Turbo Training for Beginners - a NapD guide

ddraver

I'm about to leave to go homw and do Downward Spiral - first Turbo session this winter (and first ride for a while).

If I don't come back on here by 7/8 and say I ve done it, you are all to call me susan for ever!

Wrath Rob

2 updates from me. My fan arrived and it makes such a difference! By the time I complete Angels I used to be a sweaty, dripping, knackered mess. Now I'm just a partially sweaty, knackered mess. If you haven't got one, get one.

2nd, I've started using Trainerroad. For those of you not aware, it is a piece of software that uses the input from a ANT+ USB dongle to track HR, speed, cadence, power etc, has almost 200 workouts and then combines the ANT+ inputs to track you through the workout. If you know your FTP it can then tailor the workout to your power levels. You can even drag the Sufferfest videos into it and it will tell you what power/HR you should be targetting for each interval. It will also approximate your power from your turbo trainer speed. There's a whole thread on it over in the Training section. Suffice to say, its livened up my sessions massively, meaning you can watch a film with the workout laid over the top. Result!

napoleond

Tempted to give this trainer road malarkey a go, just need to buy the right dongle.
Which one is compatible with a Garmin 705?

Wrath Rob

I got this one, though there are others available. This works with my Garmin 800.

You'll need to install the Garmin ANT software first, then plug in the stick, then shut down the ANT software, then start Trainerroad, then go to the Devices tab in Trainerroad at which point it should recognise the stick, finally start pairing your devices. Note that if you use a power meter for speed and cadence you'll just need to pair the power meter. Don't do what I did and get stressed that it couldn't find them.

napoleond

Cheers, ordered!

ddraver

ddraver wrote:

I'm about to leave to go homw and do Downward Spiral - first Turbo session this winter (and first ride for a while).

If I don't come back on here by 7/8 and say I ve done it, you are all to call me susan for ever!

I am not Susan, I am, however, Knackered!!!

wardieboy

skybie wrote:

Wrath Rob wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

Of course! And they price match...

http://www.cyclestore.co.uk/rangeViewer ... goryID=121

I got my Tacx Sirrius (sp?) from Bike-Store.de. They were doing them around £50 cheaper than any of the UK retailers.

I have just brought one off ebay but the i can't get the remote control lever to move it's stuck between 9-10. Any ideas why, i might not have set it up right or it's broken

Same thing happened on mine, I think the resistance cable has been stepped on and has a kink in it. The lever on mine snapped when I tried to lower the setting, I got round this by forcing the lever against the corner of some brickwork to lower the setting down to 2-3 and then taping it into position with some insulation tape, it hasn't budged since. The only issue will be as I get fitter and want to increase resistance up a notch. You can buy spare cables for about £20 but I don't know how easy they are to fit. Does anyone have any experience in changing turbo resistance cables?

Nap - You won't regret getting hooked up to trainerroad, the training plans are good and being able to train with virtual power with very low expenditure gives you a good benchmark to measure against (not against others of course, as there are too many variables involved). I've found the sweetspot training to be particularly good, but it's anything but sweet!

napoleond

I have a powertap... Just want something to spice things up a bit!

ddraver

wardieboy wrote:

skybie wrote:

Wrath Rob wrote:

NapoleonD wrote:

Of course! And they price match...

http://www.cyclestore.co.uk/rangeViewer ... goryID=121

I got my Tacx Sirrius (sp?) from Bike-Store.de. They were doing them around £50 cheaper than any of the UK retailers.

I have just brought one off ebay but the i can't get the remote control lever to move it's stuck between 9-10. Any ideas why, i might not have set it up right or it's broken

Same thing happened on mine, I think the resistance cable has been stepped on and has a kink in it. The lever on mine snapped when I tried to lower the setting, I got round this by forcing the lever against the corner of some brickwork to lower the setting down to 2-3 and then taping it into position with some insulation tape, it hasn't budged since. The only issue will be as I get fitter and want to increase resistance up a notch. You can buy spare cables for about £20 but I don't know how easy they are to fit. Does anyone have any experience in changing turbo resistance cables?

Nap - You won't regret getting hooked up to trainerroad, the training plans are good and being able to train with virtual power with very low expenditure gives you a good benchmark to measure against (not against others of course, as there are too many variables involved). I've found the sweetspot training to be particularly good, but it's anything but sweet!

It does do weird stuff if you move it when its not set up, it can essentially reset itself while you ve left in on, say, 5. I can't remember what it is that caused the problem now, I discovered the answer in April then forgot about it over summer....typical!

ddraver

I need you all to threaten to call me Susan again for tonight...

petemadoc

What's the school of thought on hard turbo training in the winter?

I hear some people saying they leave it until early spring before then do hard intervals as there's no point doing them in the winter and you risk injury/sickness or overtraining.

My goals are to win some crits, improve in TTs and hill climbs and maybe do a road race if I get time. Currently do a 50+ mile weekend ride, at least 1 turbo session maybe 2 per week and take it easy riding to work each day.

dashik

I'd say it depends on your goals/needs.

I need to try and maintain/improve my fitness from a 49 year old overweight beginners position.

So for me it helps me lose weight and improve my performance on the days I am short of time or the weather is bad. I can do a decent session on the Turbo at home probably slightly longer than going for a ride knowing I won't have any problems with traffic or anything that would make me late for work.

As usual it's about what suits the individual

Wrath Rob

@Nap D (and anyone else): Here's an example of Trainerroad and Sufferfest combined. Suffice to say it hurt. You can clearly see that I need to change from 5s smoothing of the power curve (yellow trace) as it takes too long to climb, shoots over the level required (even if I'm actually at the right level), takes too long to fall and then dips too far under.

