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Rugby clean afterall....

dealdeal Posts: 857
edited August 2009 in Pro race
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_u ... 746770.stm
A doping charge against Scott MacLeod has been dropped after investigators accepted that his high levels of testosterone were triggered by alcohol.

I wonder the excuse will be the next (third) time he tests positive for something? maybe he should get onto Floyd and ask for some ideas
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  • Other sports simply look after their "investments" and shout cycling as loud as possible.
    A disgraceful decision, but hardly surprising, seeing how they all now look like NFL failed draft picks. :evil:
    "Science is a tool for cheaters". An anonymous French PE teacher.
  • And I thought it was Estrogen that was in alcohol??

    So were the hell are my man boobs coming from :?: :?: :D
  • DaveyLDaveyL Posts: 5,167
    The reporting has been low-key. Presumably they have conducted an isotope ratio mass spec test on the sample and it has not turned up synthetic testosterone - it is WADA protocol to go to IRMS if the T/E ratio test flags up a positive. But no-one seems to have come out and said this, instead we hear about bizarre reasons why his testosterone was elevated. I would like to hear someone say the IRMS returned a negative.

    Ian Morrison, of the SoS, seems to have a source:

    http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/12 ... 4630405.jp

    "Reliable sources have suggested that MacLeod's IRMS tests have found nothing synthetic in his body..."

    "We understand that MacLeod's TE ratio was above the permitted 4:1 but well below the 11:1 reading that Floyd Landis gave."

    But I would like to see something a bit more official than this.

    And this is worrying:

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/ ... 014492.ece

    "Those keen to speculate whether MacLeod is telling the truth should note that of 21 cases involving abnormal levels of testosterone investigated by UK Sport over the past two years, 20 were found to have a physiological explanation. "

    Oh really?
    Le Blaireau (1)
  • I think it says something pretty depressing about professional sports and the attitude of its administrators and participants when cycling is the standard bearer by which your attitude to doping will be judged. But this is now becoming true - cycling pervsely is the only sport that is demonstrably addressing its problems. It ain't perfect but it's better than this sort of 'dog ate my homework' censored . He'd be finished if he were a cyclist in the current (improved) climate.
  • redddraggonredddraggon Posts: 10,862
    hardly surprising, seeing how they all now look like NFL failed draft picks. :evil:

    I think that's slightly unfair to rugby. OK there will be some who need some chemical help, but I bet there's loads (the great majority) of players who are naturally well built. I'm well built, and was good at rugby, haven't played rugby or trained for about 18months, but I've still got most of the upper body bulk even though I've tried to lose it - I bet if I did same weights and training as the Rugby pros I'd be just as well built. There's always going to be dopers in every sport, but I wouldn't assume the majority do it. Most players don't really seem that bulky to me anyway , just tall.....
    I like bikes...

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  • SpaceJunkSpaceJunk Posts: 1,157
    DavMartinR wrote:
    And I thought it was Estrogen that was in alcohol??

    So were the hell are my man boobs coming from :?: :?: :D

    lol
  • Wallabies to pip Wales on Saturday! :P
  • Interesting tgo remember that this is the same player who was found guilty of using an undeclared asthma remedy in place of the opne which he was allowed. I undertstand that this case was dropped as no-one at his club had thought fit to either update his records or inform the testing authorities.

    I wonder how"proffessional" this makes either the player or his club seem.
  • Alain Quay wrote:
    Wallabies to pip Wales on Saturday! :P

    Probably will be the case, yes. :cry:
  • Rugby clean? Pah yeah right. I have three friends who played top top level rugby and were on the juice. I saw 2 out of three actually taking it and buying it from our local gym.
    There is never redemption, any fool can regret yesterday...

    Be Pure! Be Vigilant! Behave!
  • hommelbierhommelbier Posts: 1,536
    With the case of the Bath three in the news again this week, I was interested to read the following article about the state of the game (Rugby League) in Australia.
    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25826883-2722,00.html
  • afx237viafx237vi Posts: 12,630
    hommelbier wrote:
    With the case of the Bath three in the news again this week, I was interested to read the following article about the state of the game (Rugby League) in Australia.
    http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25826883-2722,00.html

    ...some players were mixing prescription sleeping drug Stilnox with energy drink Red Bull.

