Ferrari has got the boggle eyed anti-cyclist brigade going

prj45

Discussing K&C's decision to allow cyclist to cycle "the wrong way" down one way streets.

Bring on the "cyclist nearly killed me", "license the law breakers" brigade!

It's so painful!

Why do some people seem to hate people on cycles so? Serious question!

Some of the bile being spouted sounds like the stuff you hear from strongly conservative types about "loose women", abortion, homosexuality or atheism.

Do they really think cyclists are the root of social breakdown in the same way they perceive the other aspects of society I mentioned?

Linkage: -

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2073117 ... reets.html

ChrisLS

...why are cyclists so hated? Partly it may go way back to the perception that the bicycle is a poor man's transport. Also, in the early 20th century, the bicycle gave the masses freedom to travel and a leisure pursuit that empowered them and strengthened nasty socialist ideas. Cycling allowed them to explore the countryside, and they could get away from the factories.I think this prejudice is still in our status driven British mindset. It was not so many years ago that a British prime minister said that a man who still used the bus was a failure.

Surf-Matt

Because most drivers are fat bar stewards who are jealous of "us" fit cyclists who will live longer, enjoy life more and spend far less money on our chosen mode of transport?

Belv

I love comment no.37:
"Some of these guys cause people to suffer road rage with their selfishness"
ROFL -

attica

My take on it is that as we ride past stationery cars, it's costing us nothing.
Car drivers are sat there in a vehicle capable of (usually) 100mph plus yet doing 0mph, not only that it's costing them money to go that "fast".

It's the ire of the lazy person deluding themselves that we should be hated rather than get up off their fat behinds and throw their leg over a bike themselves.

The slower the traffic gets and the more expensive that fuel gets, the more it'll p155 them off, also the more of them who will try cycling.

squired

I notice the same old comments from the public under the article. Cyclists should be taxed - of course non polluting cars aren't taxed, so cyclists would be exempt under that rule too. They then talk about cyclists breaking the law. The article I've linked to below shows how law abiding car drivers are in comparison...

http://www.thisiscroydontoday.co.uk/dis ... K=20779883

saveswalking

ChrisLS wrote:

...why are cyclists so hated? Partly it may go way back to the perception that the bicycle is a poor man's transport. quote]


Not that far back if I remember correctly there was a Labour MP complaining about a 'get on yer bike ' enviromental initiative who said we were in danger of reaching a 'Third World Status' if it were to happen. When I was a manager one of my staff suggested that it wasn't right that as a manager I was to be seen arriving at work on a bike !

sw

secretsam

saveswalking wrote:

ChrisLS wrote:

...why are cyclists so hated? Partly it may go way back to the perception that the bicycle is a poor man's transport. quote]


Not that far back if I remember correctly there was a Labour MP complaining about a 'get on yer bike ' enviromental initiative who said we were in danger of reaching a 'Third World Status' if it were to happen. When I was a manager one of my staff suggested that it wasn't right that as a manager I was to be seen arriving at work on a bike !

These will be the same people who then say "How much!!!!?!?!?!?!?!" when you tell them what you paid for your wheels...poor man my ar5e, I would be if I bought the kind of bike I want :twisted:

saveswalking

SecretSam wrote:

saveswalking wrote:

ChrisLS wrote:

...why are cyclists so hated? Partly it may go way back to the perception that the bicycle is a poor man's transport. quote]


Not that far back if I remember correctly there was a Labour MP complaining about a 'get on yer bike ' enviromental initiative who said we were in danger of reaching a 'Third World Status' if it were to happen. When I was a manager one of my staff suggested that it wasn't right that as a manager I was to be seen arriving at work on a bike !

These will be the same people who then say "How much!!!!?!?!?!?!?!" when you tell them what you paid for your wheels...poor man my ar5e, I would be if I bought the kind of bike I want :twisted:

Yep ... and I've had ..."for a bike!!!!?!?!?!?!?! - do you know how many golf clubs I could get for that ?!" :roll:

sw

JoeSoap76

ChrisLS wrote:

...why are cyclists so hated?

Come on, we all know the truth here even if we won't say it out loud. How many of us can honestly say that when we zip up the side of a traffic jam we aren't laughing on the inside at all the poor mugs stuck in their tin cans who aren't going to move an inch for the next five minutes? Come on... we all do it... and they know we're doing it.

Of course they hate us. :twisted:

ChrisLS

...perhaps it's because we don't tow the line, we are just that little bit outside the excepted norm, there may even be something "non-conformist" about riding a bike...it gets up people nose's...why should we get away with something for nothing when Mr and Mrs Driver are stuck in their cars going nowhere fast...I will confess to feeling smug sometimes...JoeSoap you are right...

