Cycle Facility of the Month - March Facility

UndercoverElephant

Excellent site! Here's one I have to contend with every morning, ( http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 77,,0,25.4 )

Anyone got any ideas how I should get onto it?

Wallace1492

UndercoverElephant wrote:

Excellent site! Here's one I have to contend with every morning, ( http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 77,,0,25.4 )

Anyone got any ideas how I should get onto it?

See yours and raise you getting into this bad boy: http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 7&t=h&z=17

OldSkoolKona

UndercoverElephant wrote:

Excellent site! Here's one I have to contend with every morning, ( http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 77,,0,25.4 )

Anyone got any ideas how I should get onto it?

UE, is that one really that bad? It gets rid of the issue of cyclists who are going straight on feeling that they have to stay on the gutter and then getting left hooked by the cars in the left lane. Only works where the road is wide enough

Compare to this junction, near me, where unconfident cyclists often get stuck in the left lane (which is left turn only).

kurako

One of my favourites. Coming down a hill. Do you swerve onto the reverse camber cycle path bit which is covered in gravelly crud or go straight on risking getting rear ended by the tin can behind?

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Burntwood+Ln,+London+SW17,+UK&sll=51.500836,-0.123167&sspn=0.018567,0.037208&g=london&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Burntwood+Ln,+London+SW17,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.437169,-0.182562&spn=0.00404,0.018604&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.437172,-0.18256&panoid=fQTuaocWugf5LpM99IbxRQ&cbp=11,227.45,,0,11.96

OldSkoolKona

Kurako wrote:

One of my favourites. Coming down a hill. Do you swerve onto the reverse camber cycle path bit which is covered in gravelly crud or go straight on risking getting rear ended by the tin can behind?

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Burntwood+Ln,+London+SW17,+UK&sll=51.500836,-0.123167&sspn=0.018567,0.037208&g=london&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Burntwood+Ln,+London+SW17,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.437169,-0.182562&spn=0.00404,0.018604&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.437172,-0.18256&panoid=fQTuaocWugf5LpM99IbxRQ&cbp=11,227.45,,0,11.96

Gargh, that pinch point chincanery is a night mare. If only councils spent money getting rid of pinch points rather than wasting it on pointless (and dangerous) cycle lanes...

ketka82

This one makes me laugh on the way home everyday. Good old Chiswick High Road:

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 2,,1,14.24

ketka82

Another one of my faves on the Hanworth Road in Hounslow.

Unfortunately, the Google street view picture seems to have been taken during the day when everyone is at work so doesn't fully display the lunacy. Usually the cars are parked up bumper to bumper on either side of the cycle path and more often than not they're parked like the Golf in the photo. All this means about a kilometre of door-zone dodging along a cycle path about a foot wide!!

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 1,,0,23.36

deptfordmarmoset

And this poor chappie doesn't seem to know which way he should be looking for oncoming cyclists - the lanes are pointing at him from all directions!

(Where Plumstead meets Woolwich)

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 18.18,,0,5

OldSkoolKona

ketka82 wrote:

Another one of my faves on the Hanworth Road in Hounslow.

Unfortunately, the Google street view picture seems to have been taken during the day when everyone is at work so doesn't fully display the lunacy. Usually the cars are parked up bumper to bumper on either side of the cycle path and more often than not they're parked like the Golf in the photo. All this means about a kilometre of door-zone dodging along a cycle path about a foot wide!!

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 1,,0,23.36

That one is just scary, how could anyone think that was safe. As ever, the car is king and the cyclists are just an afterthought - would be safer on the road. If anything the only reason for the cycle lane is to give space to get out of your car, unbelievable. :?

Specialized Needs

OldSkoolKona wrote:

ketka82 wrote:

Another one of my faves on the Hanworth Road in Hounslow.

Unfortunately, the Google street view picture seems to have been taken during the day when everyone is at work so doesn't fully display the lunacy. Usually the cars are parked up bumper to bumper on either side of the cycle path and more often than not they're parked like the Golf in the photo. All this means about a kilometre of door-zone dodging along a cycle path about a foot wide!!

