whats your beliefs?

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  • antfly
    antfly Posts: 3,276
    I understood alright.

    Shipman was a lone nutter though,with no cause whereas the bombers are in big groups.They don`t think what they are doing is unacceptable but a dutiful act that will get them into heaven and there are plenty of religous preachers telling them that.
    Smarter than the average bear.
  • finchy
    finchy Posts: 6,686
    antfly wrote:
    johnfinch surely you are not saying communism is worth another try because it hasn`t been done right yet.Give it up,people run countries not dead authors.

    I was merely pointing out that calling USSR or China communist is about as accurate as calling the Spanish Inquisition Christian.

    Discussing whether communism would or would not work wasn't my intention. On the other hand, I do believe that workplaces and communities could be democratised, and run on the basis of mutual interest - if you don't believe me then look at the number of co-operatives that exist today.
  • Barkiesnake
    Barkiesnake Posts: 244
    I'm pink, therfore i'm spam
    "If you think you can, or if you think you can't, your right" Henry Ford
  • stjohnswell
    stjohnswell Posts: 482
    Barkiesnake wrote:
    I'm pink, therfore i'm spam
    Beanpole wrote:
    I'm pink therefore I'm Spam

    Look out. The Pythonians are in.
  • Mithras
    Mithras Posts: 428
    antfly wrote:
    [

    Mithras is surely a viking.

    :D
    A vikeonabike in most other forums.
    I can afford to talk softly!....................I carry a big stick!
  • nasahapley
    nasahapley Posts: 717
    synchronicity wrote:
    My belief:
    You can't reason anyone out of something that they haven't reasoned themselves into.

    Spot on, succinctly sums up why arguing atheism v religion is like fixing wheels to a tomato - time consuming and entirely pointless. I don't know if anyone else visits the Guardian's 'Comment is Free' site, but this debate gets rehashed pretty much every week on there, and it's exactly the same each time (can be entertaining though).

    FWIW I'm an atheist, but I also believe that there's a lot of sense in what Jesus (to pick the religious figure I'm most familiar with) is thought to have said on a variety of topics. That 'do unto others as you would have done unto you' stuff - that's about right. It's just all the other bloodthirsty and supernatural stuff in the bible that stops me being a 'Christian'.
  • mmitchell88
    mmitchell88 Posts: 340
    teagar wrote:
    mmitchell88 wrote:
    My main problem with the atheist stance is that I read a lot of glib comments and my immediate response is 'oh yeah?'. I'm 37 yrs old. A trained chemist. None of this biology crap (joke!) - chemistry from age 14 to 28. Spent a lot of time examining the science v religion debate. But when I read comments like 'been an atheist all my life', my reaction is almost always 'you haven't thought about this really, have you?'. I mean, really.

    Oh. You have. Ok.


    I have no idea what you mean by that. :? You don't believe people who have never believed in gods/god or anything supernatural? Or do you think that those who do say that havn't given it enough thought? Or you do think that?

    Yes.
    Making a cup of coffee is like making love to a beautiful woman. It's got to be hot. You've got to take your time. You've got to stir... gently and firmly. You've got to grind your beans until they squeak.
    And then you put in the milk.
  • guilliano
    guilliano Posts: 5,495
    I see no reason to sit and ponder my belief that there is no god. I've just always believed that as long back as I can remember. What confirmed that I believed this was my mum's funeral (a Catholic funeral service) when I not only found a complete lack of comfort in what was being said, but actually though that what was being said during the service was a load of old tosh. I hoped it helped those that did believe in God, but for me it's just not true. When my time comes I hope my family and friends honour my wishes for a humanist funeral and that my ashes are scattered where I always enjoyed being..... out in the countryside with the wind on my face
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/guilliano/
  • teagar
    teagar Posts: 2,100
    mmitchell88 wrote:
    teagar wrote:
    mmitchell88 wrote:
    My main problem with the atheist stance is that I read a lot of glib comments and my immediate response is 'oh yeah?'. I'm 37 yrs old. A trained chemist. None of this biology crap (joke!) - chemistry from age 14 to 28. Spent a lot of time examining the science v religion debate. But when I read comments like 'been an atheist all my life', my reaction is almost always 'you haven't thought about this really, have you?'. I mean, really.

    Oh. You have. Ok.


    I have no idea what you mean by that. :? You don't believe people who have never believed in gods/god or anything supernatural? Or do you think that those who do say that havn't given it enough thought? Or you do think that?

    Yes.

    :?: :roll:
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • teagar
    teagar Posts: 2,100
    antfly wrote:
    I understood alright.

    Shipman was a lone nutter though,with no cause whereas the bombers are in big groups.They don`t think what they are doing is unacceptable but a dutiful act that will get them into heaven and there are plenty of religous preachers telling them that.


    Big groups? C'mon... We're talking an ultra minority here. Just because it gets reported a lot doesn't mean there's a lot of it about. If there was a lot of it about, it probably wouldn't get reported as often, since it would be common place. A bit like fatal car accidents, which rarely make the national news.

