A New Safety Bicycle Lighting System - Your Opinions Please
BobK
Posts: 8
Research has demonstrated (see http://tyrrell.people.clemson.edu/Tyrrell_CV.pdf ) both pedestrians and bicyclists are made more visible and less conspicuous at night to people driving motor vehicles if the pedestrian/bicyclist are lit up, especially if the light highlights the motion of the pedestrian/bicyclist. As a result of these research observations I believe that there is a missing link to bicyclist safety while bicycling at night. That is the need to light up the bicycle and bicyclist. Doing so will make them more conspicuous to people driving motor vehicles, especially at farther distances. In essence, lighting up both the bicycle and bicyclist increases their visible surface area versus the small surface area of the (legally required) front white and back red lights.
In response to this need for added safety while bicycling at night I have devised a new bicycle lighting system that emits 200 lumens of amber/yellow light (an internationally recognized color indicating “warning” or “caution”) onto the bicycle and bicyclist simultaneously. This strength of light allows a bicyclist to be visible from about 150 feet away before a motorist ever reaches the bicyclist (i.e., more time for the motorist to react to the presence of a bicyclist). And while most front and rear lights on a bicycle appear as light clutter at night to a motor vehicle driver, this new lighting system increases the surface area of the bicyclist for 360 degree visibility (and is an active system versus the passive system of reflective clothing).
This device, if manufactured, has a battery that lasts for about 4 hours, and would sell for about $100 US.
I have included a few Youtube videos here that illustrates this new bicycle lighting system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-TuDSAJJz8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjc_INao8cQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNaJW-IVub8
What do you think of this as a possible product to enhance safety for cycling at night?
In response to this need for added safety while bicycling at night I have devised a new bicycle lighting system that emits 200 lumens of amber/yellow light (an internationally recognized color indicating “warning” or “caution”) onto the bicycle and bicyclist simultaneously. This strength of light allows a bicyclist to be visible from about 150 feet away before a motorist ever reaches the bicyclist (i.e., more time for the motorist to react to the presence of a bicyclist). And while most front and rear lights on a bicycle appear as light clutter at night to a motor vehicle driver, this new lighting system increases the surface area of the bicyclist for 360 degree visibility (and is an active system versus the passive system of reflective clothing).
This device, if manufactured, has a battery that lasts for about 4 hours, and would sell for about $100 US.
I have included a few Youtube videos here that illustrates this new bicycle lighting system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-TuDSAJJz8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjc_INao8cQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNaJW-IVub8
What do you think of this as a possible product to enhance safety for cycling at night?
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Comments
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You're assuming the person in the vehicle has no lights on - or no lights directed towards the cyclist at least...
However, to aid you in your thoughts - I've found that if I put Christmas lights on my commute bike in the month of December - drivers seemingly give me more room - now, whether that's because they can now see me - or because it's "Christmas lights" cannot be determined as I've not asked them ... I assumed the latter because I always run 2 back lights and wear reflective clothing in the dark...0 -
NO I am not assuming the driver has no lights on. On countless occasions during daylight I have been almost hit while either walking or bicycling. And when I have the opportunity to confront the driver they usually always say "I honestly did not see you". So I am trying to maximize a bicyclist's visibility at night, and the standard front white and rear red lights are not enough. My new lighting system increases a bicyclist's visibility to drivers at night by ensuring they can be seen at a farther distance and that the lit up surface area you present as a bicyclist to a driver is much larger than the legally required lights.0
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It's been done, they're called flashing lights (best uttered in a Yorkshire accent for the full sarcastic effect).0
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"bicyclist"..0
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Flashing lights on during daylight catches attention due to the way the human eye works. Flashing plus steady in hours of darkness to both attract attention (flashing) and being able to judge distance to (steady). Reflective trim (such as the 3M strips on many jackets), (I.e. bounces the light back from car headlights) much better than simple ‘hi-viz’ yellow, which is next to useless in the dark.
Not sure what you think you have invented that will surpass those recommendations.
