How good can you be training 9 hours a week?

Gav888

chrisw12 wrote:

Quite a few of you are talking about sportives and races which I presume to mean road racing but please consider timetrialling as well.

TT's can give you some honest targets and once you get into it can be very rewarding. Don't just limit yourself to the run on the mill club 10's. Long distance tt's are great 'fun', 100's and 12hrs have got to be more rewarding than doing an overpriced sportive, wheel sucking a group of other people.

I've nothing against sportives, just there's imho a lot more that tt's can maybe offer. Just a thought.

I wouldnt rule out TT's and would like to try a few. To be honest I love watching them on TV but feel I wouldnt do that well without a proper TT bike and all the gear... still, I guess its more about beating yourself rather than others.....

simon t

[
I wouldnt rule out TT's and would like to try a few. To be honest I love watching them on TV but feel I wouldnt do that well without a proper TT bike and all the gear... still, I guess its more about beating yourself rather than others.....[/quote]


i've been beaten by guys on road bikes before.you can get quite a good position on a roadbike with a £30 set of tri bars

Gav888

Im not trying to question peoples advise here and all advise is great as it is helping me to understand my training to make the best gains, but im trying to gain an understanding of LT training and ive done some more research into this and found the below on this website - http://www.cptips.com/exphys.htm#measures

Lactate Threshhold. Recent work has focused on the blood lactate threshold (LT) as a reflection of an individual's level of training. The lactate threshold is that % of VO2 max. at which the cardiovascular system can no longer provide adequate oxygen for all the exercising muscle cells and lactic acid starts to accumulate in those muscle cells (and subsequently in the blood as well). At high levels of activity (but below 100% VO@max), there are always a few muscle cells (not entire muscles, but a small number of cells within those muscles) that are relatively deficient in oxygen and thus producing lactic acid. But this lactic acid is quickly metabolized by other cells that are still operating on an aerobic level. At some point, however, the balance between production of lactic acid and its removal shifts towards accumulation. This point is the LT. It is usually slightly below 100% VO2 max., and will improve with training (move closer to 100% VO2max). Those with an increased LT not only experience less physical deterioration in muscle cell performance for any level of %VO2max, but also use less glycogen for ATP production at any level of performance. Thus an improvement in LT allows the individual to perform at maximal levels for a longer period of time before running out of adequate energy (glycogen) stores.

This is what I was referring to when I mentioned raising your LTHR.

Alex_Simmons/RST

NapoleonD wrote:

Because it knackers you out loads so you can't do back to
back days and doesn't work on your VO2 max.

Yes it does, just not to the same degree that a block of work focused on efforts that induce VO2max would.

Most relevant physiological adaptations are induced to some degree by riding at levels above recovery levels.

Alex_Simmons/RST

Gav888 wrote:

This is what I was referring to when I mentioned raising your LTHR.

That describes an increase in power (or O2 use) at LT, not a change in the heart rate at LT.

Alex_Simmons/RST

A client of mine set a new Masters World Hour record this year (48.317km). His main training in the 6 months before the race specific prep phase averaged a bit over 8 hours per week.

Before completing the October 2009 103-mile Levi Leipheimer Grannfondo with 9000' of climbing in a tick over 6 hours, my longest ride since getting back on the bike was 3 hours.

Gav888

Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:

Gav888 wrote:

This is what I was referring to when I mentioned raising your LTHR.

That describes an increase in power (or O2 use) at LT, not a change in the heart rate at LT.

So this is increasing your lactate threshold and not your LTHR, my mistake. Thanks for clarifying Alex.

So your HR remains the same as do the LTHR zones but with the correct level of intensity you can increase your lactate threshold.

What im struggling to get my head around is doing 2 x 20 intervals for example and using a hrm with LT zones such as Joe Friel's, wont you get 'used' do doing these intervals as you get stronger and stop making gains? Does your hr get lower as you get fitter thus keeping your hr in the correct zone keeps the intensity high so your always making gains (until you reach your genetic potential)?

