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Setting a bike up for a turbo

RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
edited October 2019 in Indoor training and turbo forum
I have an original Tacx Neo, and since a recent bike fit I've been meaning to get the turbo bike setup correctly.

One thing I have, is the saddle quite far forward, and this is where I'm confused. With the riser block in place, the saddle is 3 cm further back from the BB than I would like. Without the block, it's spot on. The riser is the standard one that comes with the Neo.

So should I setup my bike off the riser? Other than stopping the wheel twisting during the session, what's the purpose of a riser?

Posts

  • webboowebboo Posts: 5,505
    Sorry but I don’t get this. I have a 3 position riser block, one is neutral in that it just makes the bike level. The other two positions lift the front wheel in order to simulate going up hill. The saddle is always in the same position in relation to the bottom bracket and handle bars.
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 11,989
    Putting your bike on a turbo should not alter the position in any way.
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    This is the trainer that I have

    T2800_NEO_Header_2533x1044px_2018.jpg

    And that's the block I have.

    The detail that I might have missed on my first post is that I'm measuring how far behind the BB the tip of the saddle is. the distance that's shown here as '5cm Tolerance'

    New%20position%20rule%20for%202014.jpg

    NOT the height of the saddle.
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 11,989
    Doesn't matter. None of your measurements will be altered by putting the bike on a turbo. The only purpose of a riser block is to compensate for any difference in the rear wheel's height off the floor..
  • cougiecougie Posts: 22,512
    Do you change your bike setup when you go up or down a hill ?
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    cougie wrote:
    Do you change your bike setup when you go up or down a hill ?

    Yes, every time. I take a lazer level, tape measure and plumb line with me every ride. Some of the guys I ride with find it annoying, but they can't say too much as I crush them up every hill...
  • slowmartslowmart Posts: 4,370
    Is that after you’ve adjusted the geometry on your bike?
    “Give a man a fish and feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and feed him for a lifetime. Teach a man to cycle and he will realize fishing is stupid and boring”

    Desmond Tutu
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    Slowmart wrote:
    Is that after you’ve adjusted the geometry on your bike?

    Only if I take my MIG welding kit, which is helpful for both mild frame tweaks and resistance training.
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 11,989
    Poor trolling..
  • N0bodyOfTheGoatN0bodyOfTheGoat Posts: 5,536
    If you're only going to use the bike on the turbo over winter, set it up on the turbo.

    If you're also going to do some outdoor rides on it over winter, either adjust things each time you ride in/outdoors, or set the bike up for outdoors and find a height for the front wheel off the floor that works for you.
    ================
    2020 Voodoo Marasa
    2017 Cube Attain GTC Pro Disc 2016
    2016 Voodoo Wazoo
  • StillGoingStillGoing Posts: 5,207
    Why is anyone replying to this? The saddle doesn't move in relation to its distance behind the BB just by putting the front wheel on a riser block. The OP is either fishing for bites or a complete idiot.
    I ride a bike. Doesn't make me green or a tree hugger. I drive a car too.
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    philthy3 wrote:
    Why is anyone replying to this? The saddle doesn't move in relation to its distance behind the BB just by putting the front wheel on a riser block. The OP is either fishing for bites or a complete idiot.
    Firstly, I'll freely admit that I may have misunderstood something and what I'm seeing is incorrect.
    Secondly, I don't appreciate being called a "complete idiot", I've come with what I thought was a reasonable question, and have been treated to a stream of sarcastic replies, which I've stooped to with a couple of my responses.

    However, my question still stands, and I'd like to understand what I'm seeing and in which position I should set the bike up.

    On both occasions the red line goes through the centre of the BB (click on the image to get a clearer version)

    Screenshot-20191012-233440-com-android-gallery3d.jpg

    Screenshot-20191012-233447-com-android-gallery3d.jpg

    So, what's the difference I'm seeing? What am I missing? Happy to have it explained to me, but if the only answers are rude or sarcastic, I'll rather be left floundering in the darkness for an answer.

    Thanks.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 22,982
    I like flounder. Nice fish.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 11,989
    Still not sure I understand what your issue is, but if by 'set the bike up' you mean 'get the correct fit' - then do that off the turbo, on the flat, using whatever measurements you have. Then put the bike on the turbo, with the front on the riser block if necessary. Apart from that, I'm just not seeing the problem..
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    Imposter wrote:
    Still not sure I understand what your issue is, but if by 'set the bike up' you mean 'get the correct fit' - then do that off the turbo, on the flat, using whatever measurements you have. Then put the bike on the turbo, with the front on the riser block if necessary. Apart from that, I'm just not seeing the problem..
    What I'm struggling with, is when I set the bike up on the flat, with the measurements that I need, then transfer it to the trainer and put it on the riser, the measurement in the photos above are different.

