Etape du tour 2009 - beware of sports tours international

Road Red

I travelled with Ronan Pensec on a two star package. We stayed in a very nice hotel in Grignan about 40 minutes from Montelimar. Food was average but very edible. Pricewise he was about 20% cheaper than the UK companies.

Service wise it was generally fine. He hires a local rep who looks after us. Had a few gripes on the morning as we were late leaving the hotel and still had to pickup 15 more cyclists at another hotel. However, they made up for it in knowing the backroads into Montelimar and we were comfortably in pens by 6.30.

We had the usual problem of the earlier finishers (not me!) having to wait for the late arrivals at Maulaucene. Not sure what you can do about that, they only have the one coach. Overall it was a satisfactory experience.

However, if I do another I will definitely be going solo. Its a simple service they provide and they charge way over the top. Buts thats the law of supply and demand. There will always be a role for these packages for first timers and they will continue and probably grow in demand in line with cycling popularity. But there is no excuse for the service levels described in many of the contributions above. Bad service will contnue until such time as the people vote with their feet and they are forced to change. All we can do is direct people towards the alternative providers.

FransJacques

Catbert - totally agree with your objectives/expectations vis a vis *any* tour groups who are peddling expensive wares in relation with the Etape. BUT - no 2 companies are created equal as you are sadly aware now.

Baxters are great for those painfully early day trips to Roubaix or Flanders where the local bus driver allow you to see the route 3/4/5/ times.

STI is absolutely fantastic for the March training camps at Club Pollentia, I've been 3/4 times and am going for sure next year. I highly recommend them to anyone on this list. They're well run and pretty professional and you'll get as much cycling related info as you can shove down your throat in a week. I myself try not to geek out too much and enjoy the island but I've been doing the sport 25 years so like to reinforce the basics and it's nicely indulgant to live like an actual athlete for a week a year, without major distractions.

Try La Fuga for next year's etape, it's run by a couple of guys I respect and who are good cyclists to boot. Why not call them in the next couple weeks when they're NOT running a trip so you can speak to Ian himself. Speak to him, tell him what peeved you off, what you'd ideally like, how much you're willing to pay for it, and he'll take what he learned to make a good trip next year. It'll be expensive, but the Etape only comes once a year, so why compromise your experience if it means that much to you?

Overall, je suis d'accord avec Kelber. The etape is about the ride not about the coach or hotels. Guess it's just the 'Brits-abroad' way and possibly a holdover from the class system where self-described discerning guests feel it necessary to elevate themselves and project a social status by complaining about sub-standard service. Recall the Monty Python sketch where Eric Idle rants about "Watney's Red Barrel" and "a lizard in the bleeding bidet" . At the end of the day it was a British outfit who bent you over the back of the sofa and took your hard-earned, post-40% tax cash.

We'll organize ourselves via this list next year so it doesn't happen again!

oscar26

Overall, je suis d'accord avec Kelber. The etape is about the ride not about the coach or hotels. Guess it's just the 'Brits-abroad' way and possibly a holdover from the class system where self-described discerning guests feel it necessary to elevate themselves and project a social status by complaining about sub-standard service.

Not too sure what you're going on about there. Yes of course the etape is about the ride - I don't think anyone was going there expecting a posh hotel or to enjoy the coach trip from the airport. But the fact that it's about the ride does not mean that one should put up with a disgraceful service put on by the tour company. Quite what any of this has got to do with the class system is seriously beyond me.

Le Commentateur

xover_runner wrote:

Total cost of trip I paid for was £700. Think STI did OK out of that....

I know they do a few other trips to the classics etc, but I reckon most of their income has to be got from these three weeks in July. Without Le Tour they'd be out of business.

I think part of the problem is that Brits aren't used to paying for quality -- I have the same issues with commissioning editors at publishers, and it's part of the reason we have virtually bankrupt farmers supplying our supermarkets, etc etc.

Personally I'd rather go independent and pay €100 a night for a great hotel with good food -- probably works out a similar total for a weeks stay to a Baxter's trip. If budget is the issue, then DIY with friends and hire a Gite & car, as the shared cost will usually be good. One trip to Mallorca we even hired a local old lady to come in and cook for us – worked out €3 each per day and she'd trundle off to the local markets in the afternoons and by the time we rolled in after a day's riding the huge Spanish meal would be amost ready.

big_phil

I am completely with FransJacques on this. I have done Etape and Marmotte - for the Etape I used a company outside UK who booked accommodation and entry but no transfers. We sorted this out ourselves and only used the Etape organisation coach transfer the day before the event to get back to start.

