Red eTap 11spd with mechanical disc or Mechanical Ultegra with Hydro Disc (8020)

CyclingLou

Hi all,
I’m building up a new titanium disc brake bike. Because of current budget constraints was only looking at Ultegra 8020 (mechanical shifting/hydro disc). My LBS happens to have a Red eTap 11spd groupset setup with mechanical discs in good condition that another customer left after upgrading to the new AXS groupset. Price of the used Red eTap is the same as the new Ultegra mechanical/hydro disc groupset.

Which one would you guys go for? Mechanical shifting with hydro disc (Brand new, 2nd tier)? or Electronic shifting with mechanical brakes (Used, top tier).

I have Ultegra Di2 with hydro brakes on my primary bike..so I know the merits of both...makes this decision that much tougher.....but budget is limiting me on this build.

andyp

That is a tough choice, as both hydraulics and electronic shifting make a huge difference in my experience.

Personally I always make component decisions based on the "only race what you can afford to replace" principle. I did consider eTap for a new cross build, but the replacement cost of a rear derailleur meant I chose Shimano Ultegra Di2 in the end.

There is a cheaper alternative which can give you both Di2 and hydraulic discs - get a pair of TRP Hylex hydraulic discs, including the Di2 mod kit, then add a Di2 drivetrain with a junction box, internal battery and rear mech (add a front mech too if you need it).

imposter2.0

You haven’t said if you’re racing or just riding around?

CyclingLou

Ah!..didn’t think about replacement costs. That’s actually a good point to consider. The TRP is definitely an viable option.

As for racing or not..this build is for my titanium bike..most likely going to use it more for touring and general riding. Save the racing for my carbon bike.

Ideally would just splurge on the SRAM HRD Force 12 speed AXS or wait for whenever the Shimano 12 Di2speed system comes out.

Having a hard time convincing myself to spend too much on any 11 speed system now....thus pondering these 2 11 speed options.

Matthewfalle

why do you want 12 speed? what benefits do you think you will get?

#isitworthit?

overlord2

Mechanical disk brakes are a bit crap imo.

For touring & general riding id rather have hydraulic brakes over electronic shifting.

Matthewfalle

for touring and general riding i'd rather have mechanical so you can fix it when it goes wrong, batteries don't run out and its doesn't cost you £250 to change a rear mech when it gets dropped at the local station/kid crashes into it on a camp site.

"hello. do you have a sub router ectoplasm cable for di2?"
"errr. no. this is a small bike shop in the highlands."

then spend the balance of funds on holibobs

#investinexperiences

photonic69

CyclingLou wrote:

..most likely going to use it more for touring and general riding.

....Having a hard time convincing myself to spend too much on any 11 speed system now....thus pondering these 2 11 speed options.

Shimano 105 Hydraulic Groupset? Around £500-530 at the moment. Do you really need anything more?

CyclingLou

Matthewfalle wrote:

why do you want 12 speed? what benefits do you think you will get?

#isitworthit?

That’s a completely valid point. But then again, I really didn’t need a 11-speed Ultegra when my 10-speed Tiagra worked just fine. I just think it’s a bit of future proofing seeing 12-speed might be the future norm.

Matthewfalle

CyclingLou wrote:

Matthewfalle wrote:

why do you want 12 speed? what benefits do you think you will get?

#isitworthit?

That’s a completely valid point. But then again, I really didn’t need a 11-speed Ultegra when my 10-speed Tiagra worked just fine. I just think it’s a bit of future proofing seeing 12-speed might be the future norm.

it won't be so don't worry about it. theres already 13 speed out there.

mechanical 10 or 11 for your needs is perfect

#whycomplicatematters?

psterdeacon

Defo go with the better brakes.
I run Etap 11 with mechanical disc brakes- which are good but you do have to keep fettling them to keep them working nicely.

step83

Id go with the Ultegra, you can get better mechanical brakes, or even mechanical to hydro brakes (TRP HYRD as an example).
eTAP is lovely but off road your more likely to damage the rather expensive rear mech, these are still retailing for around the £500 mark, which against a new Ultegra mech is a no brainer.

ctp046

Overlord2 wrote:

Mechanical disk brakes are a bit crap imo.

For touring & general riding id rather have hydraulic brakes over electronic shifting.

This

pilot_pete

CTP046 wrote:

Overlord2 wrote:

Mechanical disk brakes are a bit crap imo.

For touring & general riding id rather have hydraulic brakes over electronic shifting.

This

I would tend to agree. My summer bikes are both Dura Ace di2 and hydraulic disc braked. They are sublime (the shifting and the brakes).

My winter bike is the new 105 hydraulic. The brake calipers had to be swapped out for Deore as it is a post mount frame. The brakes are fab in the winter. The shifting is really good, but having ridden di2 for 4 years it really is noticeable going back to mechanical shifting, and although new and working properly I do find fine tuning the trim position on the front mech leads to me dropping the chain onto the small ring more often than I’d want it to. I know this is me being ham fisted with gloves on, but I really like the auto-trim of di2.

Also, if the bike is to be ridden all year round this is where di2 would actually make more difference as there are no cable inners/ outers to clog, corrode or generally get covered in crap causing duff shifting. Admittedly this could be considered an expensive solution to a minor problem.

What I intend to do is eventually upgrade the older of my summer bikes to DA9170 from the current DA9070 with ST-R785 (shifters, battery and derailleurs). This would then give me older di2 components to put on my winter bike should I so choose. I’d keep the 105 crankset and Deore calipers.

Replacement cost for components is a consideration. I must admit I’ve found the DA rear derailleurs to be pretty robust - I got hit by a car which snapped the 9070 derailleur off and dragged it down the road by the chain. I assumed it would be knackered, but I plugged it back in and it works fine! It’s scuffed up and I needed a new hanger, but once set up again it has worked flawlessly for another couple of years. My point? You could be unlucky and need to replace a component that breaks and considering if you could afford the premium price of top end components is certainly sensible before purchasing, but don’t let it completely put you off - who buys a bike whilst thinking they’d better put the same amount away in savings just in case they need to completely replace the bike if the worst happens!?

The likes of Dura Ace components come with a 2 year manufacturers warranty, so you’re covered there for early failure. It’s only really crash damage you would be out of pocket for (with nobody else to blame of course - in my accident the car drivers insurance paid out for all the damage). How often have you replaced components in the past due to crash damage? What’s your ‘track record’ like in effect? I can’t think of a component I have replaced due to an ‘own fault’ crash in the last decade. I’ve scuffed levers and bar ends and rear derailleurs and quick release levers but not actually had to replace anything. I’m not racing though, hence the term ‘only race what you can afford to replace’ being sound advice as you are much more likely to suffer a crash when racing.

If your track record is good, then you can put a little away into a fund to replace components each month and over a couple of years have enough to replace an expensive component. Me and the wife have ‘pocket money’ - a few hundred quid a month paid into our sole accounts to spend on what we want - this funds my cycling; bikes, kit, upgrades, replacement parts and all maintenance/ tools. The wife tends to do girls weekends away in various European cities. That way we are both happy.

PP