    Islam is just like any other religion! It's fine!

    It has extremist elements, but what cause/faith/ideology doesn't? Most political causes do, religious causes do. They're not the problem. It's the people who are doing the extremist stuff that are the problem! Don't cave into the Islamophobia!

    Religion's fine, it helps an awful lot of people, and very occasionally it is manipulated for extremist means. I'd venture most of the apparantly religiously motivated attacks are largely political anyway. Certainly the terror attacks in the last decade were...
    Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie.
  • Jay dubbleU
    Jay dubbleU Posts: 3,159
    Pastafarian - on the assumption that if you belong to one religion and there are 'n' religions on Earth then the number of Hells awaiting you is 'n-1'
  • switchback18
    switchback18 Posts: 617
    pottssteve wrote:
    switchback,
    How do you know?
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking your faith. It's just that I find it difficult to subscribe to any organised religion. If there is a "God", surely it's just a simplification of what God really is? God as I understand is consciousness, empathy, understanding, tolerance and hard work. God is not wearing your best clothes on Sunday and going to confession. You don't need the religious pantomime if God really does exist, because it is in you all the time. The religion provides a reassurance that you are right, it doesn't provide God.

    You are totally right about the religious stuff - I don't see God say anywhere in the Bible that he cares about the best clothes on Sunday stuff. In fact he says the opposite.
    How do I know? This is the bit that can always be taken as arrogance I guess. But for me, to say that i've discovered that a higher being is interested in my life, without me deserving it, doesn't give me any credit. Back to how I know - God makes a lot of promises in the bible, mostly with conditions. I've found that he comes through on them, which is what I meant by God doing stuff in everyday life. The local church I go to isn't so 'religious' - it's purpose I guess is basically for people to share their appreciation of God. As far as I can see, a lot of religion is concerned with finding a formula that will get God to do what we want him to, which is a bit flawed in it's reasoning!
    chasingtrails.com | twitter | facebook
  • cakewalk
    cakewalk Posts: 220
    post the enlightenment religion is best regarded as a form of mental illness/mass hysteria.
    "I thought of it while riding my bicycle."
  • Peyote
    Peyote Posts: 2,189
    nasahapley wrote:
    <snip> but I also believe that there's a lot of sense in what Jesus (to pick the religious figure I'm most familiar with) is thought to have said on a variety of topics. That 'do unto others as you would have done unto you' stuff - that's about right. It's just all the other bloodthirsty and supernatural stuff in the bible that stops me being a 'Christian'.

    I'm with you on this, I reckon that Jesus chap would've made a much better politician than a relegious figurehead*. Assuming that the politics didn't automatically corrupt him of course.


    *Though having said that he's been quite succesful in this role too...
  • cakewalk
    cakewalk Posts: 220
    Peyote wrote:
    nasahapley wrote:
    <snip> but I also believe that there's a lot of sense in what Jesus (to pick the religious figure I'm most familiar with) is thought to have said on a variety of topics. That 'do unto others as you would have done unto you' stuff - that's about right. It's just all the other bloodthirsty and supernatural stuff in the bible that stops me being a 'Christian'.

    I'm with you on this, I reckon that Jesus chap would've made a much better politician than a relegious figurehead*. Assuming that the politics didn't automatically corrupt him of course.


    *Though having said that he's been quite succesful in this role too...

    He was a politician (alebit a devout Jew). we made him a religious figurehead.
    "I thought of it while riding my bicycle."
  • Peyote
    Peyote Posts: 2,189
    cakewalk wrote:

    He was a politician (alebit a devout Jew). we made him a religious figurehead.

    Shame really.

    I guess the two aren't necessarily mutually incompatible anyway.
  • guilliano
    guilliano Posts: 5,495
    Didn't Jesus say NOT to build temples to him? And haven't The Church made a damn good living doing exactly what Jesus didn't want them to do?
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/guilliano/
  • pottssteve
    pottssteve Posts: 4,069
    guilliano wrote:
    Didn't Jesus say NOT to build temples to him? And haven't The Church made a damn good living doing exactly what Jesus didn't want them to do?

    He also said not to worship false idols, so where does that leave Celtic fans.....? :wink:
    Head Hands Heart Lungs Legs
  • finchy
    finchy Posts: 6,686
    guilliano wrote:
    Didn't Jesus say NOT to build temples to him? And haven't The Church made a damn good living doing exactly what Jesus didn't want them to do?

    He also said something about the wealthy, getting to heaven, a camel and the eye of a needle. Looks like the head of the CofE (the Queen) took heed of that advice then.

    I think that people will always use religion to justify their own beliefs - basically, if they're a decent person they'll see the love and forgiveness side of the religion, others will just use it to be judgemental or worse.

    Likewise the issue of killing in the name of faith. Believing that your soul is the property of a divine being can lead to one of two conclusions - either that all souls are sacred, and only (a) god can choose when to take it away. Or that the man who understands the will of god can wield this power.

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