...good thread by the way, let's hope it keeps running...

attica

Yep I admit it, I'm smug too, the bigger the engine of the car the smugger I get, "it's costing you how much to idle your engine?"

BTW What is the significance of Ferrari in this thread?

saveswalking

JoeSoap76 wrote:

ChrisLS wrote:

...why are cyclists so hated?

Come on, we all know the truth here even if we won't say it out loud. How many of us can honestly say that when we zip up the side of a traffic jam we aren't laughing on the inside at all the poor mugs stuck in their tin cans who aren't going to move an inch for the next five minutes? Come on... we all do it... and they know we're doing it.

Of course they hate us. :twisted:

... and pedestrians (some) 'hate' cyclists as we zip past the bus shelters full of folk waitng for ages for a bus that they may not even to be able to board .... envy ?

car = a visable mark of a degree of prosperity - some strange logic that says the more you consume/waste the more affluent you are ... and you Mr Cyclist/primordial swamp creature are a reminder of what I'm aspiring to escape ... .. and that makes me :evil:

sw

dang65

saveswalking wrote:

... and pedestrians (some) 'hate' cyclists as we zip past the bus shelters full of folk waitng for ages for a bus that they may not even to be able to board .... envy ?

There was an item on the breakfast news this morning about commuter cycling. They interviewed a couple of people at a bus stop, asking them if they'd ever considered taking up cycling. "Ooh no, much too dangerous!" was the reply. So maybe they hate us for being so fearless in the face of "danger" and laughing at their cowardice! :twisted:

saveswalking wrote:

car = a visable mark of a degree of prosperity - some strange logic that says the more you consume/waste the more affluent you are ... and you Mr Cyclist/primordial swamp creature are a reminder of what I'm aspiring to escape ... .. and that makes me :evil:

sw

The same item mentioned this sort of thing as well. They showed a clip from the 50s of hundreds of people cycling to work in factories. This reminded me of the "when I was a kid, we used to cycle to school" line which gets trotted out when school runs are discussed. The clip showed that "when you were a kid, adults used to cycle to work too"!

jedster

I think there a range of reasons why people don't like cyclists including

1. people have quite strong emotional attachments to cars. They are big, highly visible, branded objects that say something about the driver. I think their is a gut reaction that cyclists are implicitly rejecting something that the driver is quite invested in. This of course misses the point that most cyclists are also drivers and could quite easily take as much pride in their cars as the driver does

2. people seem to believe that a driver's journey is important but a cyclist's is "just" leisure - they resent any perceived inconvenience even more

3. some people get quite anxious driving near vulnerable road users and resent the anxiety that the cyclist is causing them

4. some drivers feel a sense of guilt. If you know you should be doing more exercise you might resent being reminded of it by someone who is actually getting of their @rse

none of this is really rational but there you go

saveswalking

Well put jedster


A bicycle is just a toy isn't it ?

sw

dennisn

prj45 wrote:

Why do some people seem to hate people on cycles so? Serious question!

/quote]

Well, my take on it is that you are in their way, slowing them down, they have to go around you, they have to look out for you, you interrupt the normal traffic flow, you might do something stupid on the bike(like swerve across traffic suddenly), they have to wait
for you if you have the right of way, you're slower than a car in clearing an intersection,
in this fast paced world you're just in the way and clogging things up, most of them have no clue what you will do next. So is that enough reasons for you? These may or may not
be rational reasons but they are reasons none the less, right or wrong, this is what goes
through, probably, most drivers minds. Get the hell out of my way on your stupid bike.
It's sad, but that's how I see it and my non cycling friends tell me that cyclists are just in the way.

Dennis Noward

Gussio

The comment on the Torygraph article that amused me most is this one:

This is an absolutely crazy suggestion. It is a fact that cyclists, in general, believe that the traffic laws are there for motorists (including motorcyclists) only and do not apply to them. They use the pavements as if they own them and cycle along them as fast as they are able with total disregard for the people for whom pavements are intended, pedestrians, and regard pedestrian crossings as their domain. Many years ago I was run in to by a cyclist who came around a corner as if there was no tomorrow; luckily I was not hurt very much (just a sore wrist for several days afterwards) but the frame of my leather briefcase was distorted to the extent that the briefcase no longer was usable. The cyclist carried on without even an apology.

This crazy world will be even crazier if this measure is put in place.

John Candler

Sore wrist and a "distorted" briefcase - oh crivvens!

prj45

Attica wrote:

BTW What is the significance of Ferrari in this thread?

