Cramping and ways to combat it

greeny12

Hi all,

I ride a few sportives each year, and this year I've noticed a much bigger problem with cramping in my thighs, so much so that after about 50 miles I'm unable to get out of the saddle to climb (thankfully I rarely do this anyway) and at the end of the 77 mile Highclere event I locked up solid and had to be almost helped off the bike in agony.

Now, I like to think I drink reasonably well (3-4 large SiS bottles on Highclere, say) on the ride plus I always down a 500ml Lucozade sport before setting off, but I'm wondering if I should take a salt tablet or something like that?

I'm 6'6" and around 88 kilos, and I sweat a fair bit when riding hard. Should I go down the salt route, or just try to force more fluid down on the ride?

Any advice/experiences gratefully received, especially since I have a Ventoux climb coming up in August!!

jairaj

im no expert but thought cramp was caused by 3 things: poor hydration, low salt levels and not stretching / warming up your muscles.

You seem to be drinking lots so prob not the fluid levels.

Also the stretching thing is for at the start of exercise or after you've finished, which is not what is happening to you.

So by process of elimation, im guessing its your salt levels that are too low? check what the drinks you drink contain and compare it with a dedicated salt / isotonic tablet / drink to see if you're getting enough?

Edwin

I doubt this is due to lack of salt IMHO.

You probably don't want to hear this answer, but cramp is caused by overstretching yourself. Either you are riding too hard on the day, or you're not fit enough.
If you still think it's a problem, try one of the drink mixes formulated for hot weather, with added electrolytes, or if you want to waste less money stick half a teaspoon of salt in your bottles. See if it makes any difference...

r3 guy

I also suffer from cramp a lot, like you both legs seize up and its pure agony. Having this happen to you at the bottom of hardknot isn’t fun!

Anway, I did the dragon this weekend, the prospect of 117 miles was daunting, physically I knew I could do it (and did) its just the dreaded cramp that I was worried about.

After much googling heres what I did and it worked (as you can see I covered all the bases)

Drink more than I would normally
Cycled a much higher cadence than usual
Drink an electrolyte based sports drink before and multiple during the ride (to replace the salts etc)
Ate loads of bananas the week leading up to the event and then just before and during (potassium)
Drank tonic water during the week leading up to the event (the quinine is supposed to help)
Stretched before and during the event (never usually do that)
Sucked on some heart burn tablets, rennies, gaviscon etc (magnesium)
Prayed before and during the event (I am not kidding)

After covering all those bases I got through the event fine…Who knows I may have got through it fine anyway??

Edwin

Are you related to Bhima by any chance?

I'm fairly sure almost all of that should be unneccesary, especially the praying. Admittedly I'm a non-believer, but I'd still recommend looking at your training before trying any of that.

greeny12

Thanks for the input guys - some useful thoughts.

I already use the SiS Go Electrolyte drink, at least for the initial fills of my bottles - maybe I should carry some powder for the refills as well?

Not sure about adding salt to the lemon & lime flavoured one - it's bad enough as it is and I find it the best of the bunch!!

At the end of the day I guess more distance training is going to help - it's findling the bloody time with a young family...

GeorgeShaw

I think medical research has shown that there are a number of contributing factors - most listed here - but you can never know precisely why you cramp - it's a very individual thing. For me it's a combination of electrolyte loss - I now use Torq energy drink and take refills measured out in freezer bags with me - and under-training, or rather exertion beyond my current fitness level.

With the latter I've noticed that, as long as I'm not too far over the limit, I can now cycle through the cramp. It's just a question of gearing down a couple of gears for a few minutes and spinning more to reduce the muscular strain, making sure that I mix up in and out of the saddle and do some stretching. Over-exertion is just your muscles saying "I've had enough for now".

If you get cramp after an event, then that's much more likely to be electrolyte loss, though. I remember the early days lying on the floor as every muscle in my legs took turns to spasm ...
:shock:

slunker

I get cramp and tried all things, but if you suffer from fatigue cramp then your snookered.

coulcher

I used to suffer badly so trawled the internet for solutions and sadly the biggest single cause is something you can't do anything about - your genes. Some people drink nothing, do no stretching and have never cramped in their life - others like me and others replying on this thread try stretching, electrolytes etc and will occasional suffer. But as GeorgeShaw said in medicine they haven't been able to tie it down to any one thing.

If you do suffer, the most successful prevention seems to be training your body to cope with toughness of an event. I've avoided cramping since suffering really badly in the 2006 Etape (completed 2007 & 2008 Marmottes without a single cramp). However I sometimes get the muscle twinge feeling that we all know as an indication you may cramp. I do similar things to George. Vary in and out of the saddle, ease up a little, rub the muscle area a bit and it goes away.