I would also say it is a good idea to extend trip a couple of days either side as well....

Also the Marmotte of course starts and finishes in same place so is much easier logistically and regarding the organisers lack of entry - up until this year you could enter the marmotte the day before by going to top of Alp D'Huez and giving them your 35 - 40 Euro...(and thoise of you who have only don ethe Etape will immediately notice the difference with the £130 fee charged in the UK for an entry only into Etape.

FrankKinlan

I'm still on the coach tour and it's been great. Missed food at Paris as the hotel service had finished by the time we arrived. But Ray our guide did warn us of this.
If your on a fly/ride package there is very little slack if things go wrong as they do.
Food has been great on the Pont-St-Esprit group. Rides out have been great and the Ventoux is in a few hours.
STI do put a lot of effort into making sure your bike reaches you but if you fly Ryanair what would you expect. Your bikes lost for a while heres youre Euro back ,**** Off.

You could do it cheaper but it would take some sorting as I entered very late.
There is a also a group loyalty that has developed, the one at the back sorts us out on language difficulties.,

We did have the likes of yourself trying to put bikes on our trailer but for us it's been a great trip.

spindrift72

ok, we're all agreed that entry-only is the way to go. The problem is how to get the ticket. I tried and failed this year, which is how I ended up with STI (like most people I'd imagine)Ideas?

dilemna

I would like to do an Etap next year and was wondering about these organised tours but this company STI/Baxters seem like clowns. Maybe I'll see if several in my local club want to do it and we can get a small group together and drive down in a people carrier or van or hire something and book our own accommodation. From the above posts the prob seems to be obtaining entry tickets minus all the other crap.

[Deleted User]

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Hugh A

I have travelled with Baxters a few times to the etape and had variable experiences - some reasonable, and some pretty awful, but generally it was along the lines above.

I would imagine that the problems have something to do with the one-off nature of each event (as well as Baxters' poor organization) - they are always in a different place with new hotels and coach companies, and the 'reps.' as has been pointed out are really just cyclists that they know who get a free trip out of it and usually don't speak any French or know anything about what is going on other than the rather inadequate packs they are given.

The trouble is that the company cannot engage anyone for longer than the week or so in the year when nearly all their travelling is done.

So doing it yourself is probably going to be a lot better, and we have found strangely more relaxing, BUT you will need to get together with at least one or two others to sort the logistics - mostly moving cars around so you can get to the start / from the finish.

Circular routes like the Marmotte are smoother by comparison as no pre-ride shuffling of vehicles required.

burton01

We went to this year’s etape with Sportstours and really enjoyed it.

The hotel we were in was not very good but we knew it was budget and at least it was close for the start. We knew there were better class of hotel but we saved on the money and we met one couple who were really pleased with the hotel they were in.
Our transfer to the start on the morning of the race went really well with the driver taking a route to avoid traffic so we arrived at the bike store in good time with no last minute rush.

And of course the bike store was really close and convenient for the start.

From what we saw, the bike pick-ups seem to be a great service. When we got to the bike store opening on Sunday morning, the bikes were very neatly arranged by hotel and the guys had been working until about 2 in the morning getting everything orderly. We met one guy who flew down with easyjet on the Saturday and said 12 bikes, including his, had not made it. Even though it was not Sportstours’ responsibility, they sorted it out and got the bikes for everyone from Montpellier. I don’t understand why people will train for months and then risk putting a carbon racing machine on an aeroplane either to be broken by baggage handlers or maybe not arrive in time, why take the risk!
We decided to drive because the bike pickups were not close for us but there’s no way we would put our bikes on a plane for an important event like the etape.

Also, to be fair to sportstours, with everyone in different hotels all over the region its almost impossible for them to have coaches leaving from the finish at different times. I guess the coaches are all arranged by hotel/region so they cannot leave until all have finished. They cannot have a coach leaving earlier if its taking one person to montelimar and one to Avignon and 2 to grignon etc – it wouldn’t work. Again, they did say how this would work which is why we decided on the drive option so we left a car at the finish to use.

I guess one of their problems is that they never know until October where and when the etape route will be so they do not have the advantage of being able to book up the same hotels each year close to each other to make logistics easier for themselves.

