The effect of cold

pdstsp

I have just got back from doing epicevents' Christam Cracker - a 62 mile psortive ride in Southern lake district. Weather was very cold - 1 - 2 degrees and I suffer like a dog in the cold with numb feet. However I wore several layers and hat, overshoes etc. I lost feeling in feet after about an hour. My problem was that my performance was truly shocking :oops: , diabolically bad. Indeed so miserable was I that I cut 10 miles off the route so only rode 52 miles!! I also found myself using very small gears on slopes which would not normally justify it.

My question is whether cold would have this dramatic effect - does the body have to work so much harder to try to maintain heat that everything else is sacrificed?

pb21

I go slower, paritcularly on steep hills, when its cold.

ellesse

i came back from a 20 mile loop which took me 10% longer then usual at a higher HR.
I found myself struggling on the climbs as well, though my boots are really vented (mtb shoes) and i don't own overshoes!

I'm not sure about the physics involved but i found that because my feet were without feeling i wasn't concentrating on technique which could be a reason

TheGreatGatsby

yup I only managed a 90miler today and that was in 5 and a half hours. So 10 miles off my normal sunday ride length and felt pretty knackered most of the way. Heart rate was way down aswell but that might be because I also have a cold.

Gats

SteveR_100Milers

I think the cold can have a massively adverse effect. I ride a 30 mile hilly loop all year round, and in the summer I can regulary do it in 1-35 ish. Even continuing ridinng after the end of the season and track racing my times have dropped by 5-10 minutes. 2 weeks ago it took me 2 hours but then half of it was into a 20+ mph wind. I did it today in 1-50 although this is after a forced 14 day break from cycling, despite perfect conditions for a fast time.

J2R2

I think it definitely has an effect. I went out with the club this morning like I do every weekend, and I was struggling for the last few miles on the way home, even though we were only going at a fairly gentle pace. I think it's the shock to the system that's the problem - it's the first really cold weather we've had this winter, and last winter was very mild. If we were more used to it, it probably wouldn't be as much of a problem.

chrisw12

Why would the cold mean that you go slower? Is there any physiological reason? It doesn't seem to effect cross country skiers and the like.

One possible reason for a slowing down could be, colder=more clothes=more wind resistance.

Also
colder=more clothes=more weight to carry arround. This could be the reason why you are slower on steep hills?

What do people with a power meter find?

slunker

Cold air is much more dense. When playing golf the ball doesnt carry as far, and also your mpg on your car also falls.

nickwill

I've always thought that your system is working hard just to maintain body heat, thus you are burning far more calories. Every time you breathe cold air in, it's chilling your lungs.
I did a 50 today and it felt like a good 75 miles.

ellesse

sorry to change subject,

Slunker doesn't colder temperatures make a car engine more efficient leading to increased MPG ? (as usual, the probability is, im wrong)

oldwelshman

chrisw12 wrote:

Why would the cold mean that you go slower? Is there any physiological reason? It doesn't seem to effect cross country skiers and the like.

One possible reason for a slowing down could be, colder=more clothes=more wind resistance.

Also
colder=more clothes=more weight to carry arround. This could be the reason why you are slower on steep hills?

What do people with a power meter find?

Chris thought you were a maths teacher ?
You are not serious about extra clothes increasing wind resistance are you ?
It mights if you have a cape on which is flapping round, but not normal tight fitting clothes.

If muscles are really cold they work less effectively, also blood transport not as efficient as when warm.

Then theres the psycological effect cold has

pdstsp

Cheers all - made me feel a bit better (or was that the Chianti?)

TheGreatGatsby

http://cyclingnutrition.blogspot.com/2007_12_01_archive.html

a couple of good articles about training in the cold which may offer some explaination to the lack of performance,

Gats

popette

I was really demoralised after my morning ride yesterday. I didn't even make it to the top of a hill, which normally I would get up without any problem at all. With 50 metres to go ,I pretty much collapsed over my handle bards, wheezing and trembling and thinking to myself how the fu<k am I going to finish the etape if I can't even make it up a hill in cheshire??? I spent the rest of my ride feeling quite negative about how training is going and generally feeling that I'm going backwards.
The hills are just killing me in the cold weather. It's good to hear I'm not the only one experiencing this.

pdstsp

Sounds just like me - I spent long periods thinking very dark thoughts while trying to massgae feeling back into body. This morning have woken up feeling much better (apart from the chianti hang over) and vowed to review weather before rides - it seems counter productive to train when the body is telling you not to. Luckily I have an indoor kettler ergo trainer so some tdf dvds and I'll pretend its BourgD'Oisans in July!!

martincroxall

One benefit of training in the cold is that you'll feel so much better when it gets warmer (hopefully). I'm already dreaming of riding without overshoes, tights, full fingers gloves, jackets, etc, etc and Spring can't come soon enough. Besides, if the weather is not so great next Summer it'll still be warmer than now and you know you can hack this weather don't you?

