Garmin 705 fab or fad?
pabloweaver
Posts: 444
" ...can of worms opening ....."
Im in the lucky position that my partner has had a modest financial windfall and because I'm such a great all round guy (
) she wants to " treat" me to something that I would like , but would normally not be able to or warrant getting for the biking lark.
and that brings me to the 705 . . I have hrm etc. but like the idea of the all in one package with gps but I'd just like to ask a few ( probably done to death ) questions before I stick my hat on this as my treat !
1) mapping, presumably I can load potential route into system from say map my ride and system will direct rather than it just being a plotter of where I have been
2) Im aware that mapping systems are needed ...are they readily available and how costly are they?
3) how sturdy are the 705s...I know something like this needs a certain amount of " bulk" but are they uber fragile or a plastic brick ?
4) I live in the north west ...the vast areas of cheshire are there for further exploration ...how reliable are they with info ..will they get me there and back?
5) how much life has the 705 have ...I will be really miffed if a sleeker, faster , better model comes out a week after purchase
and finally
6) each to their own I supposed based on the definition of value ....but do people think they are actually worth it , being something that will increase/enhance my ride experiences or more an expensive piece of bling?
ta !
Im in the lucky position that my partner has had a modest financial windfall and because I'm such a great all round guy (
) she wants to " treat" me to something that I would like , but would normally not be able to or warrant getting for the biking lark.and that brings me to the 705 . . I have hrm etc. but like the idea of the all in one package with gps but I'd just like to ask a few ( probably done to death ) questions before I stick my hat on this as my treat !
1) mapping, presumably I can load potential route into system from say map my ride and system will direct rather than it just being a plotter of where I have been
2) Im aware that mapping systems are needed ...are they readily available and how costly are they?
3) how sturdy are the 705s...I know something like this needs a certain amount of " bulk" but are they uber fragile or a plastic brick ?
4) I live in the north west ...the vast areas of cheshire are there for further exploration ...how reliable are they with info ..will they get me there and back?
5) how much life has the 705 have ...I will be really miffed if a sleeker, faster , better model comes out a week after purchase
and finally
6) each to their own I supposed based on the definition of value ....but do people think they are actually worth it , being something that will increase/enhance my ride experiences or more an expensive piece of bling?
ta !
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Comments
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I have a 605. When I got it the price difference to the 705 was greater and i didn't want the extras.
1. Yes, but you'll need the Garmin City Navigator maps. Topo maps are as useful for routing. If you buy the maps get them on DVD rather than on a SD card then put them on your own SD card. SD cards can fail and this way you'll have the DVD. You can find maps without purchasing them legitimately on eBay or some people will even download them.
2. In addition to Garmin maps there are free open street maps available though these won't do automatic routing as far as i know, they are just maps but they are very good. and free.
3. Sturdy enough. i wouldn't smash it about but it seems quite robust to me, fit for purpose but no more. Water proof too, mine has been rained on plenty of times. They are a bit bigger than the 205 and 305 but you want this so the screen is actually readable. The overall package is small though and looks just right mounted on the stem. It's the right size if you ask me, if it was smaller then you'd have trouble using it.
4. I use mine for getting home from distant pubs in the dark and it works well. Like all sat nav systems the routing is only as good as the mapping and the algorithms used to calculate so sometimes it's routes are a little creative. I have found that the bicycle routing is a bit too conservative and will take you out of the way to avoid a short section of A road so i normally use car routing.
5. Life will be good if the 205 and 305 are anything to go by, they have been around for years and are still supported by Garmin and for sale. Garmin released the 605/705 too early with VERY buggy software to great compliant by new owners. The software is updated online regularly and they've also added features since launch so the product is developing. The Motion Based forum is the place to look, it's effectively the Garmin user forum http://forums.motionbased.com/smf/index.php
6. I think it's worth it. If you are in a club and you don't know the roads it enables you to lead sometimes and find your way home. You can also store a record of all your rides and re ride them later.
These units are not perfect. there have been all sorts of issues with firmware, mount brackets, availability, strange readings and so on. However, i think they are the best available. The software that comes with it, Map Source and training centre take some getting used to and you'll probably need some third party tools like TCX converter to use some things on line as Garmin use their own TCX file format rather than the standard GPX. The manual is hopeless so you need the forum to work out how to use the unit and software, which can be non-trivial.
Hope this helpsM_G0 -
cant really add anything to the above!
Wouldn't be without mine now.0 -
master_grunthos comments are spot on.