Nick Ferrari, London talkshow host famous for goggle eyed ranting.

Worth a listen though: -

http://www.lbc.co.uk/Article.asp?id=225723&spid=13317

spen666

prj45 wrote:

...Why do some people seem to hate people on cycles so? Serious question!

...

There is no one answer to this, but partial reasons IMHO include:

1) The attitude of many cyclists in ignoring/breaking the law when they want- eg riding through red lights - especially at ped xings, riding on pavements, aggressive riding

2) those law breaking/ aggressive cyclists are not isolated from others by a tin can and therefore appear more personal than a car that does similar

prj45

Attica wrote:

The slower the traffic gets and the more expensive that fuel gets, the more it'll p155 them off, also the more of them who will try cycling.

I also think us who do cycle can identify with one aspect.

Imagine it was cyclists who had the impression that a large part of society and government thought they shouldn't be on the road, and legislation was being put into place that appeared to corroborate that mindset.

Dunno about you, but I'd riot in the streets before I'd let them make cycling on the road forbidden.

Surf-Matt

A lot of "us and them" here.

Surely most of us are cyclists AND drivers?!

prj45

Surf-Matt wrote:

A lot of "us and them" here.

Surely most of us are cyclists AND drivers?!

Yup. me, I love my car, but not as much as I love my bike.

I'm sort of intentinally sounding a bit us and them, but I'm not.

I'm sort of describing the anti cyclist car set, of which there is a definite constituency in Nick Ferrari's audience!

dang65

prj45 wrote:

Imagine it was cyclists who had the impression that a large part of society and government thought they shouldn't be on the road, and legislation was being put into place that appeared to corroborate that mindset.

Dunno about you, but I'd riot in the streets before I'd let them make cycling on the road forbidden.

Even if there was a cheaper, more fun alternative available which gave you more exercise, freedom and flexibility and (a lot of the time) was much faster as well??!

Keithp88

From both ends; no finer feeling than passing a mile and a half of stationary traffic whilst on two wheels (with or without engine); no worse feeling than sitting in a mile and a half of stationary traffic as the two wheeled mafia ride past you.

There is a long standing human tradition of hating what you don't understand, fortunately we have almost managed to pass the throwing rocks at it stage. Truck drivers don't seem to mind us though.

karl j

this bit made me laugh " Cycle contraflows already exist in some parts of the country but they are relatively rare as they require extensive changes to the road markings." - they should go and look at the one in Yarmouth, the only extensive thing about it is the line of white paint. In fact it's so extensive it even goes round the corner against the direction of the major bus thru-route . Fantastic piece of planning, that...

Isn't lot of the petrolhead nonsense that gets spouted simply down to envy ? . And i guess if i'd paid £25k for a tin can, even if it was a "prestige German" tin can, then i'd be a bit jarred whenever some £50 double-bouncer flashed past me

dirk_van_gently

dennisn wrote:

this is what goes through, probably, most drivers minds.

I am surprised ANYTHING goes through most drivers minds.

karl j

Off at a tangent slightly, but comment 20 " horse riders have never been rquired to obey the one-way system; they have always been allowed to ride in either direction in a one-way street. All this proposed rule does is extend this to cyclists. It's no big deal. "

is that right ?

prj45

karl j wrote:

is that right ?

Hmm, the no entry sign means "no entry to vehicular traffic", are horses vehicles?

saveswalking

prj45 wrote:

karl j wrote:

is that right ?

Hmm, the no entry sign means "no entry to vehicular traffic", are horses vehicles?

only when mounted ...?

or drawing something ...?

sw

dang65

One thing that always occurs to me is that the way to entice people out of their cars isn't to just keep putting the prices up, which doesn't seem to have any impact at all, but to make car driving such a completely pointless exercise that only the most completely dedicated continue to do it. And one way to do this is to lift all sorts of restrictions from other road users (bicycles, horses, rollerbladers, handcarts etc) whilst simultaneously introducing more and more restrictions on cars.

So, do things like blocking off roads halfway down (which is done in a lot of places already, with gates for emergency vehicles and gaps for cyclists). Make residential streets into a maze, so that you have to drive about five miles to get out of your enclave onto the "open road".

One idea I had was to have toll gates all over the place, hand operated by obese people to give them some exercise, or by people with ASBOs as a form of community service. It would only cost a penny to go through, but cars would have to queue and wait for the gate to be lifted for each car, and this would happen every couple of hundred yards.

It could take months to go anywhere, and make car driving completely pointless unless you absolutely had to, in which case... go ahead, no law against it.

Yes, well, maybe needs a little thought and planning, but I reckon it's the way forward.