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Noisy drive under load

earthearth Posts: 934
edited April 2019 in Workshop
Recently swapped groupset and I'm now getting terrible noises from the chain/sprockets/mechs when putting in a bit of effort such as climbing or just moderate acceleration. I thought to start with it might be the cassette that was not tight enough but that's not it. Sounds like it might be coming from the front mech as if the chain is too close to the cage and rubbing but that implies that I am bending a chainring and as they are Dura Ace I can't see that being the case.

Any thoughts?

Posts

  • cougiecougie Posts: 22,512
    Need oil ?
  • step83step83 Posts: 4,028
    I had similar recently, only in the little ring, turned out it was the chain hitting the inside edge of the big ring, worth checking.
    Also is the mech to low/high?
  • earthearth Posts: 934
    step83 wrote:
    I had similar recently, only in the little ring, turned out it was the chain hitting the inside edge of the big ring, worth checking.
    Also is the mech to low/high?

    Low to high? Not sure what you mean. The front mech is in the big ring, and I get the noise anywhere on the cassette but it's easiest to get it to happen on the larger sprockets at the rear. I will look for chain rub on the mech cage and the chainrings. It's difficult to spot because I have not been able to get it to happen on a stand. I'm thinking I might put it on the turbo and video it.
  • cyclecliniccycleclinic Posts: 6,865
    There is not enough to go on. This is good shops exist to fox the problems you can't. To advise we have to guess given the info you have provided. There is a lot of tuturials online, park tool is a good resource for the home mechanic. Some one has to take a look at the bike. The bike that came in this morning was noisey. Limit stops screws were miss set on both mechs and the FD was misaligned. Let a good mechanic look at it. If you don't know one then start looking. We are not mythical.
    http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.
  • First.AspectFirst.Aspect Posts: 5,657
    Loose chain rings? Loose crank arms?

    I'd also check the bb installation.
  • AlejandrosdogAlejandrosdog Posts: 1,975
    I blame brexit
  • earthearth Posts: 934
    There is not enough to go on. This is good shops exist to fox the problems you can't. To advise we have to guess given the info you have provided. There is a lot of tuturials online, park tool is a good resource for the home mechanic. Some one has to take a look at the bike. The bike that came in this morning was noisey. Limit stops screws were miss set on both mechs and the FD was misaligned. Let a good mechanic look at it. If you don't know one then start looking. We are not mythical.

    I'm just afraid they will laugh at me for installing it myself, charge me for re-cabling and use the lower spec cables. But a trip to the shop is probably what I will do.

    FYI it's Dura Ace 9000 mechanical, shortcage rear mech, braize on front mech, 52/36 > 12-28. Difficulties are that I don't have a front mech cable tension adjuster.
  • photonic69photonic69 Posts: 1,091
    earth wrote:

    I'm just afraid they will laugh at me for installing it myself, charge me for re-cabling and use the lower spec cables. But a trip to the shop is probably what I will do.

    FYI it's Dura Ace 9000 mechanical, shortcage rear mech, braize on front mech, 52/36 > 12-28. Difficulties are that I don't have a front mech cable tension adjuster.

    So you installed a £1k+ groupset but didn't install a front mech tension barrel and don't want to pay a shop £50 for a set-up? Some people!!! :D
  • earthearth Posts: 934
    photonic69 wrote:
    earth wrote:

    I'm just afraid they will laugh at me for installing it myself, charge me for re-cabling and use the lower spec cables. But a trip to the shop is probably what I will do.

    FYI it's Dura Ace 9000 mechanical, shortcage rear mech, braize on front mech, 52/36 > 12-28. Difficulties are that I don't have a front mech cable tension adjuster.

    So you installed a £1k+ groupset but didn't install a front mech tension barrel and don't want to pay a shop £50 for a set-up? Some people!!! :D

    Yeah I spent 9 years in Yorkshire.
  • keef66keef66 Posts: 13,123
    I spent my first 21 years in Yorkshire but I still fitted inline adjusters when I built up my CR1 which had none on the downtube stops.

    A lot cheaper than having to pay a bike shop to set up my gears...
  • keef66keef66 Posts: 13,123
    earth wrote:
    step83 wrote:
    I had similar recently, only in the little ring, turned out it was the chain hitting the inside edge of the big ring, worth checking.
    Also is the mech to low/high?

