Zwift Vs Bkool

apcmtb

Afternoon.

Further to my turbo training post of yesterday I managed to pick up a bargain of a turbo trainer compatible with both of the online platforms above (as far as I can see these are the big 2).

Having never used either (and with trials available on both) I’m interested to gather opinions on both (or any other similar platforms) before I sign up.

Thanks in advance

daniel_b

I used to use BigringVR, which was very good to be fair, but I just got a little bored with it.

I'm currently using IndieVelo, which is in Beta but also free currently, and seems VERY easy to setup and use, and also works pretty well on my not that new laptop.

As I understand, it has been created by some ex zwift people - but happily has no power ups, glowing wheels, or invisibility cloaks etc etc.

I find the power lag less pronounced than on the sadly dying today RGT :-(
*Thanks wahoo.

pblakeney

My preference is for Fulgaz. No racing, just the best videos and most VR of the options I've tried. Rouvy is close but too much on screen data for my liking. YMMV.
Some have difficulty connecting but I've had none of that. Best suggestion is trial periods.

me-109

Definitely try the trials, but since you only get 14 days, don't do them together unless you're riding everyday. Try a bit of everything that each has to offer.

I was quite happy using Bkool going from a dumb trainer. More interesting, plenty of rides available and quite a decent user base to always have company/opponents on the 10 or so rides that show on the landing page as either being the featured route or live (somebody else is or has recently been on it). The search sort of works but isn't always accurate in finding a course or route you're looking for, but there are plenty of options for mountain passes and you can search for shorter and flatter routes. The augmented reality of other riders I found a bit pants.

Zwift is a different beast. More limited in routes but there's plenty to go at. Some are only opened up to you as you progress through levels, which is easy at first. Obviously it is gamified with the digital ride of your choice - frames and wheels impacting the aero/weight performance of your efforts. Loads of people, you can free-ride, race, group ride, set up rides with mates, do prepared workouts or create your own.....

Zwift is more expensive and hasn't come out with an annual subscription yet. I took up an offer on Bkool again but only used it a few times - once when Zwift wasn't letting me in and a couple of times to try and get some value out of the short sub. I didn't review and am not likely to in the short term. I like my escapist world.

apcmtb

Thank you all for the summaries on each platform you’ve used so far.

Having done some more research, don’t think Zwift will appeal to me, seems much more of a gaming platform & designed probably for users half my age😂.

As the Bkool trial is 30 days I’ve signed up for that as the selection seems more in depth, more choice and closer to an experience that I could use long term.

I also like the sound & look of IndieVelo so will try that too after my trial period, always good too if it’s a set up via ex employees of a bigger firm as it tends to lead to innovation from lessons learned from a bigger brand.

Really appreciate the advice and opinions.

andyrr

Anyone using Mywhoosh? I’ve been using this since recently getting my first smart trainer (JetBlack Volt). Was really easy to setup and connect with the trainer and HR strap (as well as my more recently acquired Garmin watch which I discovered can broadcast HR). However I experienced a few failures, initially with accurately reflecting cadence and hence power and now it won’t load routes properly and I’m stranded in a virtual no-mans land without my avatar.
Looks pretty likely that I will be switching to a (ideally cheap/free) alternative.

daniel_b

Not tried mywhoosh, had heard it needed a pretty decent spec machine to run?

Heard of a few people other than yourself having issues with it, sounds like IndieVelo could be the next one to try.

If I continue to get on with it I may well take out a subscription, I think early backers get some kind of lock in on price, or reduction in price increases in the coming years, I think a years membership up front is a little over £100, which doesn't strike me as too bad in the current day.

andyrr

Re Mywoosh, yes, the relatively high machine spec seems to be something I’ve seen being advised to many people having issues as the root of their problem. I’ve gone through I think 2 updates with the app with the result that with me making no changes to the device I use it went from working perfectly to not at all - v.annoying.

dannbodge

Been a zwift user for over 5 years now.
I have tried most of the other platofrms but always seem to end up back on zwift.

