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For the closed road fans

ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
Not a sportive, but on June the 16th, a 105 km ring in the Unesco World Heritage Dolomites will be completely closed to traffic and you can cycle at leisure from 9AM to 3 PM.
That includes some iconic passes, like Flazarego, Pordoi and Fedaia.

Not a penny for the privilege, as opposed to 80 quid to cycle through Coventry... :roll:

http://www.dolomitesbikeday.it/en/

Posts

  • capt_slogcapt_slog Posts: 3,446
    Nice.

    I understand your point, but getting me and the bike to Italy is going to be quite a bit more than £80 :)


    The older I get, the better I was.

  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 13,879
    Capt Slog wrote:
    Nice.

    I understand your point, but getting me and the bike to Italy is going to be quite a bit more than £80 :)

    You can get BA flights to Venice for £100 with enough time to ride it and then something else on Monday before flying back.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
    edited March 2019
    Capt Slog wrote:
    Nice.

    I understand your point, but getting me and the bike to Italy is going to be quite a bit more than £80 :)

    That wasn't my point...

    My point is that it is possible to close the roads (although logistically simpler in the mountains) without having to make it into a huge money spinner.
    If one takes a broader and more long term view, he will realise that sustainable tourism will be generated, revenue and whatnot.
    Unfortunately here everything needs to be chicken today/grab the money and run
  • meursaultmeursault Posts: 1,433
    Very interested in this for me and the mrs, depending on sensible travel/accommodation costs.

    Thanks for posting.
    Superstition sets the whole world in flames; philosophy quenches them.

    Voltaire
  • veronese68veronese68 Posts: 23,460 Lives Here
    I'd love to do that, it would even be fairly cheap for me as my cousin has access to a place in San Martino di Castrozza. But unfortunately June is insanely busy for me so I won't be able to go. To make it worse I've been roped into organising some people from work to do the London to Brighton ride which I have no desire to do. So rather than riding in some beautiful mountains I will be riding to Brighton at a snail's pace surrounded by too many people with no clue.
  • capt_slogcapt_slog Posts: 3,446
    Capt Slog wrote:
    Nice.

    I understand your point, but getting me and the bike to Italy is going to be quite a bit more than £80 :)

    That wasn't my point...

    My point is that it is possible to close the roads (although logistically simpler in the mountains) without having to make it into a huge money spinner.
    If one takes a broader and more long term view, he will realise that sustainable tourism will be generated, revenue and whatnot.
    Unfortunately here everything needs to be chicken today/grab the money and run

    Fair enough, I stand corrected, and it's a better point than the one I thought you were making.

    But also, you're right about the logistics. I bet the UK closed road events are hell to organise and I can see why they have to charge. We aren't that popular as a pastime, I can imagine the outcry if it was put about that the events were free to enter on some principle that it was good for the area.


    The older I get, the better I was.

  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
    Capt Slog wrote:

    But also, you're right about the logistics. I bet the UK closed road events are hell to organise and I can see why they have to charge. We aren't that popular as a pastime, I can imagine the outcry if it was put about that the events were free to enter on some principle that it was good for the area.

    That's because they choose stupid areas to run them. Also, if they weren't timed mass events, there would be only half of the logistics and finally, if it was simply a closed roads day over a given loop (as this one is), possibly the residents will get involved, bring their kids and whatnot, instead of plotting to derail the all thing.

    It's the money for lycra aspect of the event that causes such havoc, not the road closures
  • daniel_bdaniel_b Posts: 8,784
    Wow that looks amazing! Shame it's so far from where my bro lives in Italy. Suspect I will struggle for this year, but might try and make a concerted effort to make it over for next year.
    Felt F70 05 (Turbo)
    Marin Palisades Trail 91 and 06
    Scott CR1 SL 12
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  • kingstongrahamkingstongraham Posts: 13,879
    I see they recommend counter clockwise - avoiding the difficult side of Fedaia. Good choice.
  • bompingtonbompington Posts: 7,639
    Capt Slog wrote:
    if they weren't timed mass events, there would be only half of the logistics
    I mostly agree with you, but not sure on this point - surely the costs of closing roads are a major proportion?

    Anyway, disappointed to say no, especially to the "most suggestive roads", but I'm not sure I could ride this and be back in class on time the next morning :-(
  • davep1davep1 Posts: 777
    There's also Stelvio Day, which I think is Saturday 31st August this year. Roads closed to vehicles from Prato (well Trafoi, about 12 km in) and Bormio (possibly a few km up from Bormio too). Free to enter, little organisation in terms of entering, timing cards/chips etc etc. 11,000 turn up on a good year.

    https://www.south-tirol.com/event/167/stelvio-bike-day

    I'm hoping to do it this year; tried in 2017 but the snow and freezing conditions meant they closed the road at Trafoi. I had been on the beach in Abruzzo for a fortnight in sweltering mid 30's temps, one disbelieving eye on the forecast as it steadily plummeted in the week before! I journey to and from Abruzzo every summer so am trying to work the travelling to get some of the big climbs in every year.

