Legs, hills... aggghh

dale_harrison · July 2018

Hi there,

New rider, been cycling on and off for a couple years, way more off than on tbh. Got back into it a few weeks ago, got myself a hybrid (Giant FastRoad CoMax) to act as a commuter and something to take round the country B roads where I live (East Sussex) for a bit of fitness.

I'm plodding along at the moment at around 50 miles a week, normally do a lunchtime (when working from home) or evening (when back from work) 10-20 mile ride - using Strava to log data - find that element quite interesting, and fun occasionally trying to better PRs on some segments.

...what I am finding however is since I started riding again my cardiovascular fitness has improved lots (not by any means in comparison to other riders, but I've noticed it myself in how I feel as well as seeing some segment times naturally improve without really trying) - but what is irritating me a lot is how my legs seem to be the first thing to give up - I've not seen this before - I'd run out of puff before my legs say enough!!

I have one local "hill" (Dewlands Hill - Rotherfield, East Sussex) that I'm sure to you lot would be a load of old meh - but I've just not been able to summit the damn thing. Strava sticks it in as a Cat4, but I think that is rubbish and am not going to get hooked up on what Strava thinks - all I know is I can't finish the climb yet, and I really want to!!

Is there something I should be targeting / doing to help improve the capability of my quads / legs? Or should I just keep riding, start going a bit further, a bit faster as time passes and try it again periodically?

Appreciate any useful insight

shirley_basso · July 2018

Generally speaking, if you have easy enough gears, you can spin up without too much muscular effort, albeit at a low speed and it takes longer.

What’s your easiest gear, weight and stats of the hill (or link to the strava segment)?

What do you mean by running out of puff?

drlodge · July 2018

If its your legs are giving up rather than your lungs, then your lowest gear is perhaps not low enough so your legs are pushing too hard. If you can't change the gears (cassette) then its just practicing. Trying starting the hill slower/more easily, so you have something in reserve for the higher parts of the climb. Often when I struggle to climb a hill its because I put too much effort in too soon.

Try taking the hill really easily in your lowest gear, almost try to not get out of breath and see how it goes. Hopefully you'll then have enough in reserve towards to top.

dale_harrison · July 2018

Thanks chaps.

Link: https://www.strava.com/segments/1580017

By puff - I mean lungs, breathing, my max HR got to about 176, so I have a little more to give there, but it is the legs that gave up, and I wasn't near the top - I reckon another 100 meters to go.

By comparison, I smash this one each and every-time: https://www.strava.com/segments/737437

bflk · July 2018

Just give it time, that first one is pretty steep (by my standards) towards the end. Make sure you pace yourself on the lower section so you have something left rather than tear into it.

joe_totale-2 · July 2018

Looks like it's the section that is 15% and over which is giving you the issue. The other hill seems to top out at around 10% which makes it quite a different beast.
As the others have said spin to the steep section in an easy gear so you are as fresh as possible for the steep bit. How are you with pedalling out of the saddle? It's not for everyone but some people find the steep bits easier out of the saddle as you get more power on the pedals.

paul2718 · July 2018

drlodge seems to have it covered.

Plus add some determination. Don't even think about failure, as soon as you are considering stopping there's a bit in your brain that has already got off and laid on the ground and decided that feels pretty good. So use the smart part of your brain, this is an easy hill with a hard one immediately after. You could do the hard one by itself, so make the easy one easier until you can do the hard one. Then do it all again.

keef66 · July 2018

Yep, it's all about pacing / gauging your effort. Sit and spin up the easier bit and keep enough in reserve to be able to attack the last really steep section standing.

Although I have to say I find the latter easier on a drop barred bike.

N0bodyOfTheGoat · July 2018

dale_harrison wrote:

Thanks chaps.

Link: https://www.strava.com/segments/1580017

By puff - I mean lungs, breathing, my max HR got to about 176, so I have a little more to give there, but it is the legs that gave up, and I wasn't near the top - I reckon another 100 meters to go.

By comparison, I smash this one each and every-time: https://www.strava.com/segments/737437

While your "problem" cat4 only has ~40 feet more climb with 0.1 mile less distance, 344ft over 1 mile is quite sharp. But also, it's gradient varies a lot over the segment with a relatively steep finish, your "easy" one is quite constant.

If your legs are going on that final section, you need to pace yourself better on the lower section, using an easier gear (if that is possible) and higher cadence, saving power for the ~0.1 mile top section that peaks at 19%.

At a very brief look at the climb, my initial strategy with my Cube's 34-50T chainrings and 11-32 cassette would be something like...
50-28 (or 25) for that initial ~0.1 section
Attempt to go through gears to 50-18 in the middle section
Drop to 34T at the start of the steep rise and gradually drop to 25T sprocket
Then try to smash that last little bit to the summit

... But your ability may mean a different strategy would work for you!

There's far more talented and younger riders than me on here, but having bought a power meter in spring, I've discovered I can produce more power at ~75-80rpm cadence up hills and that means on good days I can attack anything less than ~10% gradient using my 50T chainring. I used to use my 34T chainring far more and spin at ~90rpm, which used less energy at the cost of slower times.
Closest climb I've done that reminds me of your climb is Harvesting Lane, on the side of Butser Hill, https://www.strava.com/activities/16253 ... /4910/5283 got me a PB last month, 31secs improvement over my PB from last year.

The more you effectively train to improve your outright power and power stamina, the easier climbs become.

dale_harrison · July 2018

thank you all for your posts, and especially that last post, some great information and strategy to digest.

I've tried the whole hill currently on my easiest gear combination - and still failed - but pulling the stats of the hill apart as NitrousOxide has shows the differences - so I'm not going to be downhearted, just keep riding, keep training and will give it plenty goes more. I did forget one piece of information, I bought a new Hybrid as described above, but not used that bike yet - I'm still on my extremely old Boardman Hybrid, which feels a lot heavier than the Giant, and creaks and groans through the gears - so maybe a couple of KGs less (on both me and the new bike) and some renewed confidence will help crack it.

To be honest, and being so new to this I didn't even know what the 34/50 meant on my chainring - figured that out now ;-) - I'd also like to invest in a power meter, I like data, gives me something to look at when recovering at home!!

drlodge · July 2018

Barhatch is a bit like that hill...starts off at 10% or so which is fine, then ramps up...and ramps up...then right at the end when you're just about done its 20% ++

Legs, hills... aggghh

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