It does everything. Want a really hard ride, sure do a race. Want a chilled out zone 2, join a pace partner. Want to do structured workouts, then do that.

My only gripe is the £13 a month it costs, as I'd like to run wahoo x too as the workouts are better.

kingstongraham

MyWhoosh is virtual sports washing isn't it?

andyrr

andyrr said:

Re Mywoosh, yes, the relatively high machine spec seems to be something I’ve seen being advised to many people having issues as the root of their problem. I’ve gone through I think 2 updates with the app with the result that with me making no changes to the device I use it went from working perfectly to not at all - v.annoying.

Tried using my 5 or 6 year old Dell laptop to run Mywhoosh - Unfortunately due, I’m pretty certain to the GPU being an Intel one, whilst it loaded up a workout (slowly) it didn’t run - the graphics were choppy in the extreme. Will need to see how/if I can continue to use this on my devices. Might have to see who else in the house has something suitable.

daniel_b

Have you tried IndieVelo?

I have a similar age i7 HP with Intel graphics, and it runs fine on medium/standard settings.

apcmtb

daniel_b said:

Have you tried IndieVelo?

I have a similar age i7 HP with Intel graphics, and it runs fine on medium/standard settings.

It was mentioned a little further up in this thread, so I’m going to give it a try alongside my BKOOL trial.

Thanks 👍

thegreatdivide

kingstongraham said:

MyWhoosh is virtual sports washing isn't it?

Very much so. And it's cr4p.

daniel_b

thegreatdivide said:

kingstongraham said:

MyWhoosh is virtual sports washing isn't it?

Very much so. And it's cr4p.

Haven't heard very good things about it, though not tried it.

andyrr

daniel_b said:

thegreatdivide said:

kingstongraham said:

MyWhoosh is virtual sports washing isn't it?

Very much so. And it's cr4p.

Haven't heard very good things about it, though not tried it.

I’m new to the world of smart trainers and wanted, initially at least, to ride using a cheap app to see how I got on with that before spending more money, so I’ve went for Mywhoosh. I also was more interested in first trying out workouts as opposed to racing so it seemed to offer what I might have wanted and it has been pretty enjoyable. Main dawback currently is that now I can’t get it to run on my iPad nor windows laptop so I’ll look at the alternatives. Zwift is more expensive really than I can spend. Second issue with Mywhoosh is that it seems to constantly fixing problems/bugs which is nice that they might put resources to this but for the platform that is to be used for the Esports world championships it seems not quite ready for its users yet?!

andyrr

Have had a quick run of Indievelo using my laptop (I’d prefer using my iPad but currently it isn’t supported).
Got it pretty quickly connected to my JetBlack and my Garmin Instinct Solar watch for HR (it can broadcast HR).
Picked a random workout and it looked and worked fine for the test ride. I had thought that I’d be riding indoors this weekend, due to me becoming a bit more of a fair-weather rider as I’ve aged but it seems to have picked up so I’ll give it a more proper test as soon in the near future I’m sure.

apcmtb

So a week into my BKOOL trial period, annoyingly (and after confirming with their chat/help people) the completed/history section doesn’t sync across devices.

Such a basic feature for web/app/windows to sync with each other and show overall history, but not something that BKOOL does😡.

DeVlaeminck

I use zwift - it's definitely not for users half your age unless you are 100. If you look at the results of any race there are plenty of riders in the 40-60 age range.

The objection some people have are graphics - they aren't going for realism - it doesn't bother me but each to their own.

It is the most popular indoor training app so I'd definitely give it a go. I tried rgt but didn't find it as good simply because it had far fewer users. The strength of zwift is the size of the user base - you can jump on without planning ahead and pretty much guarantee there will be races, group rides or training rides to join. If you prefer riding solo if course you can do that but other platforms may be better.

