Are we already stuffed for quality of choice with purchasing options?

thistle_

cookeeemonster said:

Can’t see how Ashley closing a load of shops in the midst of a bike boom is good business sense myself...

One of the few retail outlets that are allowed to stay open during lockdown too. Maybe he hasn't got any leverage with those landlords to cut rent or he's not getting rates relief as a result, and he can't really furlough those staff.
I guess right now those stores are expensive to run if you only look at the outgoings, even though they might be the only ones making money.

bmxboy10

I think he is consolidating the HO and Warehouse with his existing ones up north somewhere.

elbowloh

daniel_b said:

It clearly makes him cash somehow.

This is what he did with the once legendary Lillywhites, established in 1863.
I visited once in 2001, when it was still with the original owners, and then unaware it had been snaffled, visited after the take over - it was shocking.
The previous setup with beautifully organised and labelled areas and floors for each sport was gone. When I have visited in 2001 I had a squash racket restrung, and a skillful member of staff spent about 10 minutes talking me through the various options, and to find out what would suit my playing style best.

At my subsequent visit I was met with blank looks when I asked if they still did racket restringing.....

Everything was piled up - pile em high, flog em cheap.

https://theguardian.com/business/2019/dec/05/sports-direct-puts-lillywhites-london-lease-up-for-sale

Was Wigmore Sports on Wigmore Street around then? They specialise in racket sports I think, so would be a good place to go for restringing.

daniel_b

@elbowloh the name rings a bell, but I don't think I went there.
I don't work in the big smoke anymore, back then I used to work on the Strand which was a wonderful location, with so many great places within reach of a lunchbreak.

Assuming it is still branded as Lillywhites, I couldn't bring myself to go back in there, you are spot on, it exuded quality and knowledge - if a shop can do such a thing!

I did my time commuting into London, although working solidly from home is taking some getting used to!

bmxboy10 said:

I think he is consolidating the HO and Warehouse with his existing ones up north somewhere.

Wouldn't surprise me if he wants minimal stores, and to concentrate on the online side of things - has to be more lucrative than store rents, and paying staff to cover long shop hours.

cookeeemonster said:

I worked in Lillywhites as a 16 year old...it was a rare thing, a sports shop that actually sold stuff for sports with staff that actually knew about those sports!!! Slight contrast with Sports Direct, admittedly

Evans only got into trouble because they were bought out a few years ago by a company that loaded them with debt - they were doing fine otherwise.

Can’t see how Ashley closing a load of shops in the midst of a bike boom is good business sense myself...

Whenabouts did you work there?

MidlandsGrimpeur2

Was Wigmore Sports on Wigmore Street around then? They specialise in racket sports I think, so would be a good place to go for restringing.

Yes it was, I used to live round the corner around that time and used to get my squash and badminton rackets from there!

Got a deep nostalgia for Lillywhites as well, by far the best sporting goods shop in the country before Ashley took it over, I remember walking in there after he had bought it (not knowing he had) and thinking what the hell has happened in here!

I suspect part of Ashely's overall plan is to acquire as much retail space as he can, through the acquisition of all these high street chains. It looks like he is putting himself in a position (probably already has) where he can give landlords a good kicking on rent reductions etc. and pretty much do what he wants with commercial space in future as he will have them pretty much reliant on him. He then just piles them all up with cheap stock and gets staff on minimum wage to flog it off.

navrig2

It's hard to see what the city "high streets" are going to look like in another 5 years.

In the last 5 years Princes Street in Edinburgh has lost or is losing 4 department stores.

Frasers closed - building is now the Jonny Walker Whisky Experience opening as soon as Covid stops being an issue.

BHS - closed and redeveloped as a hotel, smaller retail and residential.

Debenhams - remains to be seen what happens to it.

Jenner's - just been announced that the owner would not give in to Ashley's rent negotiations so House of Fraser are leaving. News reports suggest the building will be refurbed and partially converted to a hotel.

Edinburgh's experience is not unique but other places probably cannot accommodate more hotels or tourist attractions.

Of course many people will shrug their shoulders and say that it doesn't affect them as they buy everything online however these shops and these buildings are generally owned, in some way, by Pension funds......

elbowloh

I gather the owner of the Jenner's building had been looking to turn it into a hotel for years, so was likely to never agree to a new rent deal.

pblakeney

elbowloh said:

I gather the owner of the Jenner's building had been looking to turn it into a hotel for years, so was likely to never agree to a new rent deal.