"she wants to " treat" me to something that I would like , but would normally not be able to or warrant getting"........ describes it perfectly for me, I don't need any of it's features at all but now I've got them my bike feels wrong without it on and all the info on speed, HR, cadence, elevation, gps etc. It's definitely a luxury but worth every penny IMO.0 -
I have a feeling that its going to be a yes on this given the responses ( master grunthos report is top quality feedback ...cheers ?
her original offer was " would you like me to pay for teeth whitening?.."
er......I thought my teeth were nice and white anyway! :?
any recommended retailers? a lot of the ones on e bay are coming from Israel etc ..would prefer UK shop in case of complications!0 -
I absolutely love my 705 and for me it's easily been worth the money. The only thing I'd say is that the fixing bracket is notoriously poor quality and many of us have found that it progressively becomes loose and the computer starts to wobble. Some posters have even had their computer go flying off down the road after hitting a pothole!! Check out the forums and you'll see.
Also, Garmin's cadence sensors are a bit hit or miss. Apparently they can stop working if they get too wet.
Because of these problems I was careful to buy my 705 from a retailer that I'd had experience of being good with after-sales service. Mine cost £20-£30 more with this retailer but after them replacing my first fixing bracket and a duff cadence sensor free of charge I'm glad I used them.0 -
Hi Shezzer ...always one to happily promote good suppliers ...which one did you use ?0
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there are some ways to "improve" the bracket, or at least make it more reliable. Firstly always mount it on a few layers of old inner tube which provides some flex and takes some of the work away from the mount itself, also don't do the cable ties too tight or that can cause extra stress on the mounting.
I've actually used Araldite to glue the two pieces of the mount together which also helps them share the load, it does mean that i can't change between stem and bar mounting but it feels a lot more robust and I've had no failures on either bike (so far over ~5k miles)
I have however broken off one of the tabs that releases the GPS unit from the mount, the tabs are too weak and cheap considering the value of the unit they hold. I have read on the motion based forum that they no sell better brackets, but not much better.
If i compare the bracket to friends Etrex GPS mountings for bikes they are still better though. They've lost their Etrex units down the road plenty of times even without the brackets actually breaking, they just fail to hold the GPS units well enough.
Garmin could do better very easily with the Edge brackets and it would only cost them pence extra per unit. And even save them money on the units they end up repairing for free because the brackets have failed within weeks and they've bounced off the tarmac.
But, like i say mine have been fine...M_G0 -
Hi Pabloweaver
I used Wiggle and am pleased I did. There was no hassle with the returns / free replacements and they even apologised for the inconvenience. As I say, you can get em cheaper but when I'm spending so much I'd rather pay a little extra for the peace of mind.
To your opening post:
1) you can indeed create and load potential routes into the system using free websites (I use Map my Ride but there are lots of others that just as good). If you save the file as a .gpx then it will direct you with audio and visial alerts. This has been the best for me. My rides are now 90% on quiet country lanes that I've not been on before. I love not having to stop at every other junction to get a map out and work out which direction I should going in.
2) you'll need to get mapping onto an SD micro card. These sometimes come bundled with a 705 (eg the road pack) but you can just as easily buy them separately.
3) sturdiness ... seems as sturdy as anything else I've had. They're bigger than most cycle computers but not stupidly so. About the size of a small mobile phone I guess. You need a decent size screen though with the route map.
4) it's pretty accurate ... accurate enough for me to rely on it when I'm miles away from home in dark wildernesses ... like Cheshire!!
In fairness, if you ask the 705 to calculate a route for you it's pretty hopeless. Just be ready for a longer than necessary ride. However, if you plot the route on a website and download it then it's good enough. I've only had one experience of duff directions but the map is always accurate so you can manually navigate yourself back to where you need to be.
5) how much life has the 705 have? Dunno, only had mine a few months.
6) do people think they are actually worth it? I'm a big fan. It's made it so much easier for me to head off into different places, stick to country lanes and stay off the main roads. Navigation being done by the computer means you can concentrate more on other things like working hard, enjoying the scenerey, whatever. It's also helped when I've entered audaxes and sportives as the route is usually uploaded by someone beforehand which means you don't have to get out the fiendishly complicated written directions. I also love the range of data it gives me (eg HR, cadence, elevation etc), although you can get all that from much cheaper computers in fairness.0 -
there is an uprated mount, I got one from wiggle this week, Its a one piece unit instead of two.0
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Just purchased one of these today (waiting to pick it up from next door as it was delivered there!). Going to start with the free maps and see how I get on.
cheapest place I found with the bundle online was here :
http://www.mynewcheap.co.uk/products/de ... nce/11349/0 -
lots of great stuff already said - my 2p:
I have a 305 which I have had for a few years an it is fantastic!! - I bought it at a similar price to the 705 is now and never regretted it - the 705 has a lot mor functions than my 305 so I don't think you will go wrong - would make an ace present so go for it!0 -
I thought that the Oregon series was replacing the Edge 605/705 series.
http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... 0-09-348940 -
I live in Cheshire and I have never regretted buying my 705
I bought it with the Topo maps that come on dvd so you can install and use them on your pc.