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 1,,0,23.36

That one is just scary, how could anyone think that was safe. As ever, the car is king and the cyclists are just an afterthought - would be safer on the road. If anything the only reason for the cycle lane is to give space to get out of your car, unbelievable. :?

Similar doorzone lane for half a mile up Eltham Hill in SE London:

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 27595&z=15

Nice wiggles in and out for the junction in the distance, too (although no such wiggle on the previous junction). Fun in the dark, with buses coming past up the hill :?

Mr_Cellophane

duncedunce wrote:

Similar doorzone lane for half a mile up Eltham Hill in SE London:

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 27595&z=15

Nice wiggles in and out for the junction in the distance, too (although no such wiggle on the previous junction). Fun in the dark, with buses coming past up the hill :?

How that should be done (Barking and Dagenham)

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 72405&z=15

OldSkoolKona

Some great photos now up on the Guardian page:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/g ... =355167389

My favourite has to be this one:

roger_merriman

Attica wrote:

OldSkoolKona wrote:

Ah, these trees

Show off!

but yes, those ruddy trees, oddly enough I've never used that bike path

yes there lovely, equally hard to miss if young and drunk I found, when I was both of the above!

my fav in london town I've found is thishttp://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=51.402753,-0.206219&spn=0,359.983553&z=17&layer=c&cbll=51.402754,-0.206368&panoid=GDymsMyZo4TCabU82o5RGg&cbp=12,282.01,,0,27.5

the cycle path is steeply ramped so unless very slow would be good place to pratice one's drop offs....

OldSkoolKona

Really liked this comment from the original blog, hits the nail on the head about cycle lanes:

There are things that look dangerous and are (base jumping)
Things that look dangerous and aren't (fairground rides)
Things that look safe and are (drinking tea and listening to radio 4)
Things that look safe and aren't. (Cycle lanes)

BentMikey

Ah, good signature, that!

secretdancer

Long time lurker... thought it was about time I got involved!

Believe it or not thisis the starting post for a joint footpath/cycle lane on park of my route. Runs to the right of the signpost. Trees and usual furniture may be a nuisance but a few yards down the lane it turns into this!
Same pavement/cycle lane/car park which comes with the added bonus of a wheelie bin slalom on Mondays!

MonkeyMonster

This is still a cycle facility... just not in this country

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/v ... -bike-tree

quite cool though

Aidy

The one that always gets me is the one outside the Asda in Edmonton.

Are you supposed to charge up it and fly through the pedestrians, or what?

I'll try and get a picture of it at some stage - annoyingly it looks to have been put in place after the streetview picture.

biondino

Here's a path many may recognise - the road in front (where the van's going) is the Marc Bolan Death Bridge on Queen's Ride, Putney/Barnes.

The longer of the two bike lanes makes a certain amount of sense, as it misses out a mini-roundabout. The shorter, though, is useless to anyone coming from the viewer's perspective, as they'll have already made a very simple left turn onto a very quiet private road.

Coming from the mini-roundabout, though, you have to stop immediately, wedge yourself into the cycle box in the middle of the road, before joining a, what, 5 yard lane (it expires where the bike is painted, far left) before joining the cul-de-sac that almost no-one uses, especially as it's all gravelled and pot-holed to buggery.

OldSkoolKona

BentMikey wrote:

Ah, good signature, that!

I see you use it in 'the other place' ;-)

always_tyred

There's a perfect crescent shaped cycle lane about 15 feet long in Berwick on Tweed somewhere, going from the side of a road to the side of the same road about 10 feet further on. Anyone know it?

OldSkoolKona

Not sure if people have seen this article, by John Franklin, the author of Cyclecraft, about the misconception that cycle paths make things safer. A useful document to use if you need to explain to people the reality of most cycle lanes:

http://www.cyclecraft.co.uk/digest/cfi_jaf.pdf

simple_salmon

But for certain types of cyclists there are some cycle paths that are useful, good, serve a purpose and allow them to cycle when the alternative would be to drive.