Could you expand a bit more about training intensity and how that reflects in gains in performance. Using LTHR Zones would be ideal.....

SBezza

With the intervals, your HR zone will be the same, just that you will go at a faster pace/output greater power. If you have no way of measuring the power output, you can do it via speed (if on a turbo). Your speed for the intervals will increase as you get fitter/stronger.

Alex can probably explain in better terms however.

Infamous

Gav888 wrote:

Ive uploaded my plan here - http://rapidshare.com/files/308513799/T ... 2.xls.html

Im sure some of you will slag this off, but its my first go at creating a yearly plan.....

I'm no expert, but it may be a little too structured. I know I couldn't keep to something like that. There also isn't a lot of progression, the first week in january is not much different to a week in summer. Have a look at your local club 10s and put them in your diary, great training and you'll be sick of 2x20 by the time they start. Are all the midweek sessions done on a turbo?

You might as well start the plan in december 09 too, or even next week. Plus no ride on christmas? You need a minimum of 4 hours on xmas, to get away from family etc.

Gav888

SBezza wrote:

With the intervals, your HR zone will be the same, just that you will go at a faster pace/output greater power. If you have no way of measuring the power output, you can do it via speed (if on a turbo). Your speed for the intervals will increase as you get fitter/stronger.

Alex can probably explain in better terms however.

HRM only, but what you have written helps. So if I keep training using the zones, my LTHR remains the same but the way I can tell im getting fitter is my speed increases on my turbo for the same level or effort. Sorry some of these questions are thick but I was looking at adjusting the HRM to keep the levels correct and intensity correct. Didnt think of looking at the speed on the turbo.....

Anyway, back on subject, Infamous - thanks for looking at the schedule, its my first attempt so I wasnt 100% what to do. You read alot about 2 x 20 etc are really good so ive tried to include them in the plan. The weekday workouts are turbo unless I can get out on the road, which at this time of year is less and less. Weekend ride is out unless its chucking it down.

How do you add progression to a training plan as that is why I started to question my training?

disgruntledgoat

Have e-mailed you re: plan Gav.

Infamous

Gav888 wrote:

Anyway, back on subject, Infamous - thanks for looking at the schedule, its my first attempt so I wasnt 100% what to do. You read alot about 2 x 20 etc are really good so ive tried to include them in the plan. The weekday workouts are turbo unless I can get out on the road, which at this time of year is less and less. Weekend ride is out unless its chucking it down.

I don't like to plan too far ahead, you might get a week into the plan and realise that it's too hard/easy/boring. Keep it varied, don't have 2x20 every thursday, swap the rides around in the week.

Don't use the HRM as a coach, use it as a reference point.

inseine

[/quote]I don't like to plan too far ahead, you might get a week into the plan and realise that it's too hard/easy/boring. Keep it varied, don't have 2x20 every thursday, swap the rides around in the week.

Totally agree. It's got to be fun, but I like to have a general idea of what i'm aiming for or I'd end up going too hard now just because i can. If you do the same sort of training all year round you will not see the same improvements, but that's OK if you don't have specific goals.

Damien_KW

Don't forget that 'fitness' is not the whole story with road racing. If you haven't already, join a club or group and get plenty of experience riding in a bunch. Practice your bike handling skills, sprinting, and find a good chain gang to practice riding in a fast paceline.

Don't just sit on the turbo whenever it's cold or wet outside - get used to riding in bad conditions, because races don't always take place in warm sunny weather.

You can prepare yourself up to a point for your first season, but you'll gain far more from a few months of racing - both in terms of fitness and racing know-how - than you ever will from training.

If you have some sort of winter series of races happening near you try to do the first one you can - don't worry about being 'ready' or not (there is absolutely no shame in getting dropped, lapped, etc!). The sooner you get a feel for the demands and requirements of racing the better.

Good luck!

Gav888

Thanks for all the advise guys.