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Training Bible?

richaricha Posts: 1,634
edited September 2008 in Training, fitness and health
Are these any good?

The Cyclist's Training Bible by Joe Friel
A Companion to the Cyclist's Training Bible by Joe Friel

I have a few training books already but none of them hit the mark...
- Smart Cycling: Successful Training and Racing for Riders... (Arnie Baker)
- The Ultimate Ride: Get Fit,Get Fast,and Start Winning with the World's Top (Carmichael)
- The Lance Armstrong Performance Program: Seven Weeks to the Perfect Ride
- Long distance cyclists handbook

I am looking for some guidelines on training purely for 8hrs endurance (Marmotte).
Rich

Posts

  • SunWuKongSunWuKong Posts: 364
    Whilst I don't disagree with the criticisms of Friel's book, in fairness to him he has updated his view on training and sepcifically training with power.
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    Hi Rich,

    That cyclingforums thread was spot on, there are a lot of positives in the CTB related to periodization and long term goal setting and planning. The details are not so great. One of the most fantastic parts of using a power meter has been how my training has been overhauled - in conjunction with the PM chart in WKO. For this reason I would urge you to try out a power meter for a couple of months and get a copy of racing and training with a power meter.

    if you PM me I can lend you my copy of the CTB and TARWAPM - then you can make a more informed decision?
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • BeaconRuthBeaconRuth Posts: 2,086
    I wouldn't take the lofty high ground that many of the Cyclingforum posters take, but I doubt that Friel's book will hit the right note for you in training for the Marmotte in any case. There's some good common sense in it, but as far as structured training is concerned, to me it seemed more appropriate for road racers than any other type of cyclist.

    If I were you I wouldn't look for one book that 'hits the mark' for you - there's no such thing. Dip in to as many books as you can, extract the useful bits and disregard the inappropriate bits. Everyone is unique and needs to do things their own way.

    Ruth
  • I'm still waiting for the following title to appear:

    "The Cyclist Training Bible for The Bloke with Kids, a Wife, a job, family, friends, limited financial resources, DIY projects to do, Professional Development to Undertake, Who Is Training For the Marmotte, Target Time 10 hours on 8 hours training a week, no power tap or computrainer available."
  • I'm still waiting for the following title to appear:

    "The Cyclist Training Bible for The Bloke with Kids, a Wife, a job, family, friends, limited financial resources, DIY projects to do, Professional Development to Undertake, Who Is Training For the Marmotte, Target Time 10 hours on 8 hours training a week, no power tap or computrainer available."
    Try Amazon. They've got everything. And all at very competitive prices :wink:
    'How can an opinion be bullsh1t?' High Fidelity
  • richaricha Posts: 1,634
    I thought I'd found THE training manual for my 8hr Marmotte. Now I hear it is not all that.

    Hmmm. Back to the drawing board. Maybe if I did less drawing and actually started trauining I'd be in better shape.

    My penance is going to be two months of long slow rides...
    Rich
  • I thought LSD was old hat these days?
  • Well, I'm back at the start again now :(

    I've recently bought the CTB and was about 90 pages into it and close to actually composing some sort training plan. After reading this thread, and the cyclingforums one, I don't know what to do?

    I'm back at the start again.

    It seems that, good, decent information is hard to come by :?

    Richie
  • BeaconRuthBeaconRuth Posts: 2,086
    Follow the CTB, Richie. There's enough good sense in it to get you a long way. You can find fault with any book about anything if you try hard enough and the Cyclingforums afficianados are just revelling in the delight of picking holes because they can - that's the job of academics or wanna-be-academics. I'm not saying they're wrong, but that doesn't mean the CTB is useless. If you were finding it useful and it was making good sense to you then go with it and you'll make progress, I'm sure, unless you already an elite-level racing cyclist?

    Ruth
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    Without wishing to pick a fight I would say that ad hominems against the forumites at cyclingforums is merely presenting a fallacious argument. Their valid argument is that the CTB was written in 1995 when power meters were just emerging and is geared towards training with a HRM. ie. it is dated.

    Times have changed. With access to powermeters now available to almost everyone (or at least as prevalent as HRMs were in the 90s) training with power is emerging as the standard for all cyclists who are serious enough to periodize, set goals and build annual training plans with a view to measuring and tracking performance with some sophistication.