This link explains a little of it: http://www.cptips.com/muspain.htm

So the Highclere event and any other tough event you do will all help reduce the risk of cramp on Ventoux by training your muscles to that toughness. I stretch, drink lots, eat bananas etc as well but look on in envy at my friend who does no of those and has never cramped despite sometimes bonking so he's definitely stressing his body.

Si C

Glad I found this post...I suffered my first real cramp problems in a Go-race event last night.
It was so bad in my calfs that the best I could do was hang on the back of the bunch and try and recover when it hit.

I did my first Go-race a couple of weeks ago, no cramp problems and a good finish. The difference this time rather than hide in the bunch I ran at the front a bit, tried to chase a break and went for the sprint at the end from a good position (which was futile as I ran out of steam and got swamped )

I spoke to a friend after the race, he seemed to think it was due to exceeding my lactate threshold....could that be true? I admit I know little about training/thresholds etc.

This morning my calfs feels quiet sore.

chrisw12

Ask yourself the question 'why do you suffer cramps during races only or doing hard efforts'.

I'm starting to believe that it's mostly down to being not fit enough for the derired level of exertion, all the others are red herrings/marketing ploys by the drinks companies.

Si C

chrisw12 wrote:

Ask yourself the question 'why do you suffer cramps during races only or doing hard efforts'.

I'm starting to believe that it's mostly down to being not fit enough for the derired level of exertion, all the others are red herrings/marketing ploys by the drinks companies.

I'd be happy with that. If it's a sign that I need to work harder then that's fine.

greeny12

chrisw12 wrote:

Ask yourself the question 'why do you suffer cramps during races only or doing hard efforts'.

I'm starting to believe that it's mostly down to being not fit enough for the derired level of exertion, all the others are red herrings/marketing ploys by the drinks companies.

I see where you're coming from, and you're probably right, but I was just surprised when on my first sportive this year, after a winter of much better training than ever before, and despite not pushing my pace at all, I suddenly got the cramps which I'd not previously suffered on that self-same course/distance.

I was just fishing for an answer to this conundrum, but it seems there could be a few factors at play here. Maybe I'm just getting too old (I'm 42)??!!

I'm glad I'm not the only one in this boat though!!

chrisw12

Just a little thought and this could be waaaaaay off base and I am so far from being expert in the cramping theories, but here goes.

If you read through the posts and listen to people, cramping seems to occur when near the limit of endurance. Take the example of 'when I stood up to climb, I imediately started getting cramps, when I sat back down they went' (or words to that effect)

Well it's pretty likely that when climbing out of the saddle power increased by quite a bit, so again you've pushed over the limit and hence you get cramps.

Well here's a thought, say by taking in the salts and the water, whatever the marketing says we should take, puts a limit on that increase in power, then hey presto, no cramps.

So in a way could the salts/water be limiting performance, stopping you from pushing near the edge? A long way out of the box thinking and probably wrong but who knows.

il_principe

I cramped really badly on the 2nd descent of the Bwlch at the Dragon this year. First cramp for ages and I'm sure it was as I'd only had one bottle of water with a Nunn tablet. I just forgot to take an extra one and I'm sure the lack of salts and the heat caused my cramp. I had High 5 from the feedstops (bleurgh) and 1 bottle of psp. I'm sure training and endurance all plays a massive part, but I've struggled far less since I introduced Nunn tablets to my rides... and no I'm in no way affiliated with Nunn!

skavanagh.bikeradar

I'd agreed that over exertion is a big contributing factor. I cramp a lot anyway, even off the bike when not cycling regularly especially in my feet and calves. As I've mentioned in a couple of other threads I used Hammer Endurolytes last year and I didn't get cramp once in any sportive (including the Marmotte) and it really helped reduce the incidence of off the bike night cramp and foot and calf cramp too. For me they work really well.

Mettan

I don't want to use the "B" word............ but............. Bananas - if you can't carry on your event there should be banana supplies at the food stops - eat one and drink whilst you stop. I top my bottles up with a bit of salt in addition to orange squash. And go easy on the gears to preserve your muscles for later on in Sportives.

sandbag

low calcium and magnesium are cause of muscle cramps. taking more calcium will reduce risk of osteporosos as well. magnesium really important for every bodily function.

bianchi777

I'm suffering from calf cramps/pain because I bought a computer for my bike on Monday and was keeping a very close eye on my average speed. It was a disappointing 16.7mph over 15 or so miles. Of course, I have to factor in traffic light stops and so on, but even so...I think I have overdone it as even though my average was only 16 or so, I was able to maintain 18/19mph into wind and with it behind me. The fastest I got was around 27mph.