I spoke to John Franklin about this issue and IMHO he is too willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

By all means highlight poor facilities but to many cyclists the removal of all cycle paths would be a retrograde step.

Wallace1492

Most cycle facilities have their hearts in the right place, but why are they not designed in collaberation with real cyclists?

Simple, are maybe the paths you are talking about not lulling some people into a false sense of security, they see a cycle path and think it must be safe, therefore I can cycle on it. I think that is what John is saying - don't be fooled, that just because there is a cycle lane that it is safe.

Some will be safer of course, but some will not.

Porgy

Wallace1492 wrote:

Most cycle facilities have their hearts in the right place, but why are they not designed in collaberation with real cyclists?

The arrogance of local authority planners and engineers. They know best.

simple_salmon

Wallace1492 wrote:

Most cycle facilities have their hearts in the right place, but why are they not designed in collaberation with real cyclists?

Simple, are maybe the paths you are talking about not lulling some people into a false sense of security, they see a cycle path and think it must be safe, therefore I can cycle on it. I think that is what John is saying - don't be fooled, that just because there is a cycle lane that it is safe.

Some will be safer of course, but some will not.

The particular path I have in mind is traffic free but from the conversation I had with John it appeared that he was against all cycle paths - I may be wrong and I don't want to put words into his mouth.

What I do know is that a significant number of our staff cyclists would go back to their cars if this route was no longer available.

I'm all for a mixture of approaches to encourage cycle commuting - cycle paths for those that want them; driver education and enforcement for those who want to ride on the roads - I find myself falling into different camps depending on which particular cycling cap (helmet?) I'm wearing e.g. racer, commuter, parent.

Wallace1492

simple_salmon wrote:

Wallace1492 wrote:

Most cycle facilities have their hearts in the right place, but why are they not designed in collaberation with real cyclists?

Simple, are maybe the paths you are talking about not lulling some people into a false sense of security, they see a cycle path and think it must be safe, therefore I can cycle on it. I think that is what John is saying - don't be fooled, that just because there is a cycle lane that it is safe.

Some will be safer of course, but some will not.

The particular path I have in mind is traffic free but from the conversation I had with John it appeared that he was against all cycle paths - I may be wrong and I don't want to put words into his mouth.

What I do know is that a significant number of our staff cyclists would go back to their cars if this route was no longer available.

I'm all for a mixture of approaches to encourage cycle commuting - cycle paths for those that want them; driver education and enforcement for those who want to ride on the roads - I find myself falling into different camps depending on which particular cycling cap (helmet?) I'm wearing e.g. racer, commuter, parent.

Fair point, traffic free should be pretty good, if they are also pedestrian free, and possibly have a centre line. I certainly would not agree that all are bad, but the more I see a lot of them, the more I dislike them, I am mainly talking about roadside ones. As to the shares pavements, what a joke....

kurako

Franklin stated that poor facilities are worse than no facilities and I have to agree with that. If you're going to have cycle paths then they should be safe and well designed and not an afterthought.

One point that simple_salmon touched on is that even cyclists have different requirements. Some are happy to pootle along on a segregated path whereas other riders are fine in the general traffic.

The use of cycle facilities should definitely not be compulsory as I believe has been proposed in some places ( Australia? ). To do so would cause as much chaos as an invalid carriage on a motorway.

OldSkoolKona

Porgy wrote:

Wallace1492 wrote:

Most cycle facilities have their hearts in the right place, but why are they not designed in collaberation with real cyclists?

The arrogance of local authority planners and engineers. They know best.

The frustrating thing is there is a really good design standard, that if council engineers followed, most of these issues would be avoided!

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/businessandpartne ... /2766.aspx

(a bit of bed time reading to get through that lot!

rjsterry

Just had a look at the TFL Design Guide for cycle facilities. Depressing that someone has clearly worked out in great detail how cycle lanes, etc. should be built, and then this information is so routinely ignored/subverted. I wonder how many local authority employees who should know about this document have read it. I bet a copy has never been seen in the hands of a contractor with a barrow of green tarmac either.