Emonda Vs aero bike

RossoCorso34

I have a 2019 Trek Emonda SLR and whilst I'm very happy with it my head has been turned. Turned towards something aero. I've lusted after a SystemSix since they were released, and recently decided not to buy one and went for the Emonda instead.

However.

The Cycle to Work scheme is now unlimited and there are some good deals to be had on the basic SystemSix. So my question is, are the two bikes too similar to have together? I live in Berks and can turn left for flat fast rides and right for hilly stuff. However, the hills aren't alpine and on my test of the SystemSix, I found myself quicker up very short climbs. The sort you can sprint up.

So will I spend my rides wishing I'd bought the other bike instead. My on road riding tends to either be short 60-90 minutes after work, or 60ish miles at the weekends and some longer sportives in the summer, . Or is it possible to run a pair of bikes and just enjoy them for what they are.

My friend has also mentioned the Madone SL6 as an alternative to the SystemSix, but his feeling is that with the fancy suspension, it's too similar to the Emonda and I'll not use the Emonda again.

I'm in a quandary and looking for opinions on running multiple road bikes.

pilot_pete

The cycle to work scheme has always been unlimited, it simply requires a credit licence to offer over £1000, which most companies don’t hold, therefore they just set a £1000 limit. There is one scheme that holds the required licence and therefore can offer bikes of greater value. The issue is, is your employer signed up with that scheme, because if not, unless they hold the credit licence you will probably find that they still limit their scheme to £1000.

Regarding the bikes, well, if you can afford it have what you want. I’ve got a full on aero bike and a non aero summer bike, both Colnagos and I ride the aero one on the flats and the other in the hills (Peak District on my doorstep). It is lovely having two top end bikes with different characteristics. The other benefit of course is always having a top end bike bike available, which if you do a lot of miles there are bound to be times when one requires a service/ fix/ repair.

What I would say is if you don’t have a dedicated winter bike I would get one of those first.

PP

RossoCorso34

Winter bike is covered. I certainly don't need a bike, this is a luxury that can be afforded due to the Cycle Scheme.

w00dster

Apologies - long post coming up.....
I used to have an Emonda SLR, now have an Aeroad CLX. On a recent week in Girona I rented a SystemSix (second time doing so).
The Aeroad is great fun, I actually preferred it over the System Six. I found the System Six to be like riding a tiger down the fast descents, whereas the Aeroad is much more planted and as such much more fun when riding at speed. Obviously this is a statement about the wheels, but the System Six is a system. A friend also has the hi-mod etap AXS system six, he won't ride it in the wind and prefers his Supersix for climbing (we are both fairly light riders, I'm 67kgs and he's about 62kgs). Going uphill on the System Six, my personal opinion was that it wasn't a bike you can settle into a long climb on. I was up and out of the saddle. Where on the Emonda I will stay seated on the long climbs. Possibly down to the System Six being a hire bike and not really tweaked to my fit, but it was more of a chore to climb on.
I was faster on the Emonda than any other bike going up hill, not by much, but I enjoyed climbing more on the Emonda. I'd even be finding long climbs to go up. On the Aeroad its the complete opposite, I now enjoy finding flatter routes. But thats probably old age and lazyitis catching me up. The Aeroad climbs OK, and obviously its about the rider not the bike really, it might even be rose tinted glasses lamenting on a bike I used to have, but I just enjoyed riding it. I did read an article though about it being incredibly un-aerodynamic, but can't recall where that was.
Out of all the bikes I've had, the Emonda SLR I found to be the best all rounder. That includes CAADs, Supersixes, Madone's and a TCR. I had decent light weight aero wheels on mine, build was about 6.2kgs when fully weight weenie or about 6.6kgs in normal riding guise. I had the H1 fit and was a really good fit for me.
I guess its personal choice, my friend with the System Six wouldn't ride a Trek, he loves his 'Dales, pretty sure his advice would be to get the System Six.
One other thing to mention about the System Six, can the spacers be reduced? I find it pretty ugly and the position too upright.
TLDR - I preferred my Emonda SLR over the System Sixes I have rented.

RossoCorso34

Thanks w00dster, I know where you are coming from. I'm actually keen to have something that is different to the Emonda though if that makes sense.

I've never ridden a Canyon, and have no idea how I can test one before pulling any sort of trigger, I've ridden a SystemSix for an hour or so and was very happy on it, I've come from a Super Six so the style of ride isn't that different, it's just that everything has been turned up a notch or two. Like I say, around my way I can pick the style of ride that I can do, so hanging on to the Emonda will make a nice change up.

