Were there ever any Ti-coated fork legs?

Anonymous · June 2007

Topic title changed
Most decent sus forks used to have their legs coated in titanium nitride. Now almost all new marzocchi forks seem to be black anodised, or chrome.
My ancient (2001) Jr Ts upper legs look perfect, not a scratch at all. still silky smooth, even after several bad crashes and a lifetime's worth of abuse.
I've seen a fair few newer zocchis with serious marks in the upper legs after only a few years use.

So why have they stopped using Ti? was it just too expensive? or did they realise that people were only buying the one set of forks, and were'nt likely of ever replacing them?[:D]

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HaHo · June 2007

Don't know... Ti has increased in price pretty dramatically in the last few years. Don't the top end 888s have ti nitride coated stansion?

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Anonymous · June 2007

I think the very top end forks do, yes, but they're the only ones as far as I can tell.

The black anodising is just, well, crap.

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nicklouse · June 2007

2001 with Ti staintion coatings! dont think they are.

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John · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

I think the very top end forks do, yes, but they're the only ones as far as I can tell.

The black anodising is just, well, crap.

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<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Black anodising is hardly crap, Where did that conclusion come from?

Like has been said they wouldnt waste precious Ti on JrTs. Also the fact yours are stil nice and newer ones are battered is no indication of how good the coating is,

My old 888s I only ran for a year and a half and sustained a bad rub on one of the stantions from someones swingarm carelessly being placed on it on an uplift,

Its down to luck in crashes wether your stantions get marked or not, You may have not crashed on rocks like the people with the bad scratches may have done.

havent fallen off,
im just having a rest

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maurice · June 2007

I thought the main use of ti nitride on fork legs was to reduce stiction, maybe it's only worth it for uber-plush forks?

http://www.pinkbike.com/photo/1345770/

HaHo · June 2007

It's also very hard wearing I think. But yeah, it would be wasted on forks that weren't already pretty smooth.

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Anonymous · June 2007

Pretty sure they are. I'll take a photo when the sun comes out again if you want.
Jr Ts were much much much more expensive back then than they are today though.
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nicklouse

2001 with Ti staintion coatings! dont think they are.

nick
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nicklouse · June 2007

unless the fork has changed from the picture in your sig then the answer will be the same. thay are not Ti nitrided.

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Anonymous · June 2007

Well, not crap, but it's not as nice as Ti. I have seen relatively new forks with black anodised legs looking well ragged after a few months, whereas on older Z1s etc, the stanchions look brand new.
Take a good look next time you're surrounded by bikes, the old forks with Ti coating look pretty much showroom condition. Not just Zoccis, but Pace and Fox too. (I never get drawn to staring at rockshox or manitous, i just look away to block my own bad memories![:D])
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by John

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

I think the very top end forks do, yes, but they're the only ones as far as I can tell.

The black anodising is just, well, crap.

<hr noshade size="1">
My trusty steed
1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
<hr noshade size="1">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Black anodising is hardly crap, Where did that conclusion come from?

Like has been said they wouldnt waste precious Ti on JrTs. Also the fact yours are stil nice and newer ones are battered is no indication of how good the coating is,

My old 888s I only ran for a year and a half and sustained a bad rub on one of the stantions from someones swingarm carelessly being placed on it on an uplift,

Its down to luck in crashes wether your stantions get marked or not, You may have not crashed on rocks like the people with the bad scratches may have done.

havent fallen off,
im just having a rest

Updated [:D] Glory Jackal

Safe as Fu<s></s>ck Pushbike Bullsh<s></s>it and Wideopen Mag.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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My trusty steed
1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
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Anonymous · June 2007

What is it then? it certainly lasts, and looks as good as new.
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nicklouse

unless the fork has changed from the picture in your sig then the answer will be the same. thay are not Ti nitrided.

nick
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lacuna · June 2007

Its just the bare alloy as far as I'm aware

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John · June 2007

Well of course scratches and marks are going to show up on black stantions more than it will on silver/gold.

havent fallen off,
im just having a rest

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nicklouse · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

What is it then? it certainly lasts, and looks as good as new.
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nicklouse

unless the fork has changed from the picture in your sig then the answer will be the same. thay are not Ti nitrided.

nick
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<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> standard anodised finish.

nick
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Anonymous · June 2007

Standard anodising? really? BAH rip-off.[:0]

It really does seem much harder wearing than the black anodising they're using these days though.

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Anonymous · June 2007

Hmm, just had a look. The top-end 888s have nickel plated stanchions, so no, no Ti there either.
Even foes and White brothers forks don't use Ti coating. rockshox boxxers don't either.

Hmm. dissapointing.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by HaHo

Don't know... Ti has increased in price pretty dramatically in the last few years. Don't the top end 888s have ti nitride coated stansion?

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<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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360 · June 2007

only mtb fork that im aware of that ever had a ti nitride coating was a boxxer.

and it was rubbish, as was the boxxer slippery silver coating.

"I stepped on something soft and wobbly, struck a match and found it was a dead chinaman"

P.s Im not doing that again.

