Giro Stage 9 *Spoiler*

mididoctors

disgruntledgoat wrote:

And I'm quite sure he never wielded this much power over the TdF organisers when he was winning!

This was a ridiculous decision and, as somebody above points out, I have to race into oncoming traffic with open juntions and cars parked everywhere. Seriously, it's not that bad is it?

Also, good to see Cipo still knows how to break a strike!

he didn't try and neutralise the race when the tour was sent across a cobbled causeway covered in seaweed...TBF he had yet to get into his super bighead mode and he did appear to think twice about riding with the group that made it safely across

there are stupid stages in major tours and taking the tour of that causeway was just plain silly

and this crit was a bad idea but it was dealt with in a daft manner..

le_patron

I love the way the course is simply too dangerous for the riders H&S, but taking a cocktail of drugs and transfusions with major health implications and a group decision not to talk about it (as opossed to stopping mid-race to address the crowd on the subject) is just fine :roll: :roll: .

Sorry, bit unnecessary to bring PED's into it, but it does seem ironic.

DavMartinR

Thought this was a great comment by Zomegnan

"This circuit required explosive bursts. It required riders to get their butts up of the
seats of their bikes, and some riders who are not so young anymore apparently don't feel like doing that anymore. Instead, it seems like their legs became shorter and their tongues longer."[/i]

greeny12

DavMartinR wrote:

Thought this was a great comment by Zomegnan

"This circuit required explosive bursts. It required riders to get their butts up of the
seats of their bikes, and some riders who are not so young anymore apparently don't feel like doing that anymore. Instead, it seems like their legs became shorter and their tongues longer."[/i]

Yes, that legs shorter tongues longer line is an absolute classic - wonderful put down.

Not that His Lordship will care a jot, of course...

micron

Jeff Bernard is equally scathing in Equipe today:

Il a critiqué le parcours toute la semaine et les dangers supposés du tracé. Mais pour moi, ces critiques révèlent surtout ses limites sur le vélo. Ce sont toujours ceux qui sont à fond qui critiquent le parcours. Il sait pourtant que le cyclisme est un sport dangereux. Les arrivées en descente, les passages tortueux, ça a toujours existé. C'est ce qui donne du piquant aux courses. Armstrong doit se souvenir de l'étape du Tour de France qui s'était finie par une descente vers Gap où Joseba Beloki était tombé devant lui. A l'époque, il n'était pas aussi critique.

He's been critical all week of the supposed dangers of the route. For me, all those criticisms reveal are his own limitations on the bike. It's always those who're on the rivet who criticise the route. Above all he knows that cycling is a dangerous sport. Descending finishes, twisty roads, they've always existed. That's what gives a bit of spice to a race. Armstrong will remember the TdF stage stage which finished with a descent into Gap where Joseba Beloki feel in front of him. At that time, he wasn't critical.

LangerDan

micron wrote:

Jeff Bernard is equally scathing in Equipe today:

Il a critiqué le parcours toute la semaine et les dangers supposés du tracé. Mais pour moi, ces critiques révèlent surtout ses limites sur le vélo. Ce sont toujours ceux qui sont à fond qui critiquent le parcours. Il sait pourtant que le cyclisme est un sport dangereux. Les arrivées en descente, les passages tortueux, ça a toujours existé. C'est ce qui donne du piquant aux courses. Armstrong doit se souvenir de l'étape du Tour de France qui s'était finie par une descente vers Gap où Joseba Beloki était tombé devant lui. A l'époque, il n'était pas aussi critique.

He's been critical all week of the supposed dangers of the route. For me, all those criticisms reveal are his own limitations on the bike. It's always those who're on the rivet who criticise the route. Above all he knows that cycling is a dangerous sport. Descending finishes, twisty roads, they've always existed. That's what gives a bit of spice to a race. Armstrong will remember the TdF stage stage which finished with a descent into Gap where Joseba Beloki feel in front of him. At that time, he wasn't critical.

Didn't Jeff Bernard crash out of the Giro (and the maglia rosa) going through an unlit tunnel in the late 80s?
"Of course, we had it tough...."

Jeff Jones

Dan Friebe's written a good blog on it here: http://www.bikeradar.com/blogs/article/ ... ame--21659

iainf72

The Il Giornale comment is excellent.

Still, only cycling report got footage of the whole mess

DavMartinR

I thought LA was only riding to highlight Livestrong and getting in shape for the TdF?

What does he have over the peleton to be able to come back and dictate when they race?

Bronzie

LangerDan wrote:

I can't help but have the feeling that something else is going on in the background (and not just that a crit is the last thing some middle-aged guy with a dodgy collarbone wants.)

I suspect it has a lot more to do with the fact that the last 3 stages have totalled 700km - with another monster stage the day after the rest day. I reckon stage 9 was an "unofficial rest day".

A 155km crit halfway through the race is mad - crits should be short (1-2 hours max) if the organisers expect racing from the gun. I mean 4 hours blastin' in and out of corners is daft - it just isn't going to happen.

