Cyclists always the villain!?

Lbaguley

Another quality, unbiased peice of journalism...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6900694.stm

Plenty of quotes from motorists, and indeed most of the article seems to be written from the perspective of the "law abiding driver". Not a word from a single cyclist.[/url]

ChrisLS

...actually Yannick Read and Matt Seaton are both cyclists. I thought the article was reasonably balanced...

FarNorthSurfer

Just another piece of journalism designed to create division and dissent with the aim of getting a rise out of people and 'creating the news'
BBC please move on there is nothing to see here

Max Weber

Good to see the BBC airing the views of that well-known arbiter of good manners and road safety, white van man:

Joseph Clery drives a van around London for a living, delivering day-labourers and tools to building sites across the city. He describes cyclists as "my worst nightmare".

"You never know what they're going to do. They're unpredictable, especially at the lights."


There's competition for space on the UK's roads
He says cyclists have also "become more argumentative".

"I've had cyclists kicking the side of my van and shouting unrepeatable things at me. Some of them think they own the roads - roads that we motorists pay for through our road tax."

Next in the BBC's series of grounbreaking revelations from members of the public:

'Foreigners are stealing our jobs' says BNP candidate

'Homework not fair' complain schoolchildren

'No corruption in football' says A.N. Agent

'Fuel Tax too High' says lorry driver

'Models not too thin' claims top designer

Porgy

Makes me laugh - men in vans clearly never swear at other road users, poor little angels. They must be so shocked by our foul language.

They clearly never speed or try to run lights at junctions either.

I also want a refund on the road tax I pay and hardly use! 8)

Ghost Donkey

I've seen this guy commenting on cycling before.

"Excuse me, lets not forget that human beings riding bikes produce more carbon dioxide from respiration than human beings sitting down behind the wheel of an electric car - whenever somebody gets round to making this available, that is.
Tom, Lisbon"

Genious. Even jeremy Clarkson can work out that elecric cars are powered largely by fossil fuels via power stations.

Porgy

and cyclists happen to be getting their exercise from riding a bike, while others jog or go to the gym. And some of them will drive to get to the gym and then drive home again!

We get exercise and travel at the same time, making us very efficient.

wai

Posted before, but I thought worth resurrecting as a good parody of 'morally superior' cyclists:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAOHhV1EFe4

Wynne G Oldman

ChrisLS wrote:

...actually Yannick Read and Matt Seaton are both cyclists. I thought the article was reasonably balanced...

I agree with you. Sometimes people don't want to hear the bad side of things. We should all speak out against cyclists that disobey the law. They give us all a bad name.

Porgy

I will speak out against cyclists who break the law once the slightly more dangerous motorists who break the law are being dealt with satisfactorily.

dazzawazza

Generally I don't have too many problems with other road users.
What car commuters must remember is that cyclists amount to less traffic jams, which must be an advantage to them. They should welcome cyclists to the road.

cupofteacp

I can't wait for the pay as you go, car tax scheme.

Eat My Dust

cupofteacp wrote:

I can't wait for the pay as you go, car tax scheme.

Either can I!!! I really want a car for the occassional trip to B&Q and visiting friends who are hard to reach with public transport. There is no way I can afford to have a car sit outside my house that I only use once a week, if we had pay as you go, I could justify it, unitl then I will have to carry my DIY stuff from B&Q!!!!!!! (BTW, I do draw somw very odd looks from people!!)

ChrisLS

dazzawazza wrote:

Generally I don't have too many problems with other road users.
What car commuters must remember is that cyclists amount to less traffic jams, which must be an advantage to them. They should welcome cyclists to the road.

...couldn't agree more

tiny_pens

Don't jump red lights. Stop at the head of the queue in the middle of the lane, wait for green and pull away reeaaalllly slowly. See how pleased motorists are that you aren't jumping red lights


Tiny Pens

HJ1976

Eat My Dust wrote:

cupofteacp wrote:

I can't wait for the pay as you go, car tax scheme.

Either can I!!! I really want a car for the occassional trip to B&Q and visiting friends who are hard to reach with public transport. There is no way I can afford to have a car sit outside my house that I only use once a week, if we had pay as you go, I could justify it, unitl then I will have to carry my DIY stuff from B&Q!!!!!!! (BTW, I do draw somw very odd looks from people!!)

Same here, mu uncle has a top bracket car, as does my mother (which i use when she's not looking as it is cheaper to run than my '06 Clio!!!) who's runs on LPG. PAYD will be fantastic for them as they are both retired and between them do about 10K per year.