Probably saw the writing on the wall.
All high street retail buildings are at risk of losing rental income.

lakesluddite

It does seem to be that the 'department store' is suffering more than most - probably due to the sheer square footage that each one requires, and the fact that most things you get in there are cheaper online.
It is difficult to envisage what the 'high street' will look like in a decade, and this pandemic will, I think, continue to be another nail in the coffin even after it is over. I suspect that the number of people who now realise that working from home is not just doable, but even desirable, will mean fewer people coming into town and city centres. I for one will do at least two or three days out of five at home (employer agreement depending!).
So what will the high street look like? More city and town centre living? More people actually living in the centre would actually increase the need for shops, pubs, restaurants etc, so it might come down to a balance of living and retail - having a sustainable number of retailers, enough to service the locals, but not so many that rely on regular incomers.

Anyway...that's diverted off topic somewhat. I am really trying to make a concerted effort to buy stuff (including cycling stuff) only when needed, rather than wanted - trying to get the very most out of each garment, shoe, component, whatever. I have been as guilty as most people of wanting the latest shiny new thing, but this is not really sustainable on any level. Example - chose to use the same phone that had come to the end of it's contract but just with a new SIM deal, rather than upgrade to a new phone as well. Small steps I know...

david37

i wonder if shimano will become more expensive now madison can control the market in a way it couldnt before. Independent bike shops struggled before and the situation isnt going top be improved if they cant do a lot more than sell the odd new bike and some servicing.

bianchi_dave

bmxboy10 said:

elbowloh said:

They're not a big outfit, but I've regularly got bits and pieces from these guys online (I never realised until fairly recently, they're also 15 mins drive away from me

https://www.gbcycles.co.uk/

GB Cycles used to be a 100% road bike shop and were great. They owned another general bike shop down the road and merged operations. Since then its gone down hill IMO. They used to have really good sales in January but no more....I think they moved following the Croydon riots.

I see that GB Cycles is closing down today. Another one gone....

elbowloh

Shame.

They're also closing at just a day's notice!

bianchi_dave

elbowloh said:

Shame.

They're also closing at just a day's notice!

Yeah, seems a bit drastic! Quite surprising given they offer servicing/repairs, especially with the covid cycling boom. You'd think they'd have stock to sell off too. Bought a few things off them online over the years, but not for a long while.
A shame to see another one go to the wall

flasher

bmxboy10 said:

GB Cycles used to be a 100% road bike shop and were great. They owned another general bike shop down the road and merged operations. Since then its gone down hill IMO. They used to have really good sales in January but no more....I think they moved following the Croydon riots.

bianchi_dave said:

I see that GB Cycles is closing down today. Another one gone....

elbowloh said:

Shame.
They're also closing at just a day's notice!

Yeah a shame, but as said they were never the same since the move.

darkhairedlord

david37 said:

i wonder if shimano will become more expensive now madison can control the market in a way it couldnt before. Independent bike shops struggled before and the situation isnt going top be improved if they cant do a lot more than sell the odd new bike and some servicing.

We can kiss goodbye to competitive pricing if it has to through one distributor.

womack

From a personal point of view I am more upset by the loss of lbs's than less choice on the net. Lost three good ones locally in last few years (in the middle of a cycling boom)

Yesterday was a prime example, I needed one headset spacer, the lbs I used to use would have just given me one (a spacer) as he knew he would more than get the price of a spacer back from me.

I am left locally with Halfords £7.99 a bag meaning I have to buy a load I neither want not need or Evans who don't stock any locally but you can click and collect to store at what is it £4.99?.

Or I can go on the internet for this 99p spacer and I have the choice with Wiggle and Merlin of buying stuff up to the value of £20 to get free postage or pay postage of whatever amount (maybe £4.99 again not sure) on a 99p spacer.

Either way I ain't getting the job done today or tomorrow.

Without wishing to sound like a moaning old f-rt the situation reminds me of when we had a hardware store in our village where you could go and buy the amount of screws, nails etc you needed to do a job, not 100 because that is the pack size that is now the norm in the DIY sheds.

