eTap - what to do?

ex-pat scot

I have a bit of a quandary.

i have a general strategy to use the C2W voucher each year on a rolling programme of upgrades / replacements on my fleet.

My next voucher lands at the end of this month (yay!).

Previously my strategy was quite simple. eTap to replace the existing Sram Red (10spd) on each of my bikes, one at a time. £1,000 buys the eTap Red (11spd) upgrade kit, give or take a few pounds. Perfect!

12 months ago I put eTap on the Look summer bike. Great stuff.
Next one up is the Boardman CX. Currently on Red with TRP Spyre cable discs and Hunt 50 carbon wheels. It's my "all year round" commuter, and would benefit from hydr braking.

But now I am a bit worried: do I go eTap hydr 11 (£1,295 price matched)? There's been no indication from Sram of where the AXS Red and Force fit in to the existing product line up, and if existing mechanical groupsets are going to be still on sale / upgraded / discontinued, never mind what is to happen to eTap 11. I think it would be sensible to maintain it as a conventional option, because AXS requires you to go 100% all-in on wheels, brakes, chainset, gears. (hence I see AXS as geared towards OEM builds rather than as an upgrade pack, which is where eTap11 was strong).

It's this last point that worries me a little. If eTap 11 is discontinued then I don't know if it would be sensible to invest £1,300 now on it.


Force eTap looks nice, but there are a lot of unanswered questions. Firstly as to where the real price will settle down- will the £1800-£2200 RRP be watered down to nearer £1000 in practice, which is what sort of happens to most groupsets?
Will they release "upgrade" kits so that we can reuse existing chainsets (if you are 1x, then you should at most need a 12s chainring)?
i could always hold on to the voucher a few months and see.

Alternatively I could use the voucher on something else entirely - a new commuting wardrobe; replacement SS wheelset; there's always more needed for the fleet.

Thoughts? Insights?

yes I know it's a "first world problem".
No I am not taking the mick with C2W - my riding really is 95% commuting (lots of it). I don't see why it shouldn't be ridden on decent bikes where possible.

Alejandrosdog

total first world problem

It sounds like your kit is pretty much top end already. i dont think youd see much difference by "upgrading" further. However, you could get a new ebike.......

cougie

So for a grand plus - you'll get a bike that changes gears. Like the one you have now ?

I'm not sure that's worth it to me - you could take the bike to Mallorca for a fortnight with that.

keef66

cougie wrote:

So for a grand plus - you'll get a bike that changes gears. Like the one you have now ?

I'm not sure that's worth it to me - you could take the bike to Mallorca for a fortnight with that.

Not on the C2W scheme he can't. Unless HMRC have suddenly come over all benevolent.

Short-sighted of them I think. Anything that encourages people to exercise has got to be for the greater public good, and money well spent. And certainly better VFM than fcucking HS2 or the billions we've wasted on the Brexit farce to date...

ex-pat scot

Sadly (!) I have to spend it on "accessories" or "bike" (or both). No gallivanting off to Majorica.

Things I would really like to do (in no particular order of priority):

- create the Ultimate Brompton. Mine is fine already (S2LX) but could be further enhanced with carbon wheels, carbon bars, superlight brakes, titanium stem, carbon chainring, ti bolts. I don't think any of that can be sourced from a C2W-friendly dealer.

- Upgrade the P2 TT bike. Clincher disc wheel, aero cockpit, eTap (currently Red 10, 80mm Fulcrums, Zipp/Vision cockpit).

- upgrade the eTap Look. Current wheels are Cosmic SLE. Perhaps something like the Zipp 404NSW or Enve would be an upgrade, but tricky with C2W. I could go from eTap 11 to eTap 12 AXS, but really don't think that would be sensible!

- upgrade the Boardman CX. Hydr braking. Red 10 to eTap (Force 12 AXS or eTap 11)

- upgrade/ replace the SS commuter. It's a pig heavy canti Tricross SS/FG. It could really do with decent wheels (I can't find any decent ones online. I suppose I could try and get Phil Wood hub and self build). It would be great with discs - perhaps a replacement carbon disc fork, front brake etc.

My (many) other bikes tend to get trickle down kit. They really don't need to be getting ideas above their station about being splashed with new kit.

Sorry for rambling. It's that whole "deferred gratification" thing, where I can pick up something every 12 months but have to wait for the rest.