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Flashing lights at night are illegal in many jurisdictions, and for someone to say hi-viz yellow lights are useless in the dark must be color blind. Reflective jackets do not allow the driver to see the moving legs of a cyclist, which if they could, studies prove that the cyclist is 50 % more conspicuous to the driver. Hence, it would be more ideal to light up the entire cyclist.0
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Err, no mention of ‘hi-viz yellow lights’ by me (whatever they are). I mean gilets/ jackets of that colour. Flashing lights are not illegal where I am in the UK and this is a UK based forum so I wasn’t accounting for any other country. 3M reflective strips already exist on many items of cycle wear including legs and shoes, so reflect back the movement of the legs when car headlights hit them.
So, with my flashing light on for conspicuity, which shows up several hundreds of metres away at night to a driver and more importantly attracts their attention, a steady light so they can judge distance to me now I have their attention, and some reflective 3M items on the heels of my shoes and the back of my bib tights/ leg warmers/ shorts I’m sorted thanks. Still don’t see the advantage of what you have suggested over that.
I reckon my flashing light makes me significantly more than 50% more conspicuous to a driver.
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If you've been almost hit in daylight and the motorist has said "I didn't see you" then I'd be doing 2 things - 1) reporting them to the police for careless driving - they must have their eyes closed and 2) checking to make sure you're not wearing camouflage clothing whilst walking/cycling.BobK wrote:NO I am not assuming the driver has no lights on. On countless occasions during daylight I have been almost hit while either walking or bicycling. And when I have the opportunity to confront the driver they usually always say "I honestly did not see you". So I am trying to maximize a bicyclist's visibility at night, and the standard front white and rear red lights are not enough. My new lighting system increases a bicyclist's visibility to drivers at night by ensuring they can be seen at a farther distance and that the lit up surface area you present as a bicyclist to a driver is much larger than the legally required lights.
However, you'll find, in the UK at least, many of us have Daytime flashing rear lights on most of the time - especially when riding solo. At night, its a combo of flashing/steady lights - depends where you are and what the ambient light is.
The thing is - the drivers CAN see you, it's just they didn't NOTICE you - there's a difference - the first is to do with their eyesight - the second is the care they take in processing what they see - you can't really affect the first, you can the second.
As I said - I found that during the run up to Christmas, when I run Christmas lights on my bike - I get a bit more space - I believe this is down to being "different". People take notice of something different. Your idea of lighting up the bike and rider will be different in many circumstances - and therefore will be more noticeable... not sure I'd pay $100 for a bike light though
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Isn't it a bit dazzling having g a bright yellow light shining up at you?0
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Exactly! My lighting system addresses the issue of "noticing better" the bicyclist since it highlights their body and moving legs, which research shows to significantly increase the conspicuousness or noticeability of the bicyclist. A reflective tape on an ankle appears as a small spot to a driver situated far from the bicyclist, but if the entire leg of the bicyclist is lit up, that would be more noticeable.Slowbike wrote:The thing is - the drivers CAN see you, it's just they didn't NOTICE you - there's a difference - the first is to do with their eyesight - the second is the care they take in processing what they see - you can't really affect the first, you can the second.0 -
Are your lights brighter than a car headlights?
Car headlights light up a rider.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
PBlakeney wrote:Car headlights light up a rider.
But that is the status quo. To aid in preventing less bicyclists from getting injured or killed while cycling at night in the presence of motor vehicles I have created an active lighting system for bicyclists versus the passive system provided by vehicle headlights. Many drivers use their headlights to see other large objects and street signs, but not bicyclists nor pedestrians necessarily. If the bicyclist actively lights themselves up, then there is a higher chance that they will be more noticeable to drivers of motor vehicles.0 -
Only if your lights are brighter than headlights, which they aren't.BobK wrote:PBlakeney wrote:Car headlights light up a rider.
But that is the status quo. To aid in preventing less bicyclists from getting injured or killed while cycling at night in the presence of motor vehicles I have created an active lighting system for bicyclists versus the passive system provided by vehicle headlights. Many drivers use their headlights to see other large objects and street signs, but not bicyclists nor pedestrians necessarily. If the bicyclist actively lights themselves up, then there is a higher chance that they will be more noticeable to drivers of motor vehicles.
