Heatpump
pep.fermi
Posts: 135
I'd like to hear stories on central heating with a heatpump, rather than gas.
Our house was built 2019. At the time the housebuilder offered us to chose between gas and heatpump, the latter would have costed 30k more. Running cost would have been similar: heatpump needs 1/3 the energy (varies a lot, depending on the type, more efficient ones have lower running costs but cost much more to buy and install), but energy is electricity that costs x3 gas. Not sure maintenance costs, reliability etc. We opted for gas, because the lower cost. But I'm a hard core enviromental fanatic and I now regret the choice. So I'm contemplating replacing gas-boiler with heatpump, though doing it now is of course silly, should have done it then.
I'm still shocked by the fact the heatpump are so bloody expensive.
Informal recent quotation was ca 40k.
Anyone here changed from gas to heatpump?
Cheers,
Our house was built 2019. At the time the housebuilder offered us to chose between gas and heatpump, the latter would have costed 30k more. Running cost would have been similar: heatpump needs 1/3 the energy (varies a lot, depending on the type, more efficient ones have lower running costs but cost much more to buy and install), but energy is electricity that costs x3 gas. Not sure maintenance costs, reliability etc. We opted for gas, because the lower cost. But I'm a hard core enviromental fanatic and I now regret the choice. So I'm contemplating replacing gas-boiler with heatpump, though doing it now is of course silly, should have done it then.
I'm still shocked by the fact the heatpump are so bloody expensive.
Informal recent quotation was ca 40k.
Anyone here changed from gas to heatpump?
Cheers,
0
Posts
I know there are a few on here that have heat pumps and previous comments seem to give mixed reviews.
40K is crazy for a bit of pipe and an electric motor though, that's a lotta gas.
Instagramme
Price of gas and electricity will still be linked for quite a long time.
I don't think you will ever recover your money in your lifetime and most likely you will end up with a system which is less good at doing its job.
Will it make the house more marketable? Maybe, maybe not, but I don't think right now anyone will pay premium for that and in ten years they still won't because it will be an obsolete heat pump
How much more electricity will be needed if every household went fully electric? So, heating, cars etc... how many new power stations (or equivalent renewables) will be needed per year to get there?
Until after the election....
I am not sure. You have no chance.
80% of heat pumps installed in 2019 used r410a which is now being phased out as of Jan 23.
I think they’re moving to R32 which cant be used as a straight replacement in a r410a system so those old 2019 heat pumps would have to go in the skip so everyone can have a shiny new lower gwp version.
Hence if one's house's design is from the fossil fuel supply times, swopping to a heatpump ain't that simple. Not just ditch the gas boiler for a heatpump.
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition
£40k sounds very high but without knowing the building I don't know if it's justified. We would normally budget something closer to £10-£15k, but demand is high at the moment. If you have £40k to spend, I'd still look at where you can upgrade the fabric alongside any replacement of the old boiler.
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition
There's quite a gap between 'complies with the regulations' and 'ideal for a heat pump'.
Pinnacle Monzonite
Part of the anti-growth coalition
ASHP/GSHP - The efficiencies offered by such systems are very good - anything from 3 - 6 times+ kWh output to the kWh input. However, the heat energy out is much lower temperature than that of the hot water provided by a traditional gas fired boiler or from direct electric heater. Therefore you need a large emitter (radiator) to provide the same level/rate of heat transfer of a typical GCH + wet radiator system. Consequently the HP system is likely going to need to work longer and harder to provide the same levels of human thermal comfort you are used to if you don't have oversized radiators or UFH to emit the heat over a large area. Ultimately HTC is the thing that matters.
Modern property, post 2002, probably provides the necessary thermal performance in terms of insulation but also air permeability (how drafty the place is). Older properties are gash - poor fabric insulation and notably leaky i.e. they bleed warm air from the interior to the colder exterior quite readily. The consequence of this is that the indoor temperature drops easily and the heating system then has to switch on to maintain the desired temperature. Your traditional GCH will do this far quicker than a HP, and therein lies the issue - you 'feel' the temperature differential. And the larger the room the bigger the volume of air to heat to the desired temperature and the more heat energy required to achieve this.
If I was considering switching from GCH to ASHP (which I'm not - new high efficiency boiler and wet UFH combo) I'd do fabric first - roof, walls (where possible) and definitely glazing (u-values are really poor and heat loss high) internal ceilings, then I'd get my property tested for heat loss/leaks - infrared survey and air permeability test, addressing any issues as they present themselves. Ill-fitting doors, windows and other building envelope opening are a massive cause of heat loss. Then do nothing for a bit and see what impact that has on heat demand/energy consumption/bills compared with previous periods. Next it's consider a new high efficiency condensing boiler. No point keeping 80% efficient boiler if you can easily replace it with a 95% efficient one and run it for 10 years+ (15% saving straight off). Then do the comparative analysis between that new on paper set up versus an ASHP over the lifetime of the systems. Bear in mind you will likely have an external invertor 'box' that will be at the mercy of the elements - it will rot particularly if you are in a coastal location.
I can't comment on the costs of the OP's HP system - that would be property dependant, but £40k seems high for a typical residential property instal - maybe its a big country pile.
The take away is don't rush into HPs. They are not the silver bullet people think they are. They operate best in well insulated, low permeability property where the heat can be slowly built up and retained. They will not warm your home in the same way as a conventional GCH set up.
Bottom line - insulate well, use less energy overall and save on the bills........or get on the turbo to warm up
Our boiler feels new and efficeint but in reality is now over 10 years old so we could probably get something better. I would also like to replace all the radiators that I assume are the originals from the early 70s (plus the pipework could probably do with upgrading as we've had a couple of leaks). Not sure if the radiators would greatly improve efficiency but we could certainly get something less bulky and have them in better locations. However, as above and RJS always says we need to stop the heat leaking before looking at the source of the heat.