Before I got the computer I was more relaxed as I have no idea how fast I was going. So I hope it helps me to improve my speed. I am slightly worried that I'm slowing down..even though I am supposedly entering peak fitness (22 years old)

ridleydan

I have suffered from cramping in my left calf, normally at the end of a race or time trial. From what I can gather, cramping is caused when the muscle is tired and low on salts/electrolytes etc. I had read somewhere that strengthening a muscle makes it less susceptible to cramps as it is not being worked to its maximum.
My left calf was less muscular than my right, so i started doing calf raises and can see/feel a difference in my left calf muscle. Since doing this, I have had no issues with cramps in my calves (touch wood). I tried the drinks etc., and they helped, so hopefully this solves the problem totally now.

knedlicky

I've never had cramps but some riding friends have when taking part in sportive-type events. My impression is that it's mainly over-exertion compared to training, so not so much the speed or the distance alone but a combination of both, especially if hills are involved.
During training, the friends don't get cramp at higher speed over shorter distances (< 40 miles) or moderate speed over longer distances (80+ miles) but during a sportive if they try and maintain high speeds over long distances, especially over hilly routes, then that's when they get cramps. This suggests they need to increase their intensity during training. Or not to take sportives so seriously!

nolf

Personally i always make sure on sportives I carry some salty/savoury foods with me to gulp down if I start to feel a bit tight or weird!

I'm really into the gels/energy bars and energy drinks, but nothing beats a huuge bag of kettle chips for avoiding cramp.
Not especially scientific but since I started eating crisps at stops I stopped cramping, so seems to work for me.

skavanagh.bikeradar

As with other aspects of on the bike fuelling you have to experiment and find what works for you. It took me several years of trying other things before finding something that works reliably. My next aspect to address is eating strategy as on a long, hard sportive I usually can't force down energy gloop (and I've tried a few now). Sarnies are the current thinking.........

Mark Alexander

After cramping on Marmotte last year, it was suggested that I drop a Nuun tablet into water
http://www.nuun.com/ I do this on long rides over 75 miles or just because of the great taste.

Water, water, food, water.

skavanagh.bikeradar

That's a big advanatage of Nuun or endurolytes you mention there Mark - you take some pills/capsules with you that take up next to no space and drop them into your water (nuun) or swallow them with water (endurolytes) so you don't need a bottle of specific 'electrolyte' drink and you don't need a bag of powder.

Mark Alexander

skavanagh.bikeradar wrote:

That's a big advanatage of Nuun or endurolytes you mention there Mark - you take some pills/capsules with you that take up next to no space and drop them into your water (nuun) or swallow them with water (endurolytes) so you don't need a bottle of specific 'electrolyte' drink and you don't need a bag of powder.

I've read the site, they're great, not to be confused with energy drinks though.
They're really tasty water!! lol

slunker

knedlicky wrote:

I've never had cramps but some riding friends have when taking part in sportive-type events. My impression is that it's mainly over-exertion compared to training, so not so much the speed or the distance alone but a combination of both, especially if hills are involved.
During training, the friends don't get cramp at higher speed over shorter distances (< 40 miles) or moderate speed over longer distances (80+ miles) but during a sportive if they try and maintain high speeds over long distances, especially over hilly routes, then that's when they get cramps. This suggests they need to increase their intensity during training. Or not to take sportives so seriously!

this is the type of cramp I am suffering from at the moment. I have recently got a cat 3 licence and in some E/1/2/3 race I'm fine for 3/4 distance then I get cramp in the same muscles every time!!!!.

What can I do to combat this?

Edwin

Hmmm, this sounds strangely familiar. I'm also a 3rd cat, and my legs fall to bits just before the end of an E/1/2/3 race. Normally around the point where it starts getting quicker. I'd assumed this was just due to being crap, rather than cramp

Seriously, I can only ride so hard for so long then my legs fall to bits, it's basically over exertion, and the only way round it is to get fitter, or conserve energy earlier in the race.

slunker

Yes, but trying to get fitter then take cramp, it's a bit catch 22!!!!

Edwin

I know what you mean, but if you've just gone up, then maybe you have to accept you are going to get a kicking this season, as it takes a while to get used to riding at the higher standard?
My stategy is to race as much as possible, and ride as hard as I can in every race. If I blow up, then fine, at least I've put the effort in. I did want to aim for 2nd cat, but that's probably not realistic this year, so I'm just busting myself up trying to get stronger every time. Might not be the best strategy, but it's the only one I've got!