    Weak. Someone give 'em a recipe for Pot Belge ffs.
  • knedlickyknedlicky Posts: 3,097
    deal wrote:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/scottish/7746770.stm
    A doping charge against Scott MacLeod has been dropped after investigators accepted that his high levels of testosterone were triggered by alcohol.
    After 6 beers or 1½ litres of wine, in fact even before then, I have the impression my testosterone level drops. And hasn’t much recovered next morning.

    I’m glad to say I saw in the newspaper this morning, the first suggestion that swimmers at the World Championships in Rome may be doped. I felt this must be the case the other day, when I heard record after record had been broken. But it appears the idea of doping only surfaced in the press after it was admitted that no blood tests were being performed.

    It would be good if the media were to go pick up on this more (and on the Jamaica athletes recently caught) but I suspect it won’t be the case.
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 25,477
    knedlicky wrote:

    I’m glad to say I saw in the newspaper this morning, the first suggestion that swimmers at the World Championships in Rome may be doped. I felt this must be the case the other day, when I heard record after record had been broken. But it appears the idea of doping only surfaced in the press after it was admitted that no blood tests were being performed.

    All the swimming records are down to the new swimsuits they're wearing - lots of controversy about them.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • markwalkermarkwalker Posts: 953
    RichN95 wrote:
    knedlicky wrote:

    I’m glad to say I saw in the newspaper this morning, the first suggestion that swimmers at the World Championships in Rome may be doped. I felt this must be the case the other day, when I heard record after record had been broken. But it appears the idea of doping only surfaced in the press after it was admitted that no blood tests were being performed.

    All the swimming records are down to the new swimsuits they're wearing - lots of controversy about them.

    Yeah I need a skin suit like that :) (some training and less drinking might help too)
  • DavMartinR wrote:
    And I thought it was Estrogen that was in alcohol??

    So were the hell are my man boobs coming from :?: :?: :D
    Tons of Estrogen in alcohol. A recent scientific experiment gave a group of men 10 pints of beer each. They all started talking nonsense and became really bad drivers. :D
    time flies like an arrow
    fruit flies like a banana
  • The swimming was raising my eyebrows and the thing about the suit........even people not reading and talking about doping in sport (like I tend to), that is normal people, have said to me "it can't be the suit!". It's a distraction and a handy one to avoid talking about the real reaons. Perhaps.
  • andyracandyrac Posts: 623
    The swimming was raising my eyebrows and the thing about the suit........even people not reading and talking about doping in sport (like I tend to), that is normal people, have said to me "it can't be the suit!". It's a distraction and a handy one to avoid talking about the real reaons. Perhaps.

    We were talking about this in work yesterday - there's no way those records are just down to the swimsuits! The German who beat Phelps, has improved by 4-7 seconds, and with other records being broken.....erm, no, sorry, not having it - swimsuits.....my @r5e!
    And why no blood tests.....?? :x A joke.....

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  • disgruntledgoatdisgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    As I can't imagine there's much of a crossover between the fanbase of Cycling and Rugby League, some of you may be unaware that Wakefield have had a 30 year old player die sof a heart attack in a weights session, another die on the field from a seizure (non-trauma), a third nearly die on the operating table from cardiac arrest and a fourth contract khrons deisease in the space of a season.

    "I don't know why we attract such bad luck" says the coach of the team who's results have improved massively in the last 12 months. All the league fans I know just don't want to even entertain the possibility that without some unifying factor the odds of four such occurances befalling the same group of 40 players are simply ridculous. My experience of cycling leads me to suspect though...
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • GyatsoLaGyatsoLa Posts: 667
    I was astonished when I read that they don't do testing for swimmers, especially after the Michelle de Bruin debacle (won several gold medals in Atlanta Olympics in dubious circumstances, tested positive a few years later). From what I understand about swimsuits is that they may encourage doping. One benefit of them is that they can make an otherwise overmuscled swimmer more streamlined - hence it is 'alleged' that it encourages a different type of training. It will be interesting to see what times are achieved once they are banned.
  • andyracandyrac Posts: 623
    As I can't imagine there's much of a crossover between the fanbase of Cycling and Rugby League, some of you may be unaware that Wakefield have had a 30 year old player die sof a heart attack in a weights session, another die on the field from a seizure (non-trauma), a third nearly die on the operating table from cardiac arrest and a fourth contract khrons deisease in the space of a season.