I don't know where is comes from that Toipo maps wont route as mine has routed me on nearly every ride and without taking the long route.
I don't know what the difference is between the Topo maps and city navigator as the Topo still shows all petrol stations etc and all street names and places of interest and on top of that it shows the contour lines and offroad trails.
The based map is an absolute waste of time.
Battery life is around 18 hours which can be extended with a usb battery back up pack.
The cadence sensor is also a worthy buy as the speed readingsa can sometimes be a little erratic.
Prices do seem to have gone up a lot since I bought mine last year where I paid £280 with the whole UK mapping0 -
I havent got one - but my mate has - I was v keen on it at first - but I'm not convinced.
Battery life isnt good - needs to be charged before the sunday ride - it couldnt follow the GPS routes that I'd recorded the previous week - it was telling him that the correct road was off to the left of where we were - but that road doesnt exist.
We did a organised bike ride that took us thru a tricky housing estate. We couldnt find our way back through it even with GPS.
Cheshire isnt that tricky to be honest - just check a map and write down a few key villages and bung it in your back pocket - I've done 100 mile rides just based on that.0 -
pabloweaver wrote:I have a feeling that its going to be a yes on this given the responses ( master grunthos report is top quality feedback ...cheers ?
her original offer was " would you like me to pay for teeth whitening?.."
er......I thought my teeth were nice and white anyway! :?
any recommended retailers? a lot of the ones on e bay are coming from Israel etc ..would prefer UK shop in case of complications!
Also beware of mapping..... The 705 has a basemap, and also (depending on package) City Navigator or "Topo", Chances are these are configured for the country of original sale. If you have an Israeli map and have to pay another £70 for a UK useable version makes the price less attractive.<b><i>He that buys land buys many stones.
He that buys flesh buys many bones.
He that buys eggs buys many shells,
But he that buys good beer buys nothing else.</b></i>
(Unattributed Trad.)0 -
PS - there is an "avoid main roads" option on setup that leads to the roundabout routes. Disable this to get the more direct ones.<b><i>He that buys land buys many stones.
He that buys flesh buys many bones.
He that buys eggs buys many shells,
But he that buys good beer buys nothing else.</b></i>
(Unattributed Trad.)0 -
pps "bikeroutetoaster" will transfer direct routes direct to the unit<b><i>He that buys land buys many stones.
He that buys flesh buys many bones.
He that buys eggs buys many shells,
But he that buys good beer buys nothing else.</b></i>
(Unattributed Trad.)0 -
"Battery life isnt good" - not sure i agree with this statement, the battery life is excellent, stated at 15 hours which i can believe if you don't use the back light. i used it for a weekend away with no charging and for at least 2 evening rides ~3 hours each each week with the light on 50% and no need to charge. it's really more than adequate.
Yes, the base map is p!ss poor, very few roads and very coarse resolution.
even with avoid major roads off the bicycle routing is too conservative regarding which roads it chooses. though having said that it can come up with some odd exceptions. local knowledge is normally better and if you're planning a route just to get home it's worth calculating it a few times with different options and looking at the map to check it's not doing anything crazy. you are also at the mercy of the maps, several roads near me on the maps don't exist or vice versa which can be an issue and some junctions have incorrect priorities (the T is in the wrong place where three roads meet),
"We did a organised bike ride that took us thru a tricky housing estate. We couldn't find our way back through it even with GPS. " - i'm really surprised by this, in town the directions are pretty flawless as the mapping tends to be accurate (same as for car garmin units). Often you'll get a route with many many turns because for a bike it takes you direct rather than on a ring road but it's still spot on in my experience
I always avoid using "lock on road" this way if you take a short cut though a cycle route then the routing doesn't get confusedM_G0 -
There is no other device that can do what the 705 does, but it is far from perfect. To add to the issues already described, a few that annoy me are:
1. Speed spikes. The recorded data often has erroneous speed data where it spikes quickly up then down before going back to the correct speed. This makes the max speed data totally unusable, and greatly detracts from the usefulness of the recorded data for performing detailed analyses. I get one of these spikes every few minutes. I have the separate speed/cadence sensor fitted, but the device seems to use GPS in preference to the speed sensor.
2. Data dropouts. It is supposed to record data every second, but you get dropouts, i.e. seconds where there is no recorded data. The frequency of these can vary a lot, e.g. I had one 22 min ride with only one second missed, but today I did a 48 min ride where there was a total of 22 seconds of missing data. Again, not good if you want to do something detailed with the recorded data.
3. Time to get a satellite lock. Only an issue for short rides, but I often cycle to my health club which is a 3-4 min journey, and I need to turn it on well before I set off, and have it powered up next to a window so it gets a satellite lock, otherwise it can take half the journey before it starts giving sensible speed readings. This is a huge pain compared to just having an old fashioned wired computer on the bike. (This is on a different bike which doesn't have the separate speed sensor fitted).0 -
TarmacExpert wrote:There is no other device that can do what the 705 does, but it is far from perfect.
