Tourer Vs Gravel

baron_o_buchlyvie

Hi a'body.

I need a new bike (mine was stolen a couple months ago) and I have the option of building another Thorn Sherpa, or buying a gravel bike.

I can understand the benefits of the Gravel bike, being faster for a start, but I wonder how much I can carry on it as I do fancy doing some touring again.

Has anyone toured on a gravel bike? The one I want is steel, so it'll be sturdy, but I'm wondering about it being able to carry everything I want.

voicycle

After owning a carbon gravel bike for a year I sold both my winter road bike and my Dawes Galaxy to fund a custom Ti gravel bike build (plus kept the carbon gravel bike).

Something like a Thorn makes sense if you're going to spend extended periods in parts of the world where you can't get good replacement parts, but I pretty much only tour here in Scotland and don't envision doing anything more than a week or so in central Europe even in my most adventurous visions of the next 10ish years. And if I did want to go do a round-the-world then it would be a big enough undertaking that I'd probably build/spec a bike specifically for the job anyway.

If that sounds anything like you then here are (were) my other considerations:

1. The stack on the Galaxy was stupidly high and I just don't need it for the kind of touring I'm doing. Endurance road bike position is good enough for me for multiple long back to back days, and I've got a traditional stem on my build that I can flip over if I really want to relax on a particular trip. If you have flexibility/posture issues then you might want to stick with a tourer though.
   
2. Most carbon gravel forks with bosses on them are only rated for relatively low luggage weights - really just a drybag in an anything-cage. I got one of the very few on the market which is actually designed to be able to take a front rack and panniers (a Rodeo Spork). It's about a 300g penalty over most others IIRC. In retrospect it's probably overkill as I've now dialled my bikepacking kit to the point that I can't really see wanting a 4-pannier setup again. Standard bikepacking setup but with the seat bag swapped out for a rear rack and a pair of panniers really expands capacity an awful lot and I just can't see needing to go beyond that for my use any time soon.
   
3. Looks like that Sherpa you're looking at is rim brake. Unless you anticipate needing spares in a developing country I don't think there's any reason not to go to discs these days - ideally hydraulic, but even some of the half-decent cable operated ones will be at least as good as any rim brake and will save your wheels (provided you're using appropriate disc-specific brake housings).
   
4. Unless you're a particularly heavy rider then your pannier rack is probably going to be the weight-limiting factor in your setup. Pretty much any bike frame designed with rack bosses (rather than just mudguard bosses) is going to be able to support whatever you put on it.
   

Hope that helps!

voicycle

Oh and gearing! Obviously you can build (and rebuild) your rig however you want but that's another concern I had which proved to be unfounded.

I was nervous to lose my triple chainset but I really wanted hydraulic STIs which meant going to a double. I think my small ring on the Galaxy was a 26t and my cassette went up to 34t. On GRX I'm at 31t small ring and a 34t max allowable big cog, so I have lost some gearing. I haven't missed it yet, but if I was going on a long alpine tour I might switch from 2x to 1x so could stick on a really tiny chainring for the climbs and then just freewheel more descents. Or could get into using rear mech extenders and try sticking a really big cassette in back.

baron_o_buchlyvie

Tremendous reply mate. Thank you. Your post and the detail of it have helped me clarify a few things in my head.

I do want to get back into multi week tours in wilder places, so a tourer would be exactly what I'd be after. I may actually go for the Nomad with disc brakes. As you know in this part of the world, winter roads make brake blocks into sand paper. I can use it as a winter rider too and just have to accept that it aint gonna be particularly speedy.

So aye, just a matter of saving and also praying my original turns up (I got a mildly promising lead on it today, so fingers crossed).

Thanks again pal. I really appreciate your taking the time over your response.

navrig2

I've just bought a Shand Stoater with the intention of using it to tour and for off road riding locally. First tour outing is July with a big one planned for 2023. I want the option of being able to use tracks and towpaths when touring and many tourers have too skinny tyres for that.

froze

A gravel bike is a Swiss Army Knife type of bike, you can tour on it, go gravel riding, road riding, etc. with it.

If you plan on touring with 50 plus pounds of gear, and there are a lot of mountain grades you'll be climbing, a 1x system will leave you wanting more.

A gravel bike, depending on the maker, will have up to 50c tires. Mine came with 45s but I now use 38s because most of my time is spent on the road, but if I can do gravel roads on 23c tires I would have no problem doing gravel with 38s. Touring bikes usually use 28c to 38c tires.