ugo.santalucia

I have used Rouvy for a couple of years, RGT for a while, I have tried Fulgaz as well and since last month I am on Zwift. Never been on BKool.
As far as I can see, the main advantages of Zwift are how busy it is at all times, relieving a bit of the gloom of riding indoors and the gamification, there is always a gadget to gain by pedalling, a button to press to go faster. Some people like this kind of stuff... there are also a large number of folks who seem to be really passionate about Zwift, possibly they come from the gym/spin classes manifold.
They make it look busy by limiting the number of courses you can cycle on, effectively the fewest of all platforms... you are either on Watopia or one of the other two worlds available on that day. You only need a few hundred riders at any one time to make it look very busy. There are loads of events... I mean loads, hundreds every day.
The racing is awful... there seems to be no correlation between any power metric and where you are in the pecking order. The other day I entered a race on the hilliest course, I am at the very top end of the B category according to Zwift metrics (3.95 zFTP) just to find myself mid pack, dropped up a hill by folks who were heavier and produced fewer W/kg according to the race results... a mystery... it seems the mathematics favour drafting, pressing the correct boost button and having the Tron bike over your actual physical performance.

Climbing: I find all apps tend to make it very easy, Zwift is no exception, I have almost made it to the top of Bealach Na Ba on a 90 inch gear (48x14), which is just unrealistic... I wouldn't get to the first bend in the real world. It was the same on Rouvy... didn't have to sweat too much to do the Alpe d'Huez in under an hour. Probably the best in this respect was Fulgaz, where my virtual time up the Struggle in Cumbria turned out to be the same time I posted at the National hill climb championship. However, Fulgaz has terrible Bluetooth connectivity issues, which is the reason I never paid for a membership.

whyamihere

Have you checked your trainer difficulty setting? I think Zwift defaults it to 50%, so the gradient sent to your trainer is half the gradient shown on the screen.

ugo.santalucia

whyamihere said:

Have you checked your trainer difficulty setting? I think Zwift defaults it to 50%, so the gradient sent to your trainer is half the gradient shown on the screen.

100%... it is about the climbs themselves... everybody I know goes under 50 minutes up the Alpe du Zwift with little more than 4 W/kg... but the times up Box Hill are quite realistic, pretty much the same times I used to do when I lived in Surrey.... 7-8 minutes from the roundabout and 6-7 minutes from the start of the Zig-Zag... don't know what the problem is with the longer climbs... AdZ and the ones of the climbing portal

ugo.santalucia

... also, they are not 50% easier than the real ones, they are probably 10-15% easier...
so the AdZ will give you a time which is 6-9 minutes faster than the one you would do on the real climb, not half the time

Dorset_Boy

whyamihere said:

Have you checked your trainer difficulty setting? I think Zwift defaults it to 50%, so the gradient sent to your trainer is half the gradient shown on the screen.

That's not quite how TD works butthat is a massive can of worms. 100% TD will make the climb harder than IRL, effectively reducing the range of your cassette. A lower TD widens the range. I've found around 60% to be the most realistic.

With regards to climbing speeds in virtual worlds there are a couple of factors. First there's no wind. Second, as you can stop at any point and hop off the bike if you blow up, most people will push much harder than in real life. On Zwift, I tend to ride the Alpe at my FTP, and IRL I wouldn't do that on a 10 km climb.

pblakeney

Dorset_Boy said:

...
On Zwift, I tend to ride the Alpe at my FTP, and IRL I wouldn't do that on a 10 km climb.

I suspect that's because IRL you have still to get to the hotel after the climb.
Not climb off and onto the couch. 😉

Dorset_Boy

pblakeney said:

Dorset_Boy said:

...
On Zwift, I tend to ride the Alpe at my FTP, and IRL I wouldn't do that on a 10 km climb.

I suspect that's because IRL you have still to get to the hotel after the climb.
Not climb off and onto the couch. 😉

Absolutely!

ugo.santalucia

it’s not that… the maths are simply not right… when any joe average who is a bit svelte can do the AdZ in 45 minutes or less, it’s not a question of wind… it is a question of wrong algorithm… IRL you need to be a pretty decent elite rider to hit those numbers and you likely have to climb well in excess of 5 W/kg… on Zwift 4.4 or so will get you there.
Virtual kom is under 32 minutes at 440W, the real one is about 37 depending on which segment you consider… and that’s by a pro, not by a guy on a Wattbike