wheels wheel wheels

vermootencp · June 2007

Hi,

I'm a wheel-newbie and I need to decide which wheels to get. I currently do long hilly sportives and require low weight and high stiffness. Gotta be clinchers.

DT Swiss RR1450s are light (1450g) and cheap (œ386 from wiggle so probably cheaper elsewhere). Recommended by a forum member whose judgement I trust.

Fulcrum Zeros have been recommended by someone who owns 2 pairs of Lightweights and who therefore knows his onions. Almost twice the price (about œ675) and a whole 25g lighter that the RR1450s. But they're... red.

Zipp 303s are pricey (œ1000) and heavy (1620g) but have uber-bling which really does have to count for something...?

Are the RR1450s cheaper because they're not as stiff as the Fulcrums? Or is there another reason? Maybe they're just as useful as each other? Aaaarrrgh!

Please help me to decide. What have I missed off the list?

All posts very muchly appreciated!!

Cheers,
Andy

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

simmers · June 2007

Don't own any of those, or any lightweight wheels myself, but have looking in to it too. Read elsewhere on the the forum that RR1450 rims are prone to cracking, unless they are the double eyelet model which DT has introduced as a response. The single eyelet is apparently 'race only'.

So on that basis, you could just as well go for the trusty, yet light Mavic Open Pro rim, with your choice of spokes (CX-Rays if you fancy saving a bit of weight) and maybe the DT hubs which look nice and are quite light. Get it all built up by your LBS and they should be pretty light, as well as reliable and easily-fixable.

Or what about Campag Neutron or Neutron Ultras? Very light, no fancy spokes to go wrong and some good reviews on the forum. œ299/œ389 at Ribble.

vermootencp · June 2007

Stop press: the Fulcrums are only about œ500if bought from Germany: http://www.bike24.com/1.php?content=8;p ... nuid2=123;

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

vermootencp · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by simmers
Or what about Campag Neutron or Neutron Ultras? Very light, no fancy spokes to go wrong and some good reviews on the forum. œ299/œ389 at Ribble.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Interestingly, my trustworthy source of this shire suggested these too. Thanks for the post simmers!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

Booboocp · June 2007

Ksyriums

Event Website: http://www.whiteroseclassic.co.uk

currieinahurry · June 2007

no no no!! are you riding shimano or campag?
tikka

hi my name is adam... and i have a problem with posting on cycling forums.

Brian B · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Booboo

Ksyriums

Event Website: http://www.whiteroseclassic.co.uk
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Yeah Kysriums - Feel the power of the Dark Side Vermooten.

Brian B.

cjcp · June 2007

I don't think you can go wrong with Mavic Open Pros put together by a good wheelbuilder. Stiff, reliable and good value for money.

How heavy are you at the moment and can you lose weight (while remaining healthy of course)? If so, this wil probably be of more benefit to you going up hills.

Phil Scp · June 2007

I've had no issues with the DT Swiss, I'm a sprinter and I also have used them for training, not race-only wheels. Mine weigh 1477g. I am a big fan and if they do crack then I'll just get them warrantied, no biggie.
Ksyriums? Well, they're stiff but poop. And not aero. And not light either.
Handbuilts would probably be my number one choice - maybe an open pro with CXRays or DT aerlolite spokes, DT Swiss hubs are very good, or get some ultra lightweight FRM Feather hubs off eBay from ridersparadise in Japan - great eBayer, I got mine there.

mrushton · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by cj

I don't think you can go wrong with Mavic Open Pros put together by a good wheelbuilder. Stiff, reliable and good value for money.

How heavy are you at the moment and can you lose weight (while remaining healthy of course)? If so, this wil probably be of more benefit to you going up hills.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Paul Hewitt in Leyland will build you FRM hubs into eg Ambrosio rims with Sapin X-Ray spokes which will be as light as any of those wheels and will most likely cost less and will be repairable should that situation arise.

M.Rushton

il_principe · June 2007

If you want factory built then you can't go wrong with the Fulcrums's. I love my Zero's, and if you don't like the Red you could always go for the 1's in Black or Silver, they're only a tiny bit heavier than the zero's. Remember Fulcrum wheels are owned by campy, and they certainly know their business!

My Best Bike

Unknown · June 2007

Mavic ES. Subtle, single red spoke each wheel, and less subtle red hubs. 'Nuff said.

I've been Thamed !!

currieinahurry · June 2007

i really do believe everyone in this situation should get some handbuilts and then when they have those in the future buy some fancy wheels. and check that hubs you buy are gunna be strong enough for english weather!
tikka

hi my name is adam... and i have a problem with posting on cycling forums.

vermootencp · June 2007

Reynolds Attack have been recommended to me outside of this forum - light at 1500g, stiff (cos they're carbon), and blingy. A wee bit pricier at ¶œ750. Anyone know about these babies?

RE: Mavic ES. They get a bad press on WeightWeenies, they've sacrificed stiffness for weight. Or so they say.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

JWSurrey · June 2007

I agree with Currie on this one.
I've been running this year's Ventos, which are very light, but not as robust,comfortable, nice to ride as my new ride which has:
Handbuilt Mavic Open Pro ceramics with Ultegra hubs (assuming you're running Shimano), brass nipples, 3x rear spoking (32H), radial front.
They also weigh in slightly lighter than the Vento as somewhere around 1250g for the front, complete with grease, tyre, tape and tube. (albeit at a higher price).

Well worth trying some handbuilts - Great confidence giving, solid wheels.
You could probably go lighter with DB spokes (such as those suggested - Sapims or DTs) and non brass nipples to reduce rotating mass.