Dad on the other hand pays no road fund, and get petorl at about £10 per 80l Tank- but he cycles to work anyway in Kuwait!

I wish I could commute by bike, but i live too far away and the only real way to work is classified as a motorway- or a extra 15 miles on the diveresion route each way. So i try to give cyclists and motorcyclists extra room.

bigdawg

HJ1976 wrote:

- but he cycles to work anyway in Kuwait!

Middlesborough to Kuwait :shock: :shock: Thats some commute, and youre complaining about commuting how far...??? :?

Porgy

HJ1976 wrote:

I wish I could commute by bike, but i live too far away and the only real way to work is classified as a motorway- or a extra 15 miles on the diveresion route each way. So i try to give cyclists and motorcyclists extra room.

Then you need one of these!

http://www.givecyclistsroom.co.uk/

Wynne G Oldman

Porgy wrote:

I will speak out against cyclists who break the law once the slightly more dangerous motorists who break the law are being dealt with satisfactorily.

So it's OK for cyclists to break the law but no-one else?

CarlosFerreiro

Ghost Donkey wrote:

I've seen this guy commenting on cycling before.

"Excuse me, lets not forget that human beings riding bikes produce more carbon dioxide from respiration than human beings sitting down behind the wheel of an electric car - whenever somebody gets round to making this available, that is.
Tom, Lisbon"

Genious. Even jeremy Clarkson can work out that elecric cars are powered largely by fossil fuels via power stations.

And of course that the carbon people breath out has been eaten as food and is therefore completely recycled in the short term, whereas the carbon in the petrol / from the production of electricity is very likely from fossil fuels, with no prospect of being recycled anytime in the next million years or so....

Cunobelin

The problem is that there are those in both groups who flout the law, and in each group there will be those who defend that.

Classically the ABD stance on clamping down on cyclists is that "Cyclists should obey the laws", but clamping down on motoriats is a "Jihad against freedom of movement" !

We had a front page article locally last year condemning the cyclist in the picture for no lights, but no comment on the vehicle behind with no lights on, or the one beside him with only one working light!

Equally put a cyclist on the pavement and it's dangerous, but vehicles on the same pavemet are acceptable.

It is a "Light blue touch paper and retire" type of reporting, simply put up the suggestion and let the fanatics write your story for you, never mind the facts.

Accept that there are idiots in both camps, and treat them with the contempt they deserve

adifiddler

The only way cycling will become safer and excepted by other road users is by cyclists building good personal road skills, abiding the law, setting example to other road users. I suggest RLJs are not confident cyclists and do not have the required skills that is needed for our busy roads. I can say this because most RLJs say it is safer to do than wait with the traffic. RLJs take a calculated risk and often say they know the sequence to justify there actions but for other road users RLJ is often the number one frustration with cyclists. To improve the image of cycling cyclists must stop this RLJ.

Rightly or wrongly i feel there are two sorts of bike users, the bike rider normally children and young adults that ride a bike until they move onto other forms of traffic and the cyclist who chose to ride a bike for sport, leisure, commute or as there preferred means of transport. Both groups are responsible for the hate of cyclists on our roads but it is down to the cyclists to set good example and by doing so will encourage bike riders to follow that example.

Cycle websites, forums and there members should not encourage or glorify RLJ or any other illegal or unsafe act on the road. If you are a RLJer then that is your business and you should keep it to yourself and not try to justify your actions in public where it might be seen by less experienced bike users as the norm and encouraging them to do it.

I do a lot of stealth camping which is often illegal, I dont talk about it to people unless I know they do it and talking about it on most of the wild camping and outdoor forums is frowned upon because it is illegal and they dont want to encourage others to do it or advocate it. Members of cycling forums should perhaps put pressure on the minority that of members that RLJ and try to encourage them to do there bit for improving the image of cycling by improving there behaviour.

The BIG GT

Cunobelin wrote:

The problem is that there are those in both groups who flout the law, and in each group there will be those who defend that.

Classically the ABD stance on clamping down on cyclists is that "Cyclists should obey the laws", but clamping down on motorists is a "Jihad against freedom of movement" !

We had a front page article locally last year condemning the cyclist in the picture for no lights, but no comment on the vehicle behind with no lights on, or the one beside him with only one working light!

Equally put a cyclist on the pavement and it's dangerous, but vehicles on the same pavemet are acceptable.

It is a "Light blue touch paper and retire" type of reporting, simply put up the suggestion and let the fanatics write your story for you, never mind the facts.