With regards to the weight issue, and being blown about, I don't have too much of an issue in that regard, but the crosswind comment is interesting. Were you running the Knot wheels? With regards to the settling piece, I'm a fidget anyway, always shuffling around or getting up out of the saddle. Although, I can settle on the Emonda for longer than any other bike I've ridden.

Interesting point of view though, I guess so much of it comes down to how you and the bike gel, which you can never really tell on a short hour blast from a shop.

w00dster

I have to admit I found the style of the Systemsix very different to my old supersix (which I loved). I found the Systemsix very tall, almost Synapse level. It didn't have the snappyness of the Supersix.
Yeah it was the Knot wheels. I've ridden a lot of posh wheels, the Knot were probably the worst I've encountered for cross winds. They were so bad I was honestly laughing at how unstable they were. This isn't a lack of experience of 60mm wheels, I've had all sorts of deep dish wheels (including 60, 80 and 90mm TT wheels)
When I bought the Canyon I had a number of bikes on my shortlist. The Supersix was one of them, luckily I managed to rent one in Spain before I bought. The Canyon again I was lucky in that a riding buddy the same size as me has one so I borrowed it for a week. If you're anywhere near MK / Bedford area one day you're more than welcome for a test ride (my Aeroad is a size small in Canyon sizes, which is approx a 54)
I'm not recommending the Canyon by the way, but I honestly think its a better bike than the Systemsix. Obviously thats just my opinion. I was "given permission" by SWMBO, but I couldn't justify the price difference after riding both. Of the two of us who rented them, we were both a bit underwhelmed. But as mentioned, the guy who bought the Systemsix absolutely loves it (apart from riding it in strong winds).

RossoCorso34

Which Super Six did you have? Mine was a 2016 I think

w00dster

I've had a few, and CAAD's which offer similar feel to me. First Supersix was in about 2008/2009, then an Evo in 2013. I ride them quite a bit though, brother has one as his spare/winter bike when I visit his (he lives up North). His is the 2015 Hi Mod version.

roubaixmb

If you want it and you can afford it, is there any need to think any further? Of the current crop of aero bikes I'd plump for an S3, but now we're heading OT

RossoCorso34

RoubaixMB wrote:

If you want it and you can afford it, is there any need to think any further?

I don't think you're wrong...

neeb

theboyfold wrote:

RoubaixMB wrote:

If you want it and you can afford it, is there any need to think any further?

I don't think you're wrong...

Hmm. Debatable. I've just spent the best part of 300 quid on a stem. I wanted it and I can afford it, but I wonder about myself sometimes... Googling shopping addiction/compulsive spending..

But would I be happier if I'd put it towards getting my bathroom retiled instead? Probably not. First world problems..

RossoCorso34

neeb wrote:

theboyfold wrote:

RoubaixMB wrote:

If you want it and you can afford it, is there any need to think any further?

I don't think you're wrong...

Hmm. Debatable. I've just spent the best part of 300 quid on a stem. I wanted it and I can afford it, but I wonder about myself sometimes... Googling shopping addiction/compulsive spending..

But would I be happier if I'd put it towards getting my bathroom retiled instead? Probably not. First world problems..

I'm sure we could all tell tales about spending on bikes vs spending on houses etc, it's just a case of balancing it out.

neeb

At the end of the day if it's considered non-pathological to spend hundreds or thousands of pounds on a wristwatch, clothes, interior decoration, luxury cars etc then I suppose there's nothing wrong with spending similar sums on bike stuff that you enjoy owning, even if it's marginally beneficial in functional terms.. That's what I tell myself anyway!

I think the issue is that we're in a minority wanting to shell-out for bikes as opposed to that other stuff. There's an analogy with religious belief - if you believe in the Christian or Islamic god you are perfectly normal, but if you have an equally implausible personal belief (e.g. that Elvis was a visitor from an extraterrestrial alien master race) you are certifiable..

RossoCorso34

We all know that Elvis isn't from an alien race, he's the manager down at my local chippy...

gary_sparrow

theboyfold wrote:

We all know that Elvis isn't from an alien race, he's the manager down at my local chippy...

You should write a wee little song about that

d.pike

RossoCorso34 said:

I have a 2019 Trek Emonda SLR and whilst I'm very happy with it my head has been turned. Turned towards something aero. I've lusted after a SystemSix since they were released, and recently decided not to buy one and went for the Emonda instead.


However.


The Cycle to Work scheme is now unlimited and there are some good deals to be had on the basic SystemSix. So my question is, are the two bikes too similar to have together? I live in Berks and can turn left for flat fast rides and right for hilly stuff. However, the hills aren't alpine and on my test of the SystemSix, I found myself quicker up very short climbs. The sort you can sprint up.