I did hear very positive comments about the Campag. Neutrons though.
They're ultra-light, but couldn't comment on their robustness.

Edit: For handbuilts, I tried:
Harry Rowland - Lots of good reports
Dauphin Cycles - Box Hill
Condor Cycles - My fav. shop
Sigma Sport - Kingston

vermootencp · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by currieinahurry
i really do believe everyone in this situation should get some handbuilts and then when they have those in the future buy some fancy wheels.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
This is my sitch exactly. The future is now.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

Russ76 · June 2007

ES look the business ....... I am impressed with my recent purchase

The Zero's look great but I think you could grow to hate the red

Campag wheels are ok if you are running campag gears

Hand builts look a bit boring !

Russ76 · June 2007

p.s. I went to the Otley Town centre Crit last night and the guy that won the first race was on ES's ..... so they can't be that bad !

currieinahurry · June 2007

yea but i know guys that could kick ass on a bike with askiums doesnt mean i would suggest them to someone else how about talking to a wheel builder and getting some suggestions? or if you want speed how about some carbones? i use mine or sportives in this country anyway as they are damn stiff and super fast
tikka

hi my name is adam... and i have a problem with posting on cycling forums.

monty_dogcp · June 2007

Whilst I don't deny that a pair of handbuilts can be equally strong and light - unless you live on the doorstep of these guys, mid to top range factory built wheels from the reputable manufacturers are every bit as good. In particular, Mavic and Campag/Fulcrum have been doing it the longest and have built excellent reputations based on good quality product - they're not going to stake that on poorly built products. The benefit of these wheels is that they can tune and design the hubs/spokes and rims to work as a system and through high tech assembly can ensure a quality of construction few wheelbuilders can achieve. The spoke tensions for many of these wheels is significantly greater than can be achieved with conventional angled spokes and nipples - it means that they are generally stiffer and stay true longer. I build my own wheels too, but know that if I want something very light and stiff, it's practically impossible to find the parts to make something as stiff and light as a Ksyrium ES, a Shamal or Fulcrum Racing without spending a lot for the parts i.e. a pair of AM Classic hubs, Sapim X-Ray spokes and some Ambrosio Excellite rims will cost me over œ350 - getting close to what I can get some Mavics as part of a 'team' deal

vermootencp · June 2007

and using tubulars on sportives without a support car would be just dumb ... yes?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

Russ76 · June 2007

exactly, you would only have to carry a spare tub with you anyway and that would be pointless ..... Clinchers are the only way to go for sportives

vermootencp · June 2007

Thanks Russ76, just checking!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

Unknown · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by vermooten

and using tubulars on sportives without a support car would be just dumb ... yes?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Not necessarily. If you're able to change a tub at the side of the road then there is no real difference between getting a puncture in tubs and clinchers.

I rode the Felice Gimondi in Bergamo last month and noticed a lot of people riding fancy carbon wheels with tubs. Many of them had a can of the Vittoria tub repair stuff taped to their seat tube.

Unknown · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Russ76

exactly, you would only have to carry a spare tub with you anyway and that would be pointless ..... Clinchers are the only way to go for sportives
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Is there really that much difference between carrying a spare tub and having a spare inner tube for clinchers? I don't think so.

currieinahurry · June 2007

the problem isnt the fitting of either its the fact that when repaired the clincher will be nearly perfect where as teh tub will not be glued as securely and you will need to be more carefull on it.
tikka

hi my name is adam... and i have a problem with posting on cycling forums.

Unknown · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by currieinahurry

the problem isnt the fitting of either its the fact that when repaired the clincher will be nearly perfect where as teh tub will not be glued as securely and you will need to be more carefull on it.
tikka
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">But most tub tape or glue is a contact adhesive so there is no reason why it shouldn't be glued on as securely.

currieinahurry · June 2007

but shouldnt it be let to dry and set before you ride?? i dont own tubs but when people mount them you should leave some glue to dry first i thought then use some more to mount the tire then leave to dry.
(you do have more posts than me so your probably right)
tikka

hi my name is adam... and i have a problem with posting on cycling forums.

vermootencp · June 2007

2 days to dry innit? or that's what someone on WW posted recently I think.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I'll do what I can to help y'all. But the game's out there, and it's play or get played. That simple."

Ken Night · June 2007

I run 4 bikes

1x Zondas-Audax/training-nice and stiff, but the '03s are a bit heavy
1x Eurus-best bike-comfortable and fast, need special tool to true
1x Open pros on Daytona hubs-nice, stiff, stay true, heavy
1x Open pro (blue anodised) on Veloce 1995 (?) hubs-nice to ride

I can service all the hubs(bar the rear Veloce which is sealed), but balk at the cost of Campag cones at œ12ea, so œ48 for a set-so perhaps would avoid Campag hubs-if they were œ5ea they'd still be dear, but I could just about swallow that

With this experience, my criteria would be lightness, stiffness, seviceablility, and something I can true myself if away from home

Andy, perhaps you should score the suggestions on the criteria you would choose?

If I was buying wheels again, I'd probably also go "beyond bling"-understated excellence-Open pros with serviceable hubs? or the DT Swiss 1450 (isn't there another,lighter, model Mon Chasserelle?)

"I once prayed to God for a bike, but quickly found out he didnt work that way...so I stole a bike and prayed for his forgiveness"

Unknown · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by currieinahurry

(you do have more posts than me so your probably right)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">[:)] If only that were true!

I've no idea - I was just curious as to why people are so anti-tubs so was asking questions. I'm bored.

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