Anyway, we’ll be using them again.

gemmaa

I had a really unimpressive experience with sports tours at this years etape.

a) it was expensive, so you expect some level of service
b) the transfers took ages and felt like i was herded around like cattle
c) we had to wait at the end of the race for several hours with no food or drinks in a car park, not the best way to celebrate the best ride of my life
d) the vegetarian food at the hotal was a complete joke, rice or pasta with green beans and half a tomato every night, except the last night of the race, when the change was rice, beans and no tomato.

Would recommmend finding a smaller company that actually give you something back for your ££££

paulwood

have just been contacted by Chris from STI, trying to understand what went wrong.

sadly playing voicemail ping pong at the moment so haven't got to speak to him yet.

does show that they are taking the concerns seriously though and not just ignoring them so +1 for STI so far

spindrift72

I too have been called by Chris, Chief Exec of STI. I'm glad he's looking at trying to improve the service and I look forward to hearing back from him what he will actually be doing about it. He said something interesting that I didn't know: STI bought Graham Baxter's sporting tours 2.5 yr ago as Graham felt it was getting too big for him.

Am I the only cynic who detects that burton01's posting isn't entirely independent?? Let's keep it honest and open please guys...

Every company operating Etape trips operates within the same, admittedly difficult constraints, but some seem to do it better than others at present.

Catbert

paulwood wrote:

have just been contacted by Chris from STI, trying to understand what went wrong.

sadly playing voicemail ping pong at the moment so haven't got to speak to him yet.

does show that they are taking the concerns seriously though and not just ignoring them so +1 for STI so far

If you do get to speak to him, perhaps you could also ask why none of the staff in the cycle tour dept of STI seem to reply to emails - I had to chase up 2 messages with enquiries before doing the marmotte with them this year, and have yet to hear back from jonathan baxter in response to my complaints about the poor level of service at that event. Others in the group also had similar pre-dept experiences.

AlunP

used cyclomundo rather than sports tours.

Not a bad experience overall - the food at the ibis in Orange was really poor but the logistics went reasonably well. bussed to within 3K of start and two collections for fast/slow finishers.

Easyjet managed to lose bikes/luggage etc again this year. last year two guys had EJ lose everything from bikes to shoes,clothes..... after six months training they spent the whole day in a bar getting hammered...they used the trian this year.

The perfect solution would be to get together a group of mates and a couple of non biking supporters. Add a minibus hire and a set of entry only places.....

Kléber

spindrift72 wrote:

Am I the only cynic who detects that burton01's posting isn't entirely independent??

No!

pdavid

deleted

bikeclaw

Thought I'd add in my thoughts having just got back from the Etape

I was fully aware that there would be a premium paid over normal season prices during the Etape, I don't deny STI the right to make a profit. However my overwhelming feeling on getting back was one of being completely ripped off. Like previous posters I've tried to work out where my £700 went and I can only assume that some SIT fat cats were sat on a beach in the Bahamas sipping cocktails as I was dying a thousand small deaths up Mont Ventoux.

- Firstly I booked with two other friends. Unfortunately STI managed to not only put is in different hotels but different towns. I have raised this with STI but have received nothing by way of explanation or apology.
- Secondly, and I think this is where there is cause for complaint to ABTA, is that it was sold as a 3 star package and that it would be a comfortable way to do the Etape. Well I'm sorry but rocking up to a hotel that's clearly advertised as 40 euros a night on the side of it doesn't really mean three star. Also the single person supplement I paid was more than the total cost of the room. That continued to make me feel completely ripped off.
- Finally, as many have commented, the situation after the ride in the car park was shambolic. Far too many reps chatting with each other not seeming to care what was happening to us. Dinner at 10pm after a race like that is totally unacceptable. Although I will say that our particular rep, Daryll, did do a great job all weekend.

In the end I had to avoid talking to the reps because I knew it would just make me angry and I didn't want it to spoil what was an otherwise fantastic experience.

I would have much preferred to have done an entry only booking however they are very limited. Maybe the best way is to provide feedback to ASO.

Either way, what a fantastic weekend, such a stunning ride up to Bedoin and then so much brutal pain afterwards. The images of carnage in the forest with bodies and ambulances everywhere will never leave me

SteveDevine

Thought I'd add my experience of French Cycling Holidays. Being someone that hates package holidays i would never have booked such a holiday if it were not to guarentee getting a place.

Personally I have no complaints. The Hotel was excellent (Moulin De La Roque) near Carpentras and the food was the best I've had in France for a long time. I stayed on until Thursday after the ride. Some of the other comments talk about FCC being a small operation, well I think they had around 100 riders in total so god knows what the other orgs take and maybe therein lies the problem.