    My understanding of what the riser does, is that balances out the lift occurs when mounting the bike on the turbo. So why should the measurements be different from when it's on level ground if that's the case? They are the same without the riser as they are on level ground.

    Also, the angle of the saddle is out by a couple of degrees, which would further suggest that it's not flat when on the riser.

    So there are 3 states
    Level ground: Correct
    Trainer without riser: Correct
    Trainer with riser: Incorrect
  • imposter2.0imposter2.0 Posts: 11,989
    So use it without the riser. In practice, it won't matter. A couple of degrees or mm here or there is not going to be critical in any way.

    I'll say it again though, your fit does not change simply by putting the bike on the turbo. Sorry to say, this really seems like a complete non-issue.
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    Imposter wrote:
    So use it without the riser. In practice, it won't matter. A couple of degrees or mm here or there is not going to be critical in any way.

    I'll say it again though, your fit does not change simply by putting the bike on the turbo. Sorry to say, this really seems like a complete non-issue.

    No need to apologise, I'm happy for it to be a non issue, it just seemed to contradict what I thought the purpose of the riser block was. I was just surprised when the difference came out at 2cm, which is a fairly decent amount.
  • me-109me-109 Posts: 1,785
    The tip of your saddle is following an arc around the rear wheel axle as you add or remove the front wheel riser block. You can see against the planter in the background the effect this has. The saddle has not moved in relation the the bottom bracket or handlebars. Your relative position is no different.
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    Me-109 wrote:
    The tip of your saddle is following an arc around the rear wheel axle as you add or remove the front wheel riser block. You can see against the planter in the background the effect this has. The saddle has not moved in relation the the bottom bracket or handlebars. Your relative position is no different.
    Thank you
  • webboowebboo Posts: 5,505
    My understanding is you shouldn’t need a riser block with a direct drive turbo anyway as the cassette is the same height as it would be on a 700c wheel.
  • RossoCorso34RossoCorso34 Posts: 204
    Webboo wrote:
    My understanding is you shouldn’t need a riser block with a direct drive turbo anyway as the cassette is the same height as it would be on a 700c wheel.

    Interesting, where did you read that?
  • StillGoingStillGoing Posts: 5,207
    Webboo wrote:
    My understanding is you shouldn’t need a riser block with a direct drive turbo anyway as the cassette is the same height as it would be on a 700c wheel.

    Wrong. Direct drive and wheel on turbos are all different. Some need a riser, some don't. Measure the height of your rear axle from the ground and compare it to the height of the front wheel axle to know if you need or want a riser block. Some prefer to have a slightly more elevated front wheel on the turbo for a perceived more comfortable position like putting a couple of spacers under the bars.

    OP, if you're going to ask a question, ask the right question. Claiming that your saddle is moving from its position behind the BB because you've put it on the turbo is factually wrong. Your set up hasn't moved at all.
    I ride a bike. Doesn't make me green or a tree hugger. I drive a car too.
  • webboowebboo Posts: 5,505
    philthy3 wrote:
    Webboo wrote:
    My understanding is you shouldn’t need a riser block with a direct drive turbo anyway as the cassette is the same height as it would be on a 700c wheel.

    Wrong. Direct drive and wheel on turbos are all different. Some need a riser, some don't. Measure the height of your rear axle from the ground and compare it to the height of the front wheel axle to know if you need or want a riser block. Some prefer to have a slightly more elevated front wheel on the turbo for a perceived more comfortable position like putting a couple of spacers under the bars.

    OP, if you're going to ask a question, ask the right question. Claiming that your saddle is moving from its position behind the BB because you've put it on the turbo is factually wrong. Your set up hasn't moved at all.
    I stand corrected.
  • webboowebboo Posts: 5,505
    theboyfold wrote:
    Webboo wrote:
    My understanding is you shouldn’t need a riser block with a direct drive turbo anyway as the cassette is the same height as it would be on a 700c wheel.

    Interesting, where did you read that?
    On the instructions that came with my Elite Muin turbo. My riser block is from when I had one with a roller for the back wheel.
  • redjeepǃredjeepǃ Posts: 531
    Wow. some people seem a bit tetchy today.

    Your bike set up doesn't change, it's just that your front wheel is lifting because of the block which is there to correct for the additional height of the back wheel in the turbo and to help 'simulate' going up a hill. If you don't like the way the bike feels than just use a smaller (thinner) block. It may look like it's moved if you're using a plumb line to measure it.

    BTW you don't need a anything special, my front wheel has sat on a piece of chipboard left over from some work in my loft for years.
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