I have the separate speed/cadence sensor fitted, but the device seems to use GPS in preference to the speed sensor.
3.I often cycle to my health club which is a 3-4 min journey, and I need to turn it on well before I set off, and have it powered up next to a window so it gets a satellite lock, otherwise it can take half the journey before it starts giving sensible speed readings.
A Satmap device will do pretty much everything a Garmin will do, but you will pay hugely for the mapping software.Having seen these tested etc I believe they are supperior to Garmin.
I think your speed sensor is either broken or not set up right as mine works perfectly, try doing a scan for it and make sure the option is switched on in the menu.
If your journey is only 3-4 mins away can you not find your way there by now? :shock:
Seriously I don't think its intended to replace a computer for day to day stuff, if you do want to use it for such then turn off the GPS setting in the menu, you wont have to wait then.0 -
Well setup the 705, can't wait to go for a long ride and test it, I have to say I uploaded a short around the block trip and I am impressed with the analysis you get online through connect.
Graphically the unit isn't great but if you peddling at 20 mph plus you don't need it to be.
Ocant help thinking though that with the right application and blue tooth heart monitor and cadence sensor I could do all this with my iPhone and use google maps live so to speak. This tech does not exsist yet so I am tottally happy with the 705.0 -
I did say that the problem was on a different bike without a speed sensor fitted.Wappygixer wrote:I think your speed sensor is either broken or not set up right as mine works perfectly, try doing a scan for it and make sure the option is switched on in the menu.
I have a friend who uses a nokia phone to do a lot of what the 705 does on the mapping side. The software they provide to do it (beta at the moment) is Sports Tracker:oxford wrote:Ocant help thinking though that with the right application and blue tooth heart monitor and cadence sensor I could do all this with my iPhone and use google maps live so to speak. This tech does not exsist yet so I am tottally happy with the 705.
http://sportstracker.nokia.com/nts/main/index.do
It can't replace a 705 if you want to receive power data, though, which was a key function for me in getting the 705.0 -
There are plenty of apps on the iPhone already that attempt similar things to the nokia. Free runner is one although not sure if it's the right name. As for measuring power, why not with the right Bluetooth devices it could I am sure.But your right for the moment the 705 is the best there is.0
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Got mine about a year ago. Absolutely no regrets.
Steep learning curve! An invaluable resource is http://frank.kinlan.co.uk/?page_id=920. Make sure you check it out.
I find Wiggle's prices are steep. Got mine from http://www.handtec.co.uk/product.php/905/garmin-edge-705-heart-rate-monitor---speed-cadence at about £295 (current price)There's no such thing as too old.0 -
I think one of the things that is coming through, is that the 705 is better suited to guiding on pre set courses rather that letting it configure a point to point route ( unless lost in the wilderness and find " home" ).
one of the things I have noticed when using the works sat nav in the car, is that i end up places and then realising that I have not remembered how I got there due to paying attention to sat nav and not land marks !!
I've ...been told that there are sites on the web that you can download maps .. ( its a " friend " of mine who uses what I believe are file sharing sites ...your honour ...I would never consider using such a thing .....)
does anybody else have a friend who may have used the above and do they work ....purely out of curiosity of course ................. : 0 -
pabloweaver wrote:the 705 is better suited to guiding on pre set courses rather that letting it configure a point to point route
definately, It will take you all over the place no matter what settings you use! Which is really strange because using exactly the same maps on the PC in mapsource its usually pretty spot on!??0 -
manged to buy the city navigator on sd very cheap and thought I was doing really well for my self, now I've read that the best thing to do is NOT buy the sd card but pay a stupid amount of cash and get the CD version as the sd will not route on pc.
now I'm no technophobe, but it seems to me that garmin do there utmost for this not to be a " plug and play " product. Any advice regarding the CD's or should I just get my " friend" to download them off t'internet ...
what looked at first to be a straighforward purchase is suddenly adding ££££££'s all the time ...
then again whats new in the world of cycling!0 -
oxford wrote:Well setup the 705, can't wait to go for a long ride and test it, I have to say I uploaded a short around the block trip and I am impressed with the analysis you get online through connect.
Graphically the unit isn't great but if you peddling at 20 mph plus you don't need it to be.
Ocant help thinking though that with the right application and blue tooth heart monitor and cadence sensor I could do all this with my iPhone and use google maps live so to speak. This tech does not exsist yet so I am tottally happy with the 705.
Battery life is rather better than the iPhone though!0 -
pabloweaver wrote:should I just get my " friend" to download them off t'internet ...
!
thats what I did, balls to paying more for maps on a £300 GPS device!!0