With regard to the lack of crowd barriers, Varese was completely closed down for the Worlds last September - barriers the whole way round the course. Probably too expensive to do this for a one-off stage over a 16km course, but then the organisers should have thought it through a bit better. Like Harmon said, they should have ridden into the centre like the normal Tour finish.

DaveyL

Lance has a friend in CFA

http://twitter.com/cyclingfansanon

Who'd a thunk it

afx237vi

Bronzie wrote:

LangerDan wrote:

I can't help but have the feeling that something else is going on in the background (and not just that a crit is the last thing some middle-aged guy with a dodgy collarbone wants.)

I suspect it has a lot more to do with the fact that the last 3 stages have totalled 700km - with another monster stage the day after the rest day. I reckon stage 9 was an "unofficial rest day".

A 155km crit halfway through the race is mad - crits should be short (1-2 hours max) if the organisers expect racing from the gun. I mean 4 hours blastin' in and out of corners is daft - it just isn't going to happen.

With regard to the lack of crowd barriers, Varese was completely closed down for the Worlds last September - barriers the whole way round the course. Probably too expensive to do this for a one-off stage over a 16km course, but then the organisers should have thought it through a bit better. Like Harmon said, they should have ridden into the centre like the normal Tour finish.

So why not just do what always happens - let a soft break of no-hopers go up the road and at least pretend your're racing, even if you're not.

I just don't understand the need for all the drama. The clandestine meetings in the Astana bus, Di Luca addressing the crowd halfway through the stage. If certain riders hadn't made such a big deal about it, no-one would have even noticed they weren't racing!

afx237vi

DaveyL wrote:

Lance has a friend in CFA

http://twitter.com/cyclingfansanon

Who'd a thunk it

I saw that too. Weird.

GroupOfOne MkII

Just on the point of the barriers, they didn't barrier the whole TTT course either, although I know that's a slightly different situation to yesterday's stage.

le_patron

afx237vi wrote:

I just don't understand the need for all the drama.

Italy & a big ego = drama

Bronzie

afx237vi wrote:

So why not just do what always happens - let a soft break of no-hopers go up the road and at least pretend your're racing, even if you're not.

Can't remember the last time there was a 155km crit halfway through a Grand Tour?

It would be majorly difficult for the bunch to get back a big time gap on a circuit like that - the advantage would definitely be with the smaller group of riders.

LangerDan

It was a 10 mile circuit - not exactly a crit. More like holding the Zolder World Champs in the moddle of the Giro.

Bronzie

Zolder didn't have 90 degree bends and hairpins - it was more like a motor racing circuit

emadden

Guys, I walked 75% of the circuit yesterday and let me tell you, IT WAS NOT DANGEROUS... All of the roads were very wide, 15m in places and whilst there were one or two 90 degree bends, there was plenty of space for the riders... on top of that:

(a) The tram lines did not run parallel to the course except for the 500meters from the Piazza del Duomo to the official start. The riders rode it neutralised at 10 kmph! There is a picture of a group of riders on the deck... That happened in the first 40meters. The usual embarassing crash that some times happens.

(b) The "cobbles" are not your Paris Roubaix type .. there are the typical giant Italian paving stones that are on the streets of a large number of Italian cities

(c) There was only one place on the circuit where there were parked cars. They were well visable and had marshalls blowing whistles and waving flags. The road at that point was about 20m wide.

(d) There was a comment, I think by Michael Rogers, about "two riders" who were not even in the race, on the circuit.... This is normal!! In every country in Europe where there is bike race you always have fans riding the course. The marshalls always try to get them off the circuit. I have been at races where I have seen local amateurs join into the back of the bunch. I have seen this at the Giro di Lombardia and the Paris Nice.

(e) As for the argument about barriers... come on... They dont put up barriers in the country side, so why do it in Milan? The crowds were concentrated at corners and all major corners where there could be any realistic chance of danger did have barriers.

(f) It was a dry 27 C do riders couldnt even play the wet and dangerous card.

I have a theory about all of this... certainly LA was behind it. An extra day of easy riding would suit him. Let me tell you, when they did start the race with three to go, LA was having a damn hard time holding wheels out of the corners. He was certainly trying his best, but looked in a bad state. He finished 10 mins down and in the roll-in looked to be in a bad state.

Yesterday's stage was an utter joke and I can tell you, many people watching near me were pee'd off. The worst thing is that most fans around the circuit were not aware of the strike. Each lap the lead car would just announce "Group together, 4th lap etc". Many fans were booing after a while.

Italian press today is giving quite a lot of space to the involvement of LA in the farce. It will be interesting to see how this pans out tomorrow

le_patron

Well Basso has now apologised for the farce

Pokerface

emadden wrote:

Guys, I walked 75% of the circuit yesterday and let me tell you, IT WAS NOT DANGEROUS... All of the roads were very wide, 15m in places and whilst there were one or two 90 degree bends, there was plenty of space for the riders... on top of that:


(c) There was only one place on the circuit where there were parked cars. They were well visable and had marshalls blowing whistles and waving flags. The road at that point was about 20m wide.