    Low to high? Not sure what you mean.

    Think he meant is the front mech too low or too high?
  • AlejandrosdogAlejandrosdog Posts: 1,975
    You might be able to re use the existing cable, it sounds like you need to just have someone tweet stuff and put a barrel adjuster in line.

    A reasonably competent club mate might help you do it and you’ll probably pick up some tips. FWIW I had a noisy drive train with 9000 the answer for me was to use wet lube or wax. Dry was just noisy. Cracking sort of noises under pressure sounds like an adjustment or hanger issue since it’s unlikely to be wear in a new group set.

    The 9000 gear and brake cables are kin expensive.
  • keef66keef66 Posts: 13,123
    I thought the whizzy new Shimano FDs included some kind of cable tension adjuster??

    ETA apparently not for DA9000; the dealer manual tells you to use an inline adjuster...

    (I wouldn't know, I'm on groupsets a decade old or more)
  • earthearth Posts: 934
    I installed an inline barrel adjuster and in the process of doing so= I reinstalled the front mech, fettled with the high/low adjustment screws and the cable tension as I secured the cable in the pinch bolt. The problem is largely solved but it was not due to the barrel adjuster. It appears the inline cable tension adjuster makes no difference to the cable tension at all. There doesn't seem to be much to installing them, just cut a section of cable outer out and put the adjuster in its place then feed the cable inner through ut despit that I must have done something wrong. I understand they work by changing the length of the cable outer but this does not happen and there is no effect on the front mech.
  • AlejandrosdogAlejandrosdog Posts: 1,975
    Hmmm they definitely have an effect if installed properly and then adjusted.

    You’re using da 9000. The mech has 2 ways to route the cable to the clamp. You need to choose the correct one for your particular frame. There is a tool to help you select the correct way but if it ain’t working try it the other way and see if it makes a difference.

    Download the dealer manual for the info
  • earthearth Posts: 934
    I am aware of the two different ways to route the cable but as I bought all the components second hand I do not have that tool. Despite that I followed the dealer manual in every respect apart from that. I tried both cable routes and the derailleur works either way but no doubt one is better than the other. The barrel adjusters don't work well. They make no difference to the cable tension until turned so far to an extreme that the thread of the adjuster starts to become visible. I'm going to have to take it to a professional to see if they can set it up any better (I would hope so).
  • AlejandrosdogAlejandrosdog Posts: 1,975
    You did wind the adjuster all the way in and then back a smidge before tightening the cable didn’t you?
  • keef66keef66 Posts: 13,123
    Having had bad experiences with Jagwire ones I bought some chunkier Shimano inline adjusters. https://www.wiggle.co.uk/shimano-sm-ca7 ... adjusters/ These are easy to adjust and stay where you put them. The Jagwire ones were forever losing tension.

    As above, you do need to wind them fully in before installation, and remove all the slack from the cable / seat both ends of the outer before clamping it. That way you maximise the effect of the adjuster when you come to use it.
  • earthearth Posts: 934
    keef66 wrote:
    Having had bad experiences with Jagwire ones I bought some chunkier Shimano inline adjusters. https://www.wiggle.co.uk/shimano-sm-ca7 ... adjusters/ These are easy to adjust and stay where you put them. The Jagwire ones were forever losing tension.

    As above, you do need to wind them fully in before installation, and remove all the slack from the cable / seat both ends of the outer before clamping it. That way you maximise the effect of the adjuster when you come to use it.

    The cable adjusters were those very Shimano ones. I wound them in before installing but no joy. Anyway the guy a the bike shop came to the same conclusion that cable tension was the issue and he couldn't get any improvement using them so he replaced it with a SRAM one. The front mech is adjusted about as well as can be now and I get no chain rub unless I'm cross chaining big to big. But I still get noise under load. It seems to come from the front mech so I suspect it is still chain rub. Maybe it's flex in the chainset or maybe in the frame. On the one hand I can't believe Dura Ace 9000 would flex, although it does have a 4 arm spider rather than 5 arm of the 6700. On the other hand despite the frame being over 10 years old I never got this with 6700.
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