So will I spend my rides wishing I'd bought the other bike instead. My on road riding tends to either be short 60-90 minutes after work, or 60ish miles at the weekends and some longer sportives in the summer, . Or is it possible to run a pair of bikes and just enjoy them for what they are.


My friend has also mentioned the Madone SL6 as an alternative to the SystemSix, but his feeling is that with the fancy suspension, it's too similar to the Emonda and I'll not use the Emonda again.


I'm in a quandary and looking for opinions on running multiple road bikes.

Hi ..... I'm in australia so know nothing about the Cycle to work scheme, however I can certainly share some input on whether to stick with an Emonda or go aero with say a madone.
I rode a 2019 Madone SLR 9 Disc for 12 months covering over 17,000 km. From day one I always felt it was too heavy ( 8.4 kg in race mode, XXX6 wheels ) and I had to work too bloody hard in the bunch than I did on my much lighter 2013 Madone ( 7.2 kg with a Zipp 404 F and Zipp 808 R ). Leg fatigue was always an issue with the constant little accelerations and decelerations as we moved through the bunch to do our turn at the front. Throw in surges caused by egos etc and it felt even worse.
Luckily I had paint issues on the frame and I was able to replace the aero Madone frame with supposedly the least aero frame going round. An Emonda SLR Disc in H1 geometry.

Wow, what a revelation. I put on the same bontrager xxx 6 wheels, same dura ace di2 groupset and power crank, same saddle but added a xxx aero bar and xxx stem to replace the integrated aero bar and stem which wouldn't fit the Emonda. Weight 7.5 kg in race mode. Trek reckon there is around 20 to 25 extra watts involved in riding the Emonda over the Madone.
I've found a difference of only 4 watts on average over 5,000 km at the same average speed over the same terrain in the same bunch. My max power output is up, my maximum speed is up and my average sprinting speed over a regular 400 metre finish is also up by 2 km/hr. All this is with the same average HR and cadence, although my sprinting cadence is up by 3 rpm. The bike is just much easier to ride and I'm not talking hills .... all basically flat where the Madone should be in its element. Leg fatigue is basically non existent except when under duress when racing etc. Ride data from my Madone SLR9 Disc over 17,000 km and the Emonda SLR 9 Disc over 5,000 km is below.

2019 Madone 2020 Emonda difference
BASIC RIDE DATA SLR 9 Disc Di2 SLR 9 Disc Di2
17,000 km 5,000 km
Bike race weight 8.4 kg 7.5 kg 900 gms Lighter
Average Distance 71 km 69 km 2km less / ride
Average Speed 29.9 km/hr 29.9 km/hr Same
Avg Max Speed 52.9 km/hr 55.4 km/hr 2.5 km/hr quicker
Average HR 123 bpm 123 bpm No difference
Avg Max HR 155 bpm 159 bpm 4 bpm Higher
Average cadence 91 rpm 91 rpm No difference
Max cad unreliable

BASIC POWER DATA 2019 Madone 2020 Emonda difference

Avg WTD Power (strava) 161 W 167 W 6 Watts higher
Avg Normalised Power 172 W 179 W 7 Watts higher
Average Watts 144 W 148 W 4 Watts higher
Avg Max Watts 703 W 804 W 101 Watts higher

400 METRE SPRINT difference
Avg Average Watts 372 W 417 W 45 Watts higher
Avg Max Watts 656 W 730 W 74 watts higher
Avg Average Speed 46.1 km/hr 48.1 km/hr 2.0 km/hr higher
Average Max Speed 51.4 km/hr 52.2 km/hr 0.8 km/hr higher
Avg Average HR 152 bpm 152 bpm No difference
Average Max HR 158 bpm 159 bpm 1 bpm higher
Avg Average cadence 94 rpm 97 rpm 3 rpm higher
Average Max Cadence 105 rpm 106 rpm 1 rpm higher

Comparing the ride quality:
The Madone was very compliant and comfortable due to the Iso-Speed decoupler but this was negated by the rigidity of the oversized frame tubing.
Due to this rigidity the Madone had a tendency at speed to skip a bit sideways when cornering on uneven surfaces or when descending on uneven surfaces at speeds in excess of 70 km/hr. The madone should have been in it’s element at these speeds but I always felt a tad nervous on the handling.
I have achieved up to a 2 km/hr higher speed on the same hills 3 or 4 times on the Emonda so far, as it has impeccable manners and gives you a feeling of total control at all times.
There is almost a doubling of the effect of strong crosswinds/gusts between the 2 bikes with the same 60mm deep wheels being ridden. The side on slab tubing does cop the wind.
Coasting down hills there only appeared to be a marginal difference in speed pickup with the Madone due to it’s “aero-ness” and heavier weight.

The one thing that the AERO Madone has over all bikes is its looks .. absolutely stunning.