ and a USB stick plugged into your PC).

I've been contributing to the project for a little while now and currently developing the long term charts for analysing performance over time rather than just a ride by ride basis. We're also working on internet racing via that ANT+/Computrainer support.

Some folks are working on an Aerolab for calculating Cda etc using Virtual Elevation and some very complicated maths.

It is being developed aggressively at the moment and worth looking at the mailing lists....

Thanks for the plug!

Mark

Downloaded version 1.2 a couple of weeks ago when I was recovering from flu and bored and was having a little play about with it. Looks really great.

Noticed this thread and was struck by the bit about the Ant+ stick as I think that could prove really, really useful so last night I downloaded version 1.3 RC1 and wow you all have been very busy as there is a great deal of new functionality in this version if it all works and I can now see where this Ant+ stick could be used.

Am I right in thinking that a gamin ant+ stick plus my ant+ powertap could be used in combo and this would be displayed on my computer screen via this application? I ask because I have no other reason to spend my money on the usb stick? Is this right?

chrisw12

I'm excited about the ant+ stuff as well and second what Doyler said. i think it's going to be really good but I know it's going to end up costing me more money and getting more distracted from actually racing and training. :twisted:

I've played with the quad analysis stuff and I'd now class myself as an expert in the field :roll: It's nice but for a tester who rides one pace I don't know how useful it's going to be.

I've also played with the aero lab stuff and I think this is going to be great in the summer when it's been tidied up a bit and the weather gets a bit nicer. really looking forward to playing with this.

I'm going to stick with wko for all the performance management stuff though as that's where all my data is and it's what I'm used to. I don't want to learn another language, (xpower and all that).

jibberjim

doyler78 wrote:

Am I right in thinking that a gamin ant+ stick plus my ant+ powertap could be used in combo and this would be displayed on my computer screen via this application? I ask because I have no other reason to spend my money on the usb stick? Is this right?

Yes, although it's currently also tied to QUARQD to provide the decoding from ANT+ messages to power, and that only works well on linux - I run it on windows via Sun VirtualBox and a small ubuntu, but you're very much not going to be doing that unless you're particularly mad. So whilst I'd say yes you can, I'd also say maybe not quite yet unless you're willing to do a bit of work.

The work to get an open-source ANT+ interpreter is ongoing, Cinqo messages are fully decoded, but as yet SRM and PowerTap are not. I care very much about getting the PowerTap decoding done as I need it for GoldenEmbed, but I've no idea how long it may take me, reverse engineering the algorithm isn't that easy at least for me (so big applause to Paul who managed to do cinqo!)

There are other ANT sticks than the Garmin one (SparkFun in the US sell one for 35 USD) but I don't know of any cheaper UK suppliers.

doyler78

jibberjim wrote:

doyler78 wrote:

Am I right in thinking that a gamin ant+ stick plus my ant+ powertap could be used in combo and this would be displayed on my computer screen via this application? I ask because I have no other reason to spend my money on the usb stick? Is this right?

Yes, although it's currently also tied to QUARQD to provide the decoding from ANT+ messages to power, and that only works well on linux - I run it on windows via Sun VirtualBox and a small ubuntu, but you're very much not going to be doing that unless you're particularly mad. So whilst I'd say yes you can, I'd also say maybe not quite yet unless you're willing to do a bit of work.

The work to get an open-source ANT+ interpreter is ongoing, Cinqo messages are fully decoded, but as yet SRM and PowerTap are not. I care very much about getting the PowerTap decoding done as I need it for GoldenEmbed, but I've no idea how long it may take me, reverse engineering the algorithm isn't that easy at least for me (so big applause to Paul who managed to do cinqo!)

There are other ANT sticks than the Garmin one (SparkFun in the US sell one for 35 USD) but I don't know of any cheaper UK suppliers.

Thanks Jim. All sounds very promising.

I was looking at the SparkFun ones but they are bare boards so wouldn't be for me. As regards the Garmin ANT+ usb sticks - do they need to decoded too or has that already been done?

As for linux - well I have it installed on my spare pc (Ubuntu) which I use as a mail server mainly though I have installed GC on it however I have mainly used the Windows build as it is easier to look at it and WKO+ together not that I have done much of that. Having said that it doesn't mean I can use linux. I usually have to google most things I want to do :oops:

Ah well will be interesting to see if the pace of development is sustained.

Should have been version 2.0 and not 1.3 with the number changes and feature additions that in that RC at least.

Great job you are all doing.

jibberjim

doyler78 wrote:

I was looking at the SparkFun ones but they are bare boards so wouldn't be for me. As regards the Garmin ANT+ usb sticks - do they need to decoded too or has that already been done?

The Sparkfun ones just don't have a case, no actual soldering or anything is needed... But yeah, the Garmin ANT stick works fine, although you may need to install generic ANT drivers instead of just the garmin ones.

doyler78 wrote:

Great job you are all doing.

I've done no work on GC! Although I have started looking at GoldenEmbed.

doyler78

Jim,

The GoldenEmbed bit sort of went over me. I joined the group just to see what it was all about but only got round to reading this evening.

Are you all trying to build an ant+ cycle computer possibly with gps and altimeter and have it ready by March - woow and good luck to all. It sounds like a great project.

jibberjim

doyler78 wrote:

Are you all trying to build an ant+ cycle computer possibly with gps and altimeter and have it ready by March - woow and good luck to all. It sounds like a great project.

Well the first goal is to record HR and Power ANT+ messages, which all works fine. Next is to parse it into raw data, and that works for HR and Cinqo power, SRM power is decoded so it's just PowerTap ready.

Adding in GPS/Altimeter/weather will likely come in later yes, it's not difficult, as long as there's enough processing power to do it all real time. The difficult things come when you need to process it on the actually board for a display, a display isn't that hard either. The biggest problem is probably finding a nice enclosure.

The march isn't really a deadline, that's just when Justin will be able to ride outside again

lloydy75

I've downloaded the new version, and import from the 705 as external disk and it works a treat.

One question, if there is a quick answer, what's the difference between the power readings, in averages and Metrics xPower?

Cheers

amaferanga

lloydy75 wrote:

One question, if there is a quick answer, what's the difference between the power readings, in averages and Metrics xPower?

This might answer your question.