I'd highly recommend this to anyone who's got a turbo and the Sufferfest vids. It makes pacing sooo much easier. Last time I did Downward Spiral I went off way too hard and paid the price in the 2nd set. This time I was better paced. Net result was a more effective workout, e.g. my NP went from 217w to 253w. I'm sure my fitness hasn't improved by 36w in 3 weeks!

ddraver

I am Revolver'd out (but not Susan, Seriously BR spent all this money on a training site, they should have just had a facility to abuse people that didnt get their arse in to gear. That's way more effective!)

Rob - Is this something to use with Power or could it also be useful for the less rich?

Wrath Rob

ddraver wrote:

I am Revolver'd out (but not Susan, Seriously BR spent all this money on a training site, they should have just had a facility to abuse people that didnt get their ars* in to gear. That's way more effective!)

Rob - Is this something to use with Power or could it also be useful for the less rich?

Trainerroad does "virtual power". Basically it has power vs speed curves of loads of turbos so based on wheel speed it can guestimate your power. It even has different curves for different resistance levels of the same turbo. As long as conditions are consistent between runs (temperature, tyre pressure etc) you should get a figure that you can compare across sessions. More detail here

nweststeyn

Since starting to use Sufferfest videos, I have enjoyed Turbo Trainer time 100x more than before.

Sore though, innit!!!

thegreatdivide

nweststeyn wrote:

Since starting to use Sufferfest videos, I have enjoyed Turbo Trainer time 100x more than before.

Sore though, innit!!!

For added pain hang a COG Velo jersey on the wall in front of you ;-)

nweststeyn

thegreatdivide wrote:

nweststeyn wrote:

Since starting to use Sufferfest videos, I have enjoyed Turbo Trainer time 100x more than before.

Sore though, innit!!!

For added pain hang a COG Velo jersey on the wall in front of you ;-)

Cracking idea... I will have to obtain one through foul means, not fair, though...

Castleman

Great thread and really looking at getting back into turbo-ing.
I borrowed one a couple of years ago off a mate and it did wonders. After a year off, it's time to start cycling regularly again!

So, was wondering about any experiences of the Minoura B60-R vs the Tacx Satori.

My key constraints are noise, budget and being able to put it away when not in use (as in spare room unfortunately).

Any advice gratefully received!

napoleond

I had a tacx satori but ended up changing to a Cycleops jet fluid pro. The jet fluid 2 is very good too. I find it. Smoother than the satori and if it matters, the jet fluid pro had a much more consistent speed/power relationship.

Castleman

Cheers! What was bad about the satori?

Ps don't i recognise you from tritalk...?

napoleond

Tritalk? Nope, must be a imposter!

Apart from the jet fluid feeling more natural, the speed/power relationship was inconsistent over a session and between sessions. It was much more temperamental to changes in temp. It would probably have benefitted from a bigger flywheel.

It was ideal for taking to races to warm up though...

Caller

I'm new to turbo's, just ordered myself a CycleOps Fluid2 trainer which I'm planning on using with my singlespeed.

The singlespeed's running 45/18 at the moment, should this be ok on the turbo or would I be better off converting it to 1x10 with the spares I've got knocking about in the garage?

I'm planning on just using it through the winter to keep myself fit, probably with a couple of the Sufferfest videos.

napoleond

Good choice of turbo.

You'd be better off with gears so you can work at a much bigger variety of intensities.

Caller

NapoleonD wrote:

Good choice of turbo.

You'd be better off with gears so you can work at a much bigger variety of intensities.

Thanks for that. I though that might be the case but wasn't sure.

Looks like I need to raid the spares box

hulla the hulla

Did my first Sufferfest this morning - Angels. Have to say I really enjoyed it in a peverse, sweaty and painful way and the hour flew by. Will be looking to DL some more of the vid's for a bit of variety. Good value too.

Wrath Rob

hulla the hulla wrote:

Did my first Sufferfest this morning - Angels. Have to say I really enjoyed it in a peverse, sweaty and painful way and the hour flew by. Will be looking to DL some more of the vid's for a bit of variety. Good value too.

I did Angels last night (coupled with Trainerroad). Had a great session, though I wasn't sure I was going to make it through the last climb. 8 mins over threshold plus those attacks almost killed me. Still, new season's training records for 5, 10, 20 and 60 mins power plus new NP best (by a measly 2w) shows its all working.

@NapD: How are you getting on with Trainerroad?

hulla the hulla

NapoleonD wrote:

(sweet spot if you can measure it, very difficult with heart rate in such a short interval)

Nap, what is this "sweetspot" you talk of ? Apologies in advance, I've not read the whole thread so if it's buried in here somewhere tell me to go dig myself. If not...Qu'est-ce que c'est?

Bobbinogs

hulla the hulla wrote:

Did my first Sufferfest this morning - Angels. Have to say I really enjoyed it in a peverse, sweaty and painful way and the hour flew by. Will be looking to DL some more of the vid's for a bit of variety. Good value too.

Yeah Angels is great and it must suit my natural strengths as I can go through it, suffer but do so with a smile. I like doing Fight Club but can only do it just as it is, I simply cannot repeatedly do the attacks properly and then maintain the normal suffering levels...before attacking again. Hence, I have to ignore many of the attacks or I just trail off and get popped out the back of the peleton ( ), bloody demoralising but its always nice to have a challenge!

ddraver

Downward spiral is my favourite...