Slight winges from others in the party
- The Sunday coach to sign on left at 12 and returned at 4. So most people were bored and would have preferred to get there early in the morning, get the sign in done and return to lie by the pool for the rest of the day
- Like the other orgs the shutlles from the finish to the Hotel left when they were full so some people were waiting for a few hours. I think I waited for a couple but was so *?!cked I was happy to lie in the shade eating the wicked hot dogs froom next door!

Next year I will try and secure an entry only somehow though

crowdie

Thought I'd add my experience being a first-timer for any such mass participation cycle event. I secured my place through a charity (or at least I thought I had) and paid the deposit + entry fee in December. Next thing I heard from anyone about the Etape was in June when I got a call via the charity that STI were chasing up the remainder of my balance which I duly paid.

A couple of weeks before the Etape I began to wonder why I hadn't received any documentation about the hotel, logistics on the day etc. so rang up STI and they forwarded details onto me that were sent out weeks prior but I'd not received as they'd typed in my email address wrong!

On reading the documentation I suddenly realised I had not received notification of my dossard # and when checking the Etape site realised I wasn't entered. Seems like STI had emailed me the official entry form to this mistyped address and I'd not been entered, even though I'd paid the £600+ in full. I naturally made several calls/emails to STI Bike department and received no real help or assistance in sorting the problem out. So, on leaving for France by car with bike in the boot I was not actually down to take part in the Etape!

En route to Montelimar I spent a night in Vittel watching the arrivee/depart of the tour then stopped in Bourg D'Oisans for a quick warm up ride up Alpe d'Huez

On arriving in Montelimar and the bike store I explained the situation to Graham Baxter and he got onto Peter Davies who said he would see what he could do. Next day at registration I spoke to another guy there who told me to meet Peter at the Expo - I met Peter there and he had organised a spare number registered under his name so although I wasn't riding under my own name I was definitely in the Etape!! Big relief!

Absolutely loved the day itself and yes the waiting for the coaches to leave at the end was a pain and the STI reps weren't doing an awful lot to try and get things moving along quicker. But I wasn't too fussed as I was still on a bit of a high from the ride.

Hotel was good - despite rather odd meal for the night before of raw steak - and the various transfers etc. worked ok. Dave our rep was pretty good all in all, no complaints there.

So, all in all mixed experience of STI - they obviously have taken on such a big responsibility that cracks show through - I would've expected them to ensure everyone who'd paid up their money was registered with the organisers way before the day itself and cases like mine would be caught - fortunately as I was probably a unique case on the day they made sure I was in the race and I can't fault them for getting this organised on registration day (mainly down to Peter Davies' help).

I would probably try and do this independently (if possible) in future now I've done it once and learnt a few lessons. Agree that you should try and make a holiday out of it if you can - I then spent 6 days cycling to the west of Avignon out in the Cevennes national park and had a fab time (as always when cycling in France) enjoying superb quiet roads, food and wine!

Elliot.

niedermeyer

crowdie wrote:

On reading the documentation I suddenly realised I had not received notification of my dossard # and when checking the Etape site realised I wasn't entered. Seems like STI had emailed me the official entry form to this mistyped address and I'd not been entered, even though I'd paid the £600+ in full. I naturally made several calls/emails to STI Bike department and received no real help or assistance in sorting the problem out. So, on leaving for France by car with bike in the boot I was not actually down to take part in the Etape!

On arriving in Montelimar and the bike store I explained the situation to Graham Baxter and he got onto Peter Davies who said he would see what he could do. Next day at registration I spoke to another guy there who told me to meet Peter at the Expo - I met Peter there and he had organised a spare number registered under his name so although I wasn't riding under my own name I was definitely in the Etape!! Big relief!

.

This is unbelievably dodgy. What if you'd had an accident - who would have ASO have contacted? More importantly, what if you caused an accident to somebody else (very plausible when you observe some Brits descending) - you certainly wouldn't be covered for 3rd party damages by the Etape insurance. This is one of the reasons ASO are so stringent these days on medical forms etc -I doubt they'd be best pleased if they knew about this sort of behaviour (indeed there were signs up in French in Montellimar that anyone caught entering under a false name would be banned from future events as would accomplices)

I find it very odd that STI could take your money and not check your medical form had gone through - did they not have your phone number?

crowdie

I had my medical forms with me - 2 copies and an original. I had been told STI would use these and their 'contacts with the organisers' to get me an entry and the name changed - in the end I didn't need to show any of my forms and was just given the entry number. Looking back and at your points it wasn't the safest thing to do of course. STI had all my contact details (via the charity I was riding for) and should never have let this situation get to a last minute number swap - I don't know what else I could've done in this case.