Mike Willcox

Stayed in the warm and did a gym session followed later by a run on the treadmill. Plenty of time left to ride the bike for when it gets warmer.

slunker

ellesse wrote:

sorry to change subject,

Slunker doesn't colder temperatures make a car engine more efficient leading to increased MPG ? (as usual, the probability is, im wrong)

Not sure of the physics maths, but an engine uses more fuel when its cold. Some of these chipped cars use more fuel as the chip tricks the ECU in to thinking the ambient temperature is alot colder than it really is.

ian_oli

I havent tried a test as such, but I reckon on a really cold day my heart rate is 10-15 beats up on the same perceived effort on a turbo in the warm.

Also I occasionally dive in cold eg. UK water and despite a dry suit, hood and thick gloves you can feel knackered after a dive even though the only real effort is getting the kit on and off and getting in and out of the water.

If you are simply converting your effort into trying to stay warm is there any point training in the cold, as opposed to indoors on a turbo?

Blonde

You use more Kals just keeping warm so you may need to eat more when cycling in the cold and may feel more tired afterwards. You'll also have cold muscles which will make cycling feel harder - and you're more likely to ache or feel stiff afterwards. You can tell cyclists that train in cold weather from those that don't - any spare fat at all and it builds up on the thighs and buttocks to protect and insulate the cycling muscles.

nickwill

Blonde wrote:

You can tell cyclists that train in cold weather from those that don't - any spare fat at all and it builds up on the thighs and buttocks to protect and insulate the cycling muscles.

I take it that this comes from a close visual study of this particular area of male cyclists!

popette

Blonde wrote:

You use more Kals just keeping warm so you may need to eat more when cycling in the cold and may feel more tired afterwards. You'll also have cold muscles which will make cycling feel harder - and you're more likely to ache or feel stiff afterwards. You can tell cyclists that train in cold weather from those that don't - any spare fat at all and it builds up on the thighs and buttocks to protect and insulate the cycling muscles.

oh crap - so not only am I suffering on hills, I'm also going to get fat(ter) thighs! One of the thoughts that keeps me going when I'm struggling is the vision of me as a bronzed goddess on the start line of the etape (with very lean thighs!!) - I can't even hold that thought now when my lungs are about to explode.

With the exception of hills, it still is really nice to be out on a bike in December. As I'm cycling along, it does amaze me that here I am, on a bike, in the middle of winter!!

Ed in Vercors

Did a mtb/road commute to work today in -16°c but thats the Alps!? Nordic/bIathlon skiers are only officially allowed to race down to -18°c although this often gets ignored due to the demands of TV etc. I know during the Lilliehammer Winter Olympics in '94 they racing below -20°c. This also effects the balistics of the ammo used in biathlon.
i've never really found that the cold seriously effects performance if you dress correctly. However, being close up to a xc ski race finish can sometimes resemble a battlefield.

DaveyL

A quick doodle on the analytic cycling website shows: At sea level and 21 deg C, a speed of 20 mph needs 135 W (for a given rider). At 0 deg C, with everything else the same, it 20 mph requires 143 W. What's that, about a 6% difference? Air density is higher at the lower temperature, 1.28 kg/m3 vs 1.19 kg/m3.

portuguese mike

popette wrote:

I was really demoralised after my morning ride yesterday. I didn't even make it to the top of a hill, which normally I would get up without any problem at all. With 50 metres to go ,I pretty much collapsed over my handle bards, wheezing and trembling and thinking to myself how the fu<k am I going to finish the etape if I can't even make it up a hill in cheshire??? I spent the rest of my ride feeling quite negative about how training is going and generally feeling that I'm going backwards.
The hills are just killing me in the cold weather. It's good to hear I'm not the only one experiencing this.

perhaps using playwrights to steer your bike has made it a tad heavy for the hills

Seriously though, i went out on staurday for about 50 miles and i felt like my brakes where stuck on going up some of the hills and afterwards i felt like i'd done a century ride for the rest of the day - really stiff and achy. it's definatlely not just you, i'm doing the etape next year as well and there are times when i seriously doubt being able to get up those climbs when lately i've been struggling up what are mere pimples in comparison.

popette

portuguese mike wrote:

popette wrote:

I was really demoralised after my morning ride yesterday. I didn't even make it to the top of a hill, which normally I would get up without any problem at all. With 50 metres to go ,I pretty much collapsed over my handle bards, wheezing and trembling and thinking to myself how the fu<k am I going to finish the etape if I can't even make it up a hill in cheshire??? I spent the rest of my ride feeling quite negative about how training is going and generally feeling that I'm going backwards.
The hills are just killing me in the cold weather. It's good to hear I'm not the only one experiencing this.