I'm out, as they say.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
His title says he wants to get our opinions, but then he just wants to dismiss them and argue that his system is better. He has not convinced me in any way yet.
I have an active lighting system already - a flashing rear red light which attracts attention, much as your illumination of movement (legs) and a steady rear red which allows vehicle drivers to judge distance to me.
On the front I have the same; a flasher which draws attention, especially for drivers emerging from side roads who do a cursory glance looking for cars rather than properly observe for ALL types of vehicle. I then have a steady headlight to illuminate the road where there are no street lights.
On my winter bike I have retro-reflective tape on the fork legs, seat stays and down the middle of my full length guards. My cycle shoes have 3M reflective material on the heels, my bib tights, leg warmers, shorts and jackets have 3M reflective tabs on them.
I don’t think fitting ambient lighting to illuminate me on the bike is going to add anything, it actually may detract as my current lighting stands out highly in the darkness.
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Not at twilight they don't which is probably the most dangerous time to ride a bike, especially under street lightsPBlakeney wrote:Are your lights brighter than a car headlights?
Car headlights light up a rider.0 -
"Pedant"Imposter wrote:"bicyclist"..0 -
How are you making automobilist look at the bicyclist or footerist?0
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Pilot Pete wrote:I don’t think fitting ambient lighting to illuminate me on the bike is going to add anything, it actually may detract as my current lighting stands out highly in the darkness.
PP
I think it will add something. So in conclusion, you are the kind of person who would not be interested in my idea. You can't satisfy all the people all the time! Personally, I would rather have a couple extra lights than countless strips of reflective tape, but that is just me.0 -
Not the intended purpose of these lights.OnTheRopes wrote:
Not at twilight they don't which is probably the most dangerous time to ride a bike, especially under street lightsPBlakeney wrote:Are your lights brighter than a car headlights?
Car headlights light up a rider.BobK wrote:[To aid in preventing less bicyclists from getting injured or killed while cycling at night in the presence of motor vehicles...
Also, twilight is most dangerous due to a low sun. Any lights will work. Especially bright flashing ones.The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
I am not sure. You have no chance.Veronese68 wrote:PB is the most sensible person on here.0 -
Not sure why everyone is being so contrary. Same principle as pedal reflectors. Personally I use ankle reflectors in winter for this reason.
Where are the lights mounted? Yet another thing to charge? Those would be my issues.0 -
BobK wrote:Pilot Pete wrote:I don’t think fitting ambient lighting to illuminate me on the bike is going to add anything, it actually may detract as my current lighting stands out highly in the darkness.
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I think it will add something. So in conclusion, you are the kind of person who would not be interested in my idea. You can't satisfy all the people all the time! Personally, I would rather have a couple extra lights than countless strips of reflective tape, but that is just me.
Countless? :roll:
Here you go, here is my winter bike with just one rear light and one front headlight fitted (flashers on my summer bike when the picture was taken). If you look closely you can just about see one of the ‘countless’ strips of retro-reflective tape on the front of the fork leg. Yeah, really inconvenient, heavy, needs constantly re-charging and I tell you, the effort with a pair of scissors to cut the length took me ages... :roll: Now if only someone could invent an ambient lighting solution to do away with those issues...
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Included in your post title, it says Your opinions please.BobK wrote:Pilot Pete wrote:I don’t think fitting ambient lighting to illuminate me on the bike is going to add anything, it actually may detract as my current lighting stands out highly in the darkness.
PP
I think it will add something. So in conclusion, you are the kind of person who would not be interested in my idea. You can't satisfy all the people all the time! Personally, I would rather have a couple extra lights than countless strips of reflective tape, but that is just me.
Yet you appear unable to accept when people’s opinion doesn’t say your idea is the best thing since sliced bread.
When looking at the rear view of your system it seems hard to see the red rear light. Which is legal requirement here in the UK0 -
And just for balance, redo your videos linked in the first post. This time, put a descent flashing light on front and back as well, just so we can compare what that looks like. I bet you would be able to see the flashing lights at a much greater distance than with any of the options in your videos. Plus they will actually catch the attention, which steady lights don’t, even your illuminated backlight doesn’t really show the movement up that well.
indeed, and it seems to be flooding the rear with yellow/ white light which is also illegal. Look at the young lads with souped up Novas who put neon lights under the front, rear and down the side under the sills - all illegal. I would get some opinions of law enforcement to ensure the proposal is actually legal whatever the OP thinks about its veracity.When looking at the rear view of your system it seems hard to see the red rear light.