As you may have guessed I am not a big fan of internet shopping quite apart from the affect it is having on retail jobs.

Whilst I realise a lot of people will say price (which to be honest isn't always that much cheaper) it's hard to barter with a website.

Realise we are all different but give me the convenience / interaction of an lbs anyday.

bmxboy10

flasher said:

bmxboy10 said:

GB Cycles used to be a 100% road bike shop and were great. They owned another general bike shop down the road and merged operations. Since then its gone down hill IMO. They used to have really good sales in January but no more....I think they moved following the Croydon riots.

bianchi_dave said:

I see that GB Cycles is closing down today. Another one gone....

elbowloh said:

Shame.
They're also closing at just a day's notice!

Yeah a shame, but as said they were never the same since the move.

Why on earth GB Cycles stopped being a 100% road bike shop is beyond me. They had a niche and it worked. Whenever I went in there they were busy and had a real club vibe. What a shame.

elbowloh

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2021/mar/22/bike-poland-brexit-customs-duty-vat

Anyone on here?

These bike buying issues from the EU have made it into the Guardian.

ddraver

I've said it elsewhere but, yes the days of oodles of choice, lads of stock with everything discounted 30% are over in Britain. Same as Switzerland has always been - and they re a good place to see how it's going to go

You may get 4-5% off online now but that'll be it. You'd better make damn sure you re buying from the UK too or otherwise it'll take weeks and arrive with a big bill attached.

Now, whether or not you think that's good or bad....?

Wheelspinner

Years ago, bike stuff here was stupidly expensive to buy, then online shopping happened and suddenly we could access a vast range - in stock - at crazy cheap prices. LBS's were losing trade and in reality it wasn't their fault too much; it was the monopoly distributors here that set the prices.

Example: I had Campag Super Record 11 speed groupset and was moving it from one frame to a new one. In the process, stripped the body thread that the braze-on front derailleur clamp bolt fitted.

Rang all over town, found one in stock finally.

Me: You have one?
LBS: Yes! Dunno why we do but it's in the cabinet, and it's braze-on too.
Me: How much?
LBS: Hmm, lemme check.... RRP is $447. Jeezus! Hang on. (Short silence). Boss says we can do it for $375.
Me: Um, thanks, will ask bank for a loan first.

Meanwhile, log online, browse... ooh look, Ribble have them in stock in UK. Shipped and in my mailbox in 6 days for... $146.35

Now the locals have figured out their gravy train is over and pricing is much more even across the board, from local compared to Euro or UK suppliers. Mind you, the manufacturers have also agreed to block some retailers from shipping brands into other country markets on a much wider scale than they used to.

Nowadays, CRC/Wiggle have an Australian warehouse, and they keep a small selection of stock there, but otherwise I can't order Shimano parts from them if they are ex-UK stock for example.

Mavic always had that block in place for US to ship outside, as did lots of other brands.

Now we just have no stock, because our market is small and low priority. Currently not uncommon to hear people waiting 6 months or more for ordered bikes/frames/parts.

mididoctors

spa cycles have things I need and want.

disc brakes have created a mess. everything is insanely expensive

vincesummerskRoxcBTr

I have used Fawkes cycles on for a few bits, seem pretty good.

wayneabs

I recently used Start Fitness, had a bike in my size in stock. Placed the order, then phoned them up saying I didn't want it built so they sent it out immediately.

So bike ordered and received within 4 days, which now a days is pretty good going.

The prices of bikes are going through the roof right now, although there has been a steady rise for about the last 10 years

This last 12 months is another level

vincesummerskRoxcBTr

I was in our lbs today, decided on a new Cube at 10% discount as I had met the owner before, good service.
However I was gobsmacked at the prices he had up for bits and bobs, eg. Inner tubes £7 , Bontrager bottle cage £15 (less than £10 most places), there was little stock of most stuff.
He must make most money from bike sales and servicing as there is only a Halfords and an independent bike mechanic (who doesn't sell stuff) in the locality.

rick_chasey

To the OP - totally agree, though I have also found that since 2016 the cost for anything has gone up enough that I basically have avoided buying any non-essential kit. I can't quite believe how expensive kit is nowadays.

Quick look at my previous purchases and it goes Sigma (never bought online from them before), amazon, amazon, amazon.

So I guess I'd add amazon to your list.