    In addition, the material in the book does make errors, these are pointed out by the forumites. I think they are being a little nitpicky. For example their criticism of Friel's use of the term Critical Power is also picked up by Coggan and Allen in their book and expanded, but the basic concepts are adopted and embraced by them. Friel is obviously a fantastic coach and as a regular reader of his blog I can say that he knows more about power training than most of the bods on cf. Having said all that, the CTB is dated and doubly so wrt power based training and Friel himself all but admits that in his complimentary foreword for Racing and Training with a Power Meter.

    As for what a new cyclist should use? Hell, just get out and ride and forget about training plans and hrm and power meters. When you feel you want to take it to the next level and get serious about training then join a club, read the press and internet sources, then when that is not enough talk to one of the club coaches, once you have been through that you can start thinking about self coaching. Along the way you'll decide if tech can help.

    All in my humble opinion! :lol:

    EDIT: Maybe when "A Companion to the Cyclist's Training Bible" is published it will address a lot of the critcisms above.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • BeaconRuthBeaconRuth Posts: 2,086
    The question is, can the CTB help someone make excellent progress towards improving their performance as a cyclist? Yes it can.

    Next question?

    Ruth
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    Sigh.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • liversedge wrote:
    With access to powermeters now available to almost everyone (or at least as prevalent as HRMs were in the 90s) training with power is emerging as the standard for all cyclists who are serious enough to periodize, set goals and build annual training plans with a view to measuring and tracking performance with some sophistication.

    They're available, but not very affordable :( The cheapest I can find is about £1000 which is more than my bike cost.
    liversedge wrote:
    As for what a new cyclist should use? Hell, just get out and ride and forget about training plans and hrm and power meters. When you feel you want to take it to the next level and get serious about training then join a club, read the press and internet sources, then when that is not enough talk to one of the club coaches, once you have been through that you can start thinking about self coaching. Along the way you'll decide if tech can help.

    I think I'll just go out and ride then. But I really wanted to do it with some 'method' and reasoning behind it, rather than just taking a stab in the dark and hoping that I just get better.

    ps. The new, updated version of the CTB is out in 2009 according to Amazon and is available to be pre-ordered.

    Cheers

    Richie
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    Join a club - you'll get organised rides and better advice than you find on internet forums!!!!!!

    Seriously, join a club!
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • liversedge wrote:
    Join a club - you'll get organised rides and better advice than you find on internet forums!!!!!!

    Seriously, join a club!

    I disagree with that....you get the same advice, pretty much, if you join a club as you do on this forum. Some advice works some doesn't. The trick is knowing what works for you. Most people on this forum have been doing it long enough to have at least some idea of how to improve. :)
    'How can an opinion be bullsh1t?' High Fidelity
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    Hi idaviesmoore,

    I was being a bit tongue in cheek!! (otherwise why bother posting? :lol: ) I still vote for joining a club over self-coaching based upon advice from a bunch of guys on an internet forum tho.
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
  • liversedge wrote:
    Hi idaviesmoore,

    I was being a bit tongue in cheek!! (otherwise why bother posting? :lol: ) I still vote for joining a club over self-coaching based upon advice from a bunch of guys on an internet forum tho.

    :wink: I was being a bit over critical of your observation
    'How can an opinion be bullsh1t?' High Fidelity
  • richaricha Posts: 1,634
    OK. I am going to give The Cyclist's Training Bible a go. I don't train with power yet, largely due to cost and will hopefully find some interesting reading in the Bible about training endurance.

    My birthday is coming up so it is going on the list (the 2003 edition - not going to wait for the 2009 edition - need to get my training up to speed).
    Rich
  • Seems that looking around there's a lot of snobbishness about CTB, but go with Ruth, she know what she's about.
    I 'just got out and rode' my first season which was good enough. But then I needed a bit more structure. I used the CTB and it was excellent for exactly that. Good structure, flexibility, focus etc etc. You will improve by using this book. I couldn't afford (and wouldn't justify) a power meter so this book is good enough. When your engine is so good that seconds are all you can gain then time to upgrade to something else, but if you're like me this will do you for a couple of seasons.
  • BeaconRuthBeaconRuth Posts: 2,086
    Thanks, mackdaddy. We're singing from the same song sheet.

    Ruth
  • liversedgeliversedge Posts: 1,002
    --
    Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com
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