MiddleRinger

All the chatter I hear is that Red eTap 11-speed will not be continued or even supported much. The TT guys haven't been able to get new Blip Boxes for ages now and the new 12-speed stuff is not backwards compatible. I'm not sure in this stage of the game it'd be wise to buy into it. I doubt you'll be able to get spares easily down the track.

That said, you could probably just buy it and ride it into the ground over several years with no issues.

ex-pat scot

MiddleRinger wrote:

All the chatter I hear is that Red eTap 11-speed will not be continued or even supported much. The TT guys haven't been able to get new Blip Boxes for ages now and the new 12-speed stuff is not backwards compatible. I'm not sure in this stage of the game it'd be wise to buy into it. I doubt you'll be able to get spares easily down the track.

That said, you could probably just buy it and ride it into the ground over several years with no issues.

That's my general concern - that it gets quietly dropped.
The Di2 10 speed stuff didn't get much support and spares are really tricky to find now, apparently.

I was kind of hoping that we'd get a bit of a clearer strategy on things like
- development / support cycle of 11spd (eTap and mechanical)
- "upgrade kits" (mechs and shifters) rather than full groupsets. I have all the chainsets I need.

I suppose I could investigate Shimano DA - whilst I like the simplicity of eTap and the general Sram ethos, I think there's a huge market they had (and could lose) for the "upgrade pack" approach.

If I go DA Di2, then I'd need:
shifters
mechs
charger
battery
cable.

I'm sure the wiring is very fiddly, but I guess you only need to do it once.

philbar72

wouldn't bother to be honest. its already supplanted as others say.

cougie

Good point on the tax efficiency but it does seem like you're kicking around to spend it ? So Mallorca it is ! :-)

ugo.santalucia

Tarting up the Brompton gives you the highest ROI... firstly because they retain their value and secondly because if you make it a kg lighter, you can actually benefit from it when you lift it.

Midlands Grimpeur

MiddleRinger wrote:
All the chatter I hear is that Red eTap 11-speed will not be continued or even supported much. The TT guys haven't been able to get new Blip Boxes for ages now and the new 12-speed stuff is not backwards compatible. I'm not sure in this stage of the game it'd be wise to buy into it. I doubt you'll be able to get spares easily down the track.

That said, you could probably just buy it and ride it into the ground over several years with no issues.


That's my general concern - that it gets quietly dropped.
The Di2 10 speed stuff didn't get much support and spares are really tricky to find now, apparently.

I was kind of hoping that we'd get a bit of a clearer strategy on things like
- development / support cycle of 11spd (eTap and mechanical)
- "upgrade kits" (mechs and shifters) rather than full groupsets. I have all the chainsets I need.

My LBS are already saying they can't get hold of 11 speed etap anymore, and I was reading an interview (can't remember where) with one of the senior execs at Sram the other day where he strongly hinted that they would go down the 12 speed axs route from now on. I can't see them continuing to produce both electronic groupsets and the fact that Force is axs only would suggest that 11 speed will disappear in the short term. My thoughts are that in terms of consumables, chains, cassettes etc. these will still continue to be produced and supported as there are still mechanical options available and the sheer volume of 11 speed users would make it impossible for Sram to ditch support. The main issue will be for etap 11 speed owners who suffer a breakage of any electronic parts i.e. shifters and/or derailleurs. If that happens we may well be stuck!

handful

Typical! Just forked out for eTap on a bike that I'm picking up tomorrow! Obsolete before I ride it!

cycleclinic

you need and XDR freehub for AXS 12 speed not new wheels. Watch everyone bring out XDR freehub over the next 12 months. people with BORG wheels with Carbon Ti hubs can already fit a XDR freehub as they released there last year. DT Swiss have come out with there. Miche have one in development....Shimano won't bother of course but campagnolo might.

ex-pat scot

thecycleclinic wrote:

you need and XDR freehub for AXS 12 speed not new wheels. Watch everyone bring out XDR freehub over the next 12 months. people with BORG wheels with Carbon Ti hubs can already fit a XDR freehub as they released there last year. DT Swiss have come out with there. Miche have one in development....Shimano won't bother of course but campagnolo might.

Indeed. I'm pretty sure you can get an XDR freehub for Hunt; I guess a little more unlikely for my TT bike and its Fulcrum 80 / Sram S60 rear wheels I use on it. I suppose there's nothing to stop me rebuilding with a new rear hub though.

The sensible thing would be to wait and see for a few months, and not to think of the voucher burning a hole in my pocket!

Thanks all for your thoughts, particularly on the eTap 11 gossip.