Starting/Leaving a job

ddraver

Hi Hive mind,

those if you who follow the big threads will know what im talking about here...

If i start a remote job - which starts with 3 weeks training- very soon but leave within the first month. Is there anything that could come back to bite me in terms of penalties/fines etc.

The job is a plan Z but its going to start before decisions about plan A are finalised. The two jobs are not in any sort of competition. Notice periods in the contract are short (nothing for the first month) but there is a line about recovering costs for training if one leaves. However i suspect this is for if an established employee took an expensive external course and then buggered off the following week to work for a competitor rather than an induction.

Decision needs to be taken ASAP. Not sure this forum always brings it out but fundamentally I'm an honest dude and i dont especially like lying but...needs must...

slowmart

If its a private company, almost certainly the line regarding covering costs will be applied to you.

The cost of searching, filtering and on boarding new employees is a significant business cost. Add the training on top and any employer will be frustrated and look to recover their costs.

And we've all been there deciding to die on the sword of principle or crack on and protect what's precious in terms of family. Best wishes for it working out in your favour.

BTW could you fail the training? ;-)

ddraver

One option is to do the first week and say, "sorry but this isnt for me". Obviously i accept that i wont be paid. that seems entirely fair...

That's a thing, right? (happens to us at Plan A all the time)

elbowloh

In my experience companies only recover costs for training if there has been a learning agreement in place that you've signed specific to a particular course, like you say to do a diploma or degree course etc rather than an induction. Doesn't mean they won't be really pissed off though.

ddraver

I mean... obviously its not so much burning a bridge but dropping a nuke on the bridge...

But i dont see it being a bridge I'm going to care about much. This is all a COVID caused problem...

surrey_commuter

i think the worst that would happen is that they deduct it from the wages they owe you

pblakeney

ddraver said:

One option is to do the first week and say, "sorry but this isnt for me". Obviously i accept that i wont be paid. that seems entirely fair...

That's a thing, right? (happens to us at Plan A all the time)

Not experienced it personally but I think not being paid would be the extent.
Assuming the training is home based or in-house. Different for external courses.

elbowloh

surrey_commuter said:

i think the worst that would happen is that they deduct it from the wages they owe you

Difficult to cost an induction?

ddraver

The other thing is theres a whole bunch of us...dont know how many but its a "mass start" type thing

Pross

I'd agree with those saying the cost relates to actual training rather than their processes for a new starter. In a previous job we had someone join who decided by the end of the day it wasn't for them, they simply didn't show up the next day and we eventually found out they had gone back to their previous job. It's a bit annoying if you recruit someone and they quit more or less straight away but I doubt they would try to charge you for the privilege.

My daughter was in a similar situation earlier this year after returning home. She got offered a job in a similar role to what she had been doing before coming home (call centre for a health insurer) and then got interviewed for a more career focussed job relating to her degree. She didn't want to risk saying no on the offer but also knew she would rather be doing the "proper job" if offered it. She got told unofficially her preferred job would be making her an offer but didn't have anything formal by the time she was due to start the other job. In the end she took the risk and called to say she wouldn't be starting rather than wasting their time training her for a week. She got the formal offer for her preferred job a few days later but was then unable to start for a few months due to the lockdown which subsequently left a gap in her employment history and meant a provisional mortgage offer was turned down so it doesn't always pay to try to do the right thing!

rick_chasey

Absolutely fine to do that, as long as you're ok cheesing them off.

Is there a probation period? Most roles have one...

ddraver

Yes, there's a probation period...

rick_chasey

ddraver said:

Yes, there's a probation period...

Probation cuts both ways.

ie there is no notice period during probation so either side can say no at any time and walk away.

david37

The answer to this question is....... it depends.

i.e. it depends on whats in your employment contract. Remember you have to agree to deductions in writing.

You also have statutory rights relating to deductions from pay/wages which are not removed by anything thats written in your employment contract. EVER. some of these are specific to the sector youre in such as retail and some cover everyone such as not being paid less than the statutory minimum wage.

which would leave the employer to sue you for anything else.

it would be an unusual situation for an induction cost to be recovered by the employer but there are some right tossers out there.

Situations where you might be in trouble and their might be a legitimate claim would be training with a commercial value and a high cost to deliver. eg getting an HGV licence or similar and then saying thanks and bye and going else where.

Finally, it does happen that employees leave and it can leave a bitter taste, especially where the employer can ill afford to repeat the costs of the recruitment and induction process.

To a certain extent your own moral compass must guide you!

EDIT or get yourself fired

First.Aspect

rick_chasey said:

ddraver said:

Yes, there's a probation period...

Probation cuts both ways.

ie there is no notice period during probation so either side can say no at any time and walk away.

This. But read the small print, particularly if the training is prolonged or costly for the employer.

ddraver

Ive just found out by "mass start" i mean 700 people!!!

and apparently they re expecting people to act like this so theres no come back on me...

so it looks ok in this sense, but...see my post in the Brexit Thread 😳

First.Aspect

Yeah, sounds like all 700 of you will be on an extended job interview.

Sainsbury's or Tesco?

Cargobike

It's a dog eat dog world out there right now and with unemployment rates rising and vacancies decreasing, looking after No.1 should be your priority.

They can't deduct anything from your wages unless you have agreed to it upfront, either in writing or as a clause in a signed "onboarding" document.

Any employer worth their salt should have contingencies in place for these types of eventualities, so the onus should be on them, not you.

If in doubt, shagging the boss' daughter usually attains the desired result. Works for me every time

Pross

Cargobike said:

It's a dog eat dog world out there right now and with unemployment rates rising and vacancies decreasing, looking after No.1 should be your priority.

They can't deduct anything from your wages unless you have agreed to it upfront, either in writing or as a clause in a signed "onboarding" document.

Any employer worth their salt should have contingencies in place for these types of eventualities, so the onus should be on them, not you.

If in doubt, shagging the boss' daughter usually attains the desired result. Works for me every time

Don't you run your own company?

rick_chasey

Just go for it.

I did it once. Got a temp job for 6 months working in their accounts whilst looking for work. By the time I started I was waiting on an offer and after day one two arrived, so I called in after day one to say sorry I got a permanent job offer so I won't be coming in again.

It's the name of the game. They wouldn't think twice about binning you off if they could get someone better, so you should apply the same logic.

First.Aspect

There is a bridge-burning consideration in some sectors. My profession is way to small to get away with this. Doubt this is a concern for you though dd.

pblakeney

Beware now. I thought the bridge was part of BJ's masterplan. 🤣

me-109

As per a couple of comments above, if you weren't suitable they would sharp get rid of you, and unless it was a condition of the contract that you pay for the training within x time if leaving or fail the certification, then you aren't likely to be pursued.

Take it and see what happens. You never know what might happen to Company/Role B in the following weeks. I got a shutdown contract one Friday, rocked up on the Monday (other end of the country) and it had been canned over the weekend. Equally I went elsewhere for a six month contract and did nearly twelve years.

EDIT: I did do a daybreak flit from an overseas job after a couple of months because it was a bit carp, and didn't get any fallout from that. No training, mind.

ddraver

Thanks all, I shall update the Brexit Thread with any gossip I hear...

veronese68

ddraver said:

Thanks all, I shall update the Brexit Thread with any gossip I hear...

But I really don't want to go back into the Brexit thread.
Good luck with the job thing.