NlEDERMEYER

crowdie wrote:

I had my medical forms with me - 2 copies and an original. I had been told STI would use these and their 'contacts with the organisers' to get me an entry and the name changed - in the end I didn't need to show any of my forms and was just given the entry number. Looking back and at your points it wasn't the safest thing to do of course. STI had all my contact details (via the charity I was riding for) and should never have let this situation get to a last minute number swap - I don't know what else I could've done in this case.

I'm not criticising you, Crowdie - I'd have done the same, or it would have been a year of training and a load of cash for nothing. I am however appalled at STI.

itisaboutthebike

The only way these comapnies are going to impove is to complain to ABTA.

And even BBC's Watchdog.

If I were you I;d aviod the Etape and ride a real sportive like La Marmotte !

Then you can ccall yourself a bike rider !

dmb101

I went this year with sports tours. Although I did not rate the hotel at the start it was very close to the start and the one at the end was ok. Transfers did take a little time but that was mainly pretty bad traffic on the motorway and in the towns.

I found the reps very good. Food was edable if not plentiful. The bike pickup worked and none of our bikes were damaged. The wait at the end enabled me to refuel on much needed ice cold larger.

would I use them again, perhaps I would not go for the buget package next time.

cyclopath

paulwood wrote:

have just been contacted by Chris from STI, trying to understand what went wrong.

sadly playing voicemail ping pong at the moment so haven't got to speak to him yet.

does show that they are taking the concerns seriously though and not just ignoring them so +1 for STI so far

No, I'm afraid it doesn't mean a thing.

I went with them last year when their organisation proved to be an utter shambles. I told them about it and I too was contacted afterwards for further info.

Having read the various posts it is clear that they have learned absolutely nothing.

bahzob

paulwood wrote:

have just been contacted by Chris from STI, trying to understand what went wrong.

sadly playing voicemail ping pong at the moment so haven't got to speak to him yet.

does show that they are taking the concerns seriously though and not just ignoring them so +1 for STI so far

Interesting. I got an email from Chris Bird (CE of Sports Tours?? not sure) saying tried to call me but had old mobile number so please could he have new one. Supplied it but not heard back since. Will let you know if he calls..

Sports Tours Internationa

Dear Sports Tours International Customer,

Firstly, I would like to thank many of you who have taken the time to post well-balanced views and constructive comments on bike radar regarding our service at the Etape this year.

As many of you are aware, we are one of Europe’s leading operators in cycling, running and training camps.

This year we had approximately 800 cyclists travel with us to the Etape du Tour. Once our team arrived back, I carried out a full debrief with them and distributed a customer questionnaire via email for direct feedback on our offer, service and possible improvements for 2010.

I was alerted to the Bike Radar comments as soon as postings came through and made contact with a number of customers to understand fully the issues they had experienced.

Following direct conversations with customers and staff, it became very clear to me that we had not delivered the standards we expect, and our customers deserve, in a few areas of our offer.

It was also clear to me that the changing profile of our customer requires a more varied level of offer in price, content and delivery of the Etape experience.

For those who have posted comments questioning our pricing, integrity and operations I would like to be very clear that Sports Tours International has been trading successfully for over 3 decades and has only remained at the forefront of sports travel due to our customer focus, value for money offer, professional reputation and continued investment.

I will not hide from the fact that on this occasion we have fallen short of some of our customers’ expectations when it came to service delivery. However, we have listened and we will address the isolated points highlighted to us.

We have communicated with customers, hotels, the ASO and our staff and I can assure you that the Bike Radar activity, as well as our own research, will be a major part of our thinking as we prepare to launch our 2010 Etape du Tour packages in the coming weeks.

For those of you (and there are many) who enjoyed this year, I hope you will notice more customer choice in 2010. For those who have been disappointed, I realise I cannot expect your support but I do hope you will recognise that Sport Tours International takes its responsibilities seriously and respects the needs of its customers, and values their support.

Once again thank you all for your feedback and wherever you go, and whoever you go with, enjoy your cycling!

Chris Bird
Chief Executive
Sports Tours International

xover_runner

What a totally inadequate response from a Chief Exceutive to some very serious customer service complaints which he admitted had been balanced and constructive. Shame he could not have reciprocated. Looks like everything will be OK and fabulous for 2010 because he says it will.