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The idea is... OK. But I'm not entirely convinced of how much a difference it'll actually make in the real world. And you may run into issues with the light colour - white for the front, red for the rear. Are there any regulations about having amber running lights? I have no idea...BobK wrote:Research has demonstrated (see http://tyrrell.people.clemson.edu/Tyrrell_CV.pdf ) both pedestrians and bicyclists are made more visible and less conspicuous at night to people driving motor vehicles if the pedestrian/bicyclist are lit up, especially if the light highlights the motion of the pedestrian/bicyclist. As a result of these research observations I believe that there is a missing link to bicyclist safety while bicycling at night. That is the need to light up the bicycle and bicyclist. Doing so will make them more conspicuous to people driving motor vehicles, especially at farther distances. In essence, lighting up both the bicycle and bicyclist increases their visible surface area versus the small surface area of the (legally required) front white and back red lights.
In response to this need for added safety while bicycling at night I have devised a new bicycle lighting system that emits 200 lumens of amber/yellow light (an internationally recognized color indicating “warning” or “caution”) onto the bicycle and bicyclist simultaneously. This strength of light allows a bicyclist to be visible from about 150 feet away before a motorist ever reaches the bicyclist (i.e., more time for the motorist to react to the presence of a bicyclist). And while most front and rear lights on a bicycle appear as light clutter at night to a motor vehicle driver, this new lighting system increases the surface area of the bicyclist for 360 degree visibility (and is an active system versus the passive system of reflective clothing).
This device, if manufactured, has a battery that lasts for about 4 hours, and would sell for about $100 US.
I have included a few Youtube videos here that illustrates this new bicycle lighting system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-TuDSAJJz8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjc_INao8cQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNaJW-IVub8
What do you think of this as a possible product to enhance safety for cycling at night?0 -
lettingthedaysgoby wrote:The idea is... OK. But I'm not entirely convinced of how much a difference it'll actually make in the real world. And you may run into issues with the light colour - white for the front, red for the rear. Are there any regulations about having amber running lights? I have no idea...
Yes - I do agree - the idea is ok ... not sure I'd spend $100 on it - not when I can get a bunch of fairy lights from the pound shop for a .... pound ...
The marketing of these lights does need sorting - out of focus videos not showing anything like real riding conditions doesn't help. Not all people need additional lighting and in some instances it can detract from the cyclist safety as the additional light pollution reduces the riders night vision.
As I said earlier - drivers can see you - they just don't always notice you. To make yourself stand out visually you need to be different to what is normally seen. It's been tested that if a rider has a pony tail, they get a bit more room ... why? Surely a pony tail isn't really noticeable? Well -yes, it is - and the usual assumption here in the UK is that it will be a woman - and for some reason that tends to trump the fact that it's a cyclist ... tbf - it's not often you see pony tails on cyclists, so it stands out as something different and makes the driver take notice...
Anyway - back to the lights - yes, it's a reasonable idea, needs refinement, not least on the cost and the OP would do well not to shoot down the contrary ideas when asking for opinion ...0 -
1.Expensive-$100=£78/€88
2.Possibly illegal in the UK/EU?
3.Not convinced it's any better than a flashing LED/reflector combo.0 -
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bike-light-laws-in-the-uk-what-you-need-to-know/
No mention of other lights - other than triangular rear reflectors shouldn't be used (unless on a trailer) and that white rear light or red front light mustn't be used - although you can get rear lights that flash red with green or white ...
The idea is not to confuse the other road users.
I think illuminating the rider/bike is fine - provided it is supplementary to the normal lights and not as bright. Long vehicles tend to have orange side lights down their length - so this could be seen as the bike equivalent.
It's no different to the provis 360 jackets/clothing that really stand out anyway...0 -
Why go amber when you can go pink?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7Z6Y0YNQGg0