Wheels are the potential weak spot on a gravel bike, they use less spokes than a touring bike will, a touring bike will have at least 36 spokes, while a gravel bike will have no more than 32. But rims can be swapped out if you want to do extreme expedition type of touring and will be carrying 100 pounds of gear.

There are pros and cons to mechanical and hydro brakes. I went with mechanical because they are a lot easier to maintain on the road should something go wrong, less tools are needed to be carried with mechanical too. But others don't mind fooling with hydro brakes, hydros are extremely smooth but I was coming off of cantilevers, and going to mechanical disk I found them to be extremely smooth compared to cantilevers. When you tour, weight drags you down, and carrying tools and fluid to fix or bleed your brakes is extra weight. Hydro brakes do self-adjust, mechanical do not, but it's just a simple turn of the barrel adjustment, and boom you're good to go. You should read more about the two types and then decide which will suit your needs the best; since I was going to be touring, I wanted to be able to fix them easily and carry fewer tools.

Some will say that a gravel bike cannot carry heavy loads, how heavy is too heavy? I carry 50 to 60 pounds and haven't had any issues on a gravel bike. My gravel bike is heavy compared to a touring bike. Touring bikes come with more mounts, but today gravel bikes are doing the same thing. Touring bikes will have a longer wheelbase while making it comfortable to ride you give up the handling response that the gravel bike will have. A lot of gravel bikes you can't get the handlebars level with the seat like you can with a touring bike, thus your riding position on a touring bike is more upright, however, with spacers, you can raise the bar on a gravel bike, if still not enough height you can get stems with more angle.

seanoconn

froze said:

A gravel bike is a Swiss Army Knife type of bike, you can tour on it, go gravel riding, road riding, etc. with it.

If you plan on touring with 50 plus pounds of gear, and there are a lot of mountain grades you'll be climbing, a 1x system will leave you wanting more.

A gravel bike, depending on the maker, will have up to 50c tires. Mine came with 45s but I now use 38s because most of my time is spent on the road, but if I can do gravel roads on 23c tires I would have no problem doing gravel with 38s. Touring bikes usually use 28c to 38c tires.

Wheels are the potential weak spot on a gravel bike, they use less spokes than a touring bike will, a touring bike will have at least 36 spokes, while a gravel bike will have no more than 32. But rims can be swapped out if you want to do extreme expedition type of touring and will be carrying 100 pounds of gear.

There are pros and cons to mechanical and hydro brakes. I went with mechanical because they are a lot easier to maintain on the road should something go wrong, less tools are needed to be carried with mechanical too. But others don't mind fooling with hydro brakes, hydros are extremely smooth but I was coming off of cantilevers, and going to mechanical disk I found them to be extremely smooth compared to cantilevers. When you tour, weight drags you down, and carrying tools and fluid to fix or bleed your brakes is extra weight. Hydro brakes do self-adjust, mechanical do not, but it's just a simple turn of the barrel adjustment, and boom you're good to go. You should read more about the two types and then decide which will suit your needs the best; since I was going to be touring, I wanted to be able to fix them easily and carry fewer tools.

Some will say that a gravel bike cannot carry heavy loads, how heavy is too heavy? I carry 50 to 60 pounds and haven't had any issues on a gravel bike. My gravel bike is heavy compared to a touring bike. Touring bikes come with more mounts, but today gravel bikes are doing the same thing. Touring bikes will have a longer wheelbase while making it comfortable to ride you give up the handling response that the gravel bike will have. A lot of gravel bikes you can't get the handlebars level with the seat like you can with a touring bike, thus your riding position on a touring bike is more upright, however, with spacers, you can raise the bar on a gravel bike, if still not enough height you can get stems with more angle.

Impressive level of consecutive posts 👍

me-109

What is it that people think is going to happen to hydraulic disc brakes that would stop them working? Anyone any first hand experience of hoses being ripped out of levers or calipers, even off road? Torn hoses? Anything much from the racing world?

Not had an issue with mine, even in the MTB, which I don't think I've bled since new (many many years ago) and still feel sharp.

joeyhalloran

I'd imagine there is now a lot of overlap between gravel and touring bikes. On the less racey end of the gravel spectrum the geometry is designed to be very stable, long wheel base with reasonable stack which would be similar to most tourer bikes.

I'd say as mentioned, the carbon folk (lighter, 'more comfortable' but restrictions on weight) is the biggest difference on the frameset. Wheels and gearing can be adjusted to suit riding on either type of frame.