Accept that there are idiots in both camps, and treat them with the contempt they deserve

I agree, a very good point. The way that one 'side' or the other always defends that group's illegal and/or dangerous actions by saying "but they do it!!" always makes me think of the infant school playground. If it's illegal/stupid/thoughtless/unsafe, the fact that you are on a bike, in a car, bus, lorry, taxi, etc. does not make it all OK just because some other people do it.

And the "it's OK because I'm experienced and know what I'm doing" argument is ridiculous! By that thinking, those drivers who have six pints before heading home after the pub are OK too, because they've "always done it and never had an accident".

And that is just complete b0llocks. :roll:
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BikieExeter

"I've had cyclists kicking the side of my van and shouting unrepeatable things at me. Some of them think they own the roads - roads that we motorists pay for through our road tax."

Can we be clear: no motorist pays any more to use the road than any cyclist. There is no 'Road Tax' - it is called a 'Vehicle Tax'. The name says it all. Time to spread the word on this odious little argument. We do own the road.

Cunobelin

Accept "VED"!

As a vehicle emitting less than 100g of carbon per mile, we are BAnd A vehicles. VED is rated for these vehicles at ZERO

Exactly nothing at all.

£0.00

I along with al cyclists pay my fully assessed duty.

Unless we are sayingthat there should be more duty on bicycles than other vehicles with the same emissions?

BikieExeter

Cunobelin

I like your kind of logic! I'm actually looking forward to the next time someone comes up with the 'cyclists don't pay *road* tax' line.

Porgy

As a cyclist I tend to obey the law. As a motorist too. Obviously I make the odd mistake now and again - in both my roles.

As a cyclist I reckon I make less mistakes and with much less significant outcomes for other roadusers. But this doesn;t stop me being constantly bombarded - as a cyclist - with orders from other road users - get in the cycle lane (I don;t have to) - get off the pavement (its a cycle lane) - get to the side of the road (this is the lane I need to be in) - don;t go so fast its dangerous - don;t go so slow you're in my way. I even got chased down Lewisham High street by a bloke who perceived that I had run a red light. I hadn't .

On the Dunwich Dynamo - you have to see to believe the aggression the ride gets from certain people - young blokes mainly - as we wind our way out of East London. I remember being told I was a wanker and I should go home - I was off the road getting my water out of my pannier at the time - not even cycling!

So I ask - what is the point of obeying the law merely to appease those who hate us? And will hate us regardless. It's a waste of time. Obey the law becasue you want to. And I WILL CONDEMN WHOEVER I CHOOSE TO CONDEMN FOR LAW-BREAKING - that's my choice. There's lots of groups I don;t condemn for law-breaking - but there's one I do and that's motorists. why? Because every day I have to deal with at least one who thought he could save time - or be lazy or careless - and risk my - or someone else's life in the process.

I can't remember a cyclist ever putting my life in danger. Or restricting my freedom. Or pushing property prices up. Or causing dangerous levels of pollution, etc.

I've been run over about three times as a pedestrian and hit quite a few times as a cyclist over 30 years. I've never been injured by a cyclist. Nor do I know anyone who has.

Porgy

Cunobelin wrote:

Accept "VED"!

As a vehicle emitting less than 100g of carbon per mile, we are BAnd A vehicles. VED is rated for these vehicles at ZERO

Exactly nothing at all.

£0.00

I along with al cyclists pay my fully assessed duty.

Unless we are sayingthat there should be more duty on bicycles than other vehicles with the same emissions?

I remember a recent analysis based on wear and tear on the road caused by a cyclist compared to a car. The conclusion was that we'd have to pay 2p a year to cover our road use. I'm more than happy to pay this! As it happens I own a car, and rightfully, pay full whack!!

Porgy

duplicated post :oops:

Porgy

Porgy wrote:

Wynne G Oldman wrote:

Porgy wrote:

I will speak out against cyclists who break the law once the slightly more dangerous motorists who break the law are being dealt with satisfactorily.

So it's OK for cyclists to break the law but no-one else?

I didn;t say that - and the answer to your question is no.

magibob

"The biggest problem I have with cyclists is that they think they have a god-given right to cycle on the pavement and pedestrians should move out of their way. Far from being heroes, they are dangerous, ignorant and downright selfish.
Dougal McKinnon, Stoke on Trent"


The biggest problem I have with people called Dougal, is that they over-generalise and Tar everyone with the same brush.

Bob