perhaps using playwrights to steer your bike has made it a tad heavy for the hills

Seriously though, i went out on staurday for about 50 miles and i felt like my brakes where stuck on going up some of the hills and afterwards i felt like i'd done a century ride for the rest of the day - really stiff and achy. it's definatlely not just you, i'm doing the etape next year as well and there are times when i seriously doubt being able to get up those climbs when lately i've been struggling up what are mere pimples in comparison.

oh you made me chuckle . I'm starting to psyche myself out at the moment - looked at tourmalet on climbbybike and compared to a local seemingly huge hill - the cat and fiddle. Cat and fiddle is a piece of p!ss in comparison according to climbbybike. We've got bags of time yet though haven't we? It's the longest day on Friday and then we'll be getting closer and closer to short sleeve riding again. I'm so looking forward to feeling the sun on my back again.

DaveyL

Funnily enough the last section of the Cat & Fiddle reminds me in a way of the last part of the Col du Glandon (from the south) - the way you can see the road snaking its way up to the isolated pub/restaurant at the summit. Admittedly the gradient on the C&F is somewhat gentler...

portuguese mike

popette wrote:

portuguese mike wrote:

popette wrote:

I was really demoralised after my morning ride yesterday. I didn't even make it to the top of a hill, which normally I would get up without any problem at all. With 50 metres to go ,I pretty much collapsed over my handle bards, wheezing and trembling and thinking to myself how the fu<k am I going to finish the etape if I can't even make it up a hill in cheshire??? I spent the rest of my ride feeling quite negative about how training is going and generally feeling that I'm going backwards.
The hills are just killing me in the cold weather. It's good to hear I'm not the only one experiencing this.

perhaps using playwrights to steer your bike has made it a tad heavy for the hills

Seriously though, i went out on staurday for about 50 miles and i felt like my brakes where stuck on going up some of the hills and afterwards i felt like i'd done a century ride for the rest of the day - really stiff and achy. it's definatlely not just you, i'm doing the etape next year as well and there are times when i seriously doubt being able to get up those climbs when lately i've been struggling up what are mere pimples in comparison.

oh you made me chuckle . I'm starting to psyche myself out at the moment - looked at tourmalet on climbbybike and compared to a local seemingly huge hill - the cat and fiddle. Cat and fiddle is a piece of p!ss in comparison according to climbbybike. We've got bags of time yet though haven't we? It's the longest day on Friday and then we'll be getting closer and closer to short sleeve riding again. I'm so looking forward to feeling the sun on my back again.

Luckily we do and i can't wait for the spring either

on the road

ellesse wrote:

sorry to change subject,

Slunker doesn't colder temperatures make a car engine more efficient leading to increased MPG ? (as usual, the probability is, im wrong)

You could be forgiven for thinking that, but it takes longer to start the engine in the cold using up more fuel in the process, then you usually have the heating on most of the time using up more fuel again, and the engine tends to labour during the cold so uses up more fuel to keep the engine running. It's not like a computer where it works better cold, car engines work better hot.

portuguese mike

on the road wrote:

ellesse wrote:

sorry to change subject,

Slunker doesn't colder temperatures make a car engine more efficient leading to increased MPG ? (as usual, the probability is, im wrong)

You could be forgiven for thinking that, but it takes longer to start the engine in the cold using up more fuel in the process, then you usually have the heating on most of the time using up more fuel again, and the engine tends to labour during the cold so uses up more fuel to keep the engine running. It's not like a computer where it works better cold, car engines work better hot.

The only thing that requires additional energy to run when your heater is on is the fan that blows the air into the cabin which uses very lttle (energy). the air is heated by water from the cars cooling system some of which is diverted from the radiator to a heating matrix (though which the air passes) before rejoining the cooling system. This heating matrix is always warm whether you have you heating fan or not so it doesn't really make a noticable difference to the fuel economy.

i'd agree with the rest of your points though, it seems people are mistaking the (very)slight increase in power you may get when fuel burns with denser cold air with incresed economy.

Mike Willcox

It's colder for a cyclist than for a pedestrian as the movement through the air takes the warm air surrounding the body away. If there's a cold wind as well then you might be do yourself more harm than good.

You see figures in weather forecasts of temperatures that state "feels like". Well that's the one you should go by if you intend to ride your bike. I haven't been out on the road on my bike since last week, as it's too cold. There's plenty of time to build aerobic fitness and if you have an indoor trainer then you shouldn't lose too much if you use it two or three times a week.