Anonymous · June 2007

Curously enough though, if you search to Titanium Nitrdide coating on the net, then you will get a load of pages saying things along the lines of
"TiN is commonly used as a protective and performance enhancing coating on such items as bicycle and motorcycle suspension... etc"

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TE · June 2007

Hasnt it occured to you that there may be better materials than Ti Nitride that might also be cheaper?
Why are you so dissappointed? Hard anodising is plenty adequate enough for most forks, lasts, and is slippery enough as long as it doesnt get damaged, which is rare.

Top end superbikes have Ti Nitride fork stantions BTW.

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Anonymous · June 2007

I'm dissapointed because I know it's one of the very hardest coatings available. That's why it gets used on the cutting egde of various tool-bits in high end machine tools.

If there was a harder, cheaper surface treatment, then surely that would be used for machine-tools?

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My trusty steed
1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
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ROCHA · June 2007

There harder and more slippery coatings available for sure... Probably not in the bike suspension fork market, though. Even if some company came up with a suspension fork with a stanchion coating much better than titanium nitride people would still think it wasn't half as good as Ti Nitride. That's because it has a flashy cool name![:D] I'm surprised no one has ever came up with the idea of a suspension fork with a big red sticker on the stanchion itself saying:
TITANIUM NITRIDE
They'd sell it to the millions![:D]

WD-40? GT-85?? I'd rather use the old AK-47!

nicklouse · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

I'm dissapointed because I know it's one of the very hardest coatings available. That's why it gets used on the cutting egde of various tool-bits in high end machine tools.

If there was a harder, cheaper surface treatment, then surely that would be used for machine-tools?

<hr noshade size="1">
My trusty steed
1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
<hr noshade size="1">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> but it is not that good. look at any well used (03,5) 04 Z150. they have Ti nitrided staintions. (yes black can be a colour for Ti nitride) and most of them will have had the colour worn off.

nick
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John · June 2007

Christ your not letting this go are you, Im sure if you were really bothered and had a lot of money you could get your stantions coated, But you would need the stantions skimmed to accomodate the thickness of the coating,

In most cases the standard coatings are fine as the bushings that are made nowadays are really high quality and new materials are being descovered all the time,

My 40s which Id consider a high end fork have standard annodised stantions and they are smooth as anything.

havent fallen off,
im just having a rest

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Anonymous · June 2007

Meh, who cares? I just thought the legs were Ti coated on older ones. The gold anodising seems to stay looking better for longer.

Nicklouse, how does black TiN coating work? What makes it black?
I thought it was titanium Carbide that was black? But the only Ti Carbide things I've seen have had an intentional slight roughness to the surface.

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My trusty steed
1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
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rubber side up · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

Meh, who cares? I just thought the legs were Ti coated on older ones. The gold anodising seems to stay looking better for longer.

Nicklouse, how does black TiN coating work? What makes it black?
I thought it was titanium Carbide that was black? But the only Ti Carbide things I've seen have had an intentional slight roughness to the surface.

<hr noshade size="1">
My trusty steed
1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
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<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The gold anodized forks look good because if they get scratched there isnt such a contrast against the silver metal below.

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Anonymous · June 2007

I don't think it's just visual. If I run my fingers down the stanchions, I can't feel any scratches, or roughness at all.
I do also prefer the look to the new black coating.

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nicklouse · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

Nicklouse, how does black TiN coating work? What makes it black?
I thought it was titanium Carbide that was black? But the only Ti Carbide things I've seen have had an intentional slight roughness to the surface.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

no idea ask Marz.

and

RS used to Ti nitride coat their fork legs untill it started to fall off.

nick
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Anonymous · June 2007

Well, I won't ask marzocchi, because they don't use it! At least I don't think so, unless that's what they call hard black anodized?!?!?
Their top of the line stuff is nickel-coated.

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red eye · June 2007

arnt they coated with Teflon or something?

nicklouse · June 2007

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

Well, I won't ask marzocchi, because they don't use it! At least I don't think so, unless that's what they call hard black anodized?!?!?
Their top of the line stuff is nickel-coated.

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1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
<hr noshade size="1">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> FFS the 03,5/04 Z150 has Ti nitrided steel staintions. and you aske how does that work ASK them as yes they did it!

nick
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Anonymous · June 2007

You really are a very phycotically angry man aren't you?
from the horse's mouth...

The Z150 FR is the only single crown freeride fork to offer "works" style nitrite coated steel stanchions 

Nitrite. Nitrite is not Titanium NitRIDE.

Stop smoking the crack, and chill the frick out.
I asked you because you seem intent on demonstrating an innate understanding of life, the universe and everything. I thought you might like to share a sample of that knowledge regarding black TiN.

Answer is, you can't. You can, however get black TiCN. Titanium Carbon Nitride.

Doen't matter anymore anyhoo, I was just curious, but you seem intent on turning this into a war.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by nicklouse

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by yeehaamcgee

Well, I won't ask marzocchi, because they don't use it! At least I don't think so, unless that's what they call hard black anodized?!?!?
Their top of the line stuff is nickel-coated.

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1999 marin wolfridge, Marzocchi Jr Ts, Saint cranks, D321 rims, Hope C2s, raceface bits and bobs, XT running gear. All vintage stuff! (apart from the saints)
<hr noshade size="1">
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> FFS the 03,5/04 Z150 has Ti nitrided steel staintions. and you aske how does that work ASK them as yes they did it!

nick
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<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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Were there ever any Ti-coated fork legs?

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