(e) As for the argument about barriers... come on... They dont put up barriers in the country side, so why do it in Milan? The crowds were concentrated at corners and all major corners where there could be any realistic chance of danger did have barriers.

I have a theory about all of this... certainly LA was behind it. An extra day of easy riding would suit him. Let me tell you, when they did start the race with three to go, LA was having a damn hard time holding wheels out of the corners. He was certainly trying his best, but looked in a bad state. He finished 10 mins down and in the roll-in looked to be in a bad state.

A few points. You say that there was only one small section where there were cars? I watched on TV and there were definitely SEVERAL sections with cars. In fact, there were cars everywhere that there were no barriers!

(Did anyone see the guy getting out of his car and opening the door as the peleton approached right around the time Voekler decided to go off the front?)

As far as barriers go - the reason why there are no barriers in the countryside is - beside the fact it would be impossible, is due to riders only passing by once - and usually fairly quickly. In a city centre crit where they do lap after lap, the course is usually barriered off.

Lastly - you say you were there and that you saw Armstrong having trouble keeping wheels coming out of corners? How many corners could you have seen!?

moray_gub

Pokerface wrote:

Lastly - you say you were there and that you saw Armstrong having trouble keeping wheels coming out of corners? How many corners could you have seen!?

Well he managed to conclude that none of the course was dangerous by walking 75% of it so i would imagine even if he only saw one corner that would be enough to form an opinion on every corner.

Philip S

Aren't we all missing the key point of today's stage here?

Which was:
Cav was going so fast in the final sprint that his Bingo shades couldn't keep up... They couldn't take the extreme G-forces and leapt off into the gutter with about 100 metres to go.

emadden

Pokerface wrote:

emadden wrote:

Guys, I walked 75% of the circuit yesterday and let me tell you, IT WAS NOT DANGEROUS... All of the roads were very wide, 15m in places and whilst there were one or two 90 degree bends, there was plenty of space for the riders... on top of that:


(c) There was only one place on the circuit where there were parked cars. They were well visable and had marshalls blowing whistles and waving flags. The road at that point was about 20m wide.


(e) As for the argument about barriers... come on... They dont put up barriers in the country side, so why do it in Milan? The crowds were concentrated at corners and all major corners where there could be any realistic chance of danger did have barriers.

I have a theory about all of this... certainly LA was behind it. An extra day of easy riding would suit him. Let me tell you, when they did start the race with three to go, LA was having a damn hard time holding wheels out of the corners. He was certainly trying his best, but looked in a bad state. He finished 10 mins down and in the roll-in looked to be in a bad state.

A few points. You say that there was only one small section where there were cars? I watched on TV and there were definitely SEVERAL sections with cars. In fact, there were cars everywhere that there were no barriers!

(Did anyone see the guy getting out of his car and opening the door as the peloton approached right around the time Voekler decided to go off the front?)

As far as barriers go - the reason why there are no barriers in the countryside is - beside the fact it would be impossible, is due to riders only passing by once - and usually fairly quickly. In a city centre crit where they do lap after lap, the course is usually barriered off.

Lastly - you say you were there and that you saw Armstrong having trouble keeping wheels coming out of corners? How many corners could you have seen!?

I dont think you can judge by what you saw on TV, versus what it was like being there. As I said, I walked 75% of the course and shot pictures at every corner...

stagehopper

Philip S wrote:

Aren't we all missing the key point of today's stage here?

Which was:
Cav was going so fast in the final sprint that his Bingo shades couldn't keep up... They couldn't take the extreme G-forces and leapt off into the gutter with about 100 metres to go.

I think the sonic boom he created as he accelerated blew them off.

frenchfighter

Great post emadden. I am in agreement.

Stop talking about LA - that is just what he wants you to do. He is a fragile attention seeking old man, way past it.

More to the point, Cavendish got a well deserved win, and to those who think it doesn't count bear in mind three points: Everyone had the same circumstances in that race so were all on level peggin, Cavendish was willing to race from the get-go and most importantly, look who came 2nd, 3rd and 4th - they were clearly going for it and so was Cav (he said he was going full gas) and he beat them.

frenchfighter

And now I am getting ride of my Di Luca avater given he was the protagonist.

Kléber

Zomegnan must be quiet upset with things. He spent a fortune bribing Armstrong to ride, only to find the full TV rights didn't make it to most US viewers. Now the rider he forked out for is telling him to fork off.

frenchfighter

From Zomegnan comments am I to assume that Jens was instrumental?! I really hope not...

"Di Luca was manipulated by a group of riders who have become the teams' means of fighting against the power of the race organizers. Yes, I'm talking about [Dario] Cioni and [Jens] Voigt. They're the riders' representatives on the UCI council. What happened in Milan was an attack on the race organizers.

DaveyL

Ironic that Zomegnan is worried about this situation destroying the credibility of his race when all the while Di Luca is in the pink jersey.