    "I don't know why we attract such bad luck" says the coach of the team who's results have improved massively in the last 12 months. All the league fans I know just don't want to even entertain the possibility that without some unifying factor the odds of four such occurances befalling the same group of 40 players are simply ridculous. My experience of cycling leads me to suspect though...

    It's got to be more than a coincidence, hasn't it?

    Every other sport's fans are incredibly naive when it comes to doping - as far as they're concerned - their sport/sports are clean. Not helped by the 'omerta' of the gutless press.

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  • alex16zxalex16zx Posts: 153
    Sadly after the youth player at Wakefield died so soon after Adam Watene, the first thought in my head was 'Steroids'. I think the problem is that, perfectly understandably, noone wants to insult the memories of those players by coming out and saying anything, but do we have to have more incidents before people look into it?

    As for the state of the game in Australia...where do we start? :lol: Unfortunately though Aus and NZ are coming over here for the Four Nations with us and France in the Autumn and we nearly lost sponsorship because of their scandals. Thankfully Gillette are on board though as main sponsor.
  • SunWuKongSunWuKong Posts: 364
    Rugby clean? Pah yeah right. I have three friends who played top top level rugby and were on the juice. I saw 2 out of three actually taking it and buying it from our local gym.

    Me too, Rugby League, he says it is very common.
  • disgruntledgoatdisgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    SunWuKong wrote:
    Rugby clean? Pah yeah right. I have three friends who played top top level rugby and were on the juice. I saw 2 out of three actually taking it and buying it from our local gym.

    Me too, Rugby League, he says it is very common.

    I know about 75% of my team (Warrington) are on the juice... You meant lager right? :wink:

    As far as Wakey go, you're right people don't want ot insult their memory, particularly in such a sentimental, close knit sport. But I think for me, it's worse for everybody to continue without questioning anything. It doens't help us avoid another 30 year old father of 2 or 18 year old dying for reasons unknown.
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • PirahnaPirahna Posts: 1,315
    A doping charge against Scott MacLeod has been dropped after investigators accepted that his high levels of testosterone were triggered by alcohol.

    I bet Landis wishes he had the same investigators.
  • Philip SPhilip S Posts: 398
    As far as Wakey go, you're right people don't want ot insult their memory, particularly in such a sentimental, close knit sport. But I think for me, it's worse for everybody to continue without questioning anything. It doens't help us avoid another 30 year old father of 2 or 18 year old dying for reasons unknown.

    Insulting people's memory is one thing, but surely if the insinuations are true we're getting into the realms of manslaughter here? Which, to my unsentimental world view, means it's more of an insult to their memory not to go after the callous/heartless/naive/stupid (delete as appropriate) b*stards who suggested that they dope/supplied them with the stuff.
  • alex16zxalex16zx Posts: 153
    Manslaughter? If they were taking it willingly I doubt it could be manslaughter, although the people suggesting it/supplying them would presumably be culpable for that.
  • drewfromriscadrewfromrisca Posts: 1,165
    I see those 3 Bath players got a 9 month ban yesterday. Bit pathetic really isn't it?
    There is never redemption, any fool can regret yesterday...

    Be Pure! Be Vigilant! Behave!
  • andyracandyrac Posts: 623
    I see those 3 Bath players got a 9 month ban yesterday. Bit pathetic really isn't it?

    And they have the temerity to appeal the ban - they should be thanking their lucky stars they 'got off' so lightly. It should really be 2 years!!

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  • AndyRAC wrote:
    I see those 3 Bath players got a 9 month ban yesterday. Bit pathetic really isn't it?

    And they have the temerity to appeal the ban - they should be thanking their lucky stars they 'got off' so lightly. It should really be 2 years!!

    To their credit the RFL did ensure that Gareth Hock and his tattooed neck will be seeking alternative employment for 2 years.
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
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