    So how come the Italians and Swiss can do this every year, and yet the miserable Brits get all up in arms about the idea of it? I think Ugo has some good points, but I think it is just our miserable nature these days. I think the Stop Velosouth campaign was a very small amount of very noisy people, but it got me thinking about not doing the event, before the weather took the decision out of everyone's hands. They were ranting on about being prisoners in their own homes all day...
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
    davep1 wrote:

    So how come the Italians and Swiss can do this every year, and yet the miserable Brits get all up in arms about the idea of it? I think Ugo has some good points, but I think it is just our miserable nature these days. I think the Stop Velosouth campaign was a very small amount of very noisy people, but it got me thinking about not doing the event, before the weather took the decision out of everyone's hands. They were ranting on about being prisoners in their own homes all day...

    Look, close this 21 mile loop in the lakes and you're hardly going to bother anybody... there are probably fewer than 100 residential dwellings along the way make it into a free to ride for all one way or the other way... there is a bit of false flat for kids and 2 big climbs for those who like sportives... it's really not that hard... find a weekend just before or just after Easter or in September when business is flat call it Keswick Cyclo, promoted by the local council, plenty of people will spend fortunes buying food, drinks and whatnot.

    https://www.strava.com/routes/17472057
  • joe2008joe2008 Posts: 1,531

    Look, close this 21 mile loop in the lakes and you're hardly going to bother anybody... there are probably fewer than 100 residential dwellings along the way make it into a free to ride for all one way or the other way... there is a bit of false flat for kids and 2 big climbs for those who like sportives... it's really not that hard... find a weekend just before or just after Easter or in September when business is flat call it Keswick Cyclo, promoted by the local council, plenty of people will spend fortunes buying food, drinks and whatnot.

    https://www.strava.com/routes/17472057

    That's a towny attitude. I live in a place with far fewer than 100 residential dwellings and I would suggest that there would be plenty of opposition to any attempt to close a loop around here for a bloody bike ride.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
    joe2008 wrote:

    Look, close this 21 mile loop in the lakes and you're hardly going to bother anybody... there are probably fewer than 100 residential dwellings along the way make it into a free to ride for all one way or the other way... there is a bit of false flat for kids and 2 big climbs for those who like sportives... it's really not that hard... find a weekend just before or just after Easter or in September when business is flat call it Keswick Cyclo, promoted by the local council, plenty of people will spend fortunes buying food, drinks and whatnot.

    https://www.strava.com/routes/17472057

    That's a towny attitude. I live in a place with far fewer than 100 residential dwellings and I would suggest that there would be plenty of opposition to any attempt to close a loop around here for a bloody bike ride.

    Not necessarily, because the benefit for the community would far outweigh the small disturbance to their routine. I wasn't talking about a "bike ride" where 10K men clad in lycra whizz past, but a day when bikes and pedestrians only are allowed on those roads... it's an opportunity for residents too... the local farm can open their doors and showcase (sell?) their produce, families can let their children loose on the roads and teach them to cycle without stabilisers, the cafe' will do a roaring trade and so will the pub... gardeneres will continue to do their gardening and life goes on.

    It's how you sell an idea and the "closed road sportive" unfortunately only appeal to one type of bod
  • joe2008joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    joe2008 wrote:

    Look, close this 21 mile loop in the lakes and you're hardly going to bother anybody... there are probably fewer than 100 residential dwellings along the way make it into a free to ride for all one way or the other way... there is a bit of false flat for kids and 2 big climbs for those who like sportives... it's really not that hard... find a weekend just before or just after Easter or in September when business is flat call it Keswick Cyclo, promoted by the local council, plenty of people will spend fortunes buying food, drinks and whatnot.

    https://www.strava.com/routes/17472057

    That's a towny attitude. I live in a place with far fewer than 100 residential dwellings and I would suggest that there would be plenty of opposition to any attempt to close a loop around here for a bloody bike ride.

    Not necessarily, because the benefit for the community would far outweigh the small disturbance to their routine. I wasn't talking about a "bike ride" where 10K men clad in lycra whizz past, but a day when bikes and pedestrians only are allowed on those roads... it's an opportunity for residents too... the local farm can open their doors and showcase (sell?) their produce, families can let their children loose on the roads and teach them to cycle without stabilisers, the cafe' will do a roaring trade and so will the pub... gardeneres will continue to do their gardening and life goes on.

    It's how you sell an idea and the "closed road sportive" unfortunately only appeal to one type of bod

    Don't get me wrong I like your sentiment, however, I find it all rather 'Darling Buds Of May'.

    Back in reality Farmer Joe just wants to get his fecking tractor down the road, and Mrs B just has to get her fags from the local shop, which happens to be a good drive away.
  • meursaultmeursault Posts: 1,433
    joe2008 wrote:
    joe2008 wrote:

    Look, close this 21 mile loop in the lakes and you're hardly going to bother anybody... there are probably fewer than 100 residential dwellings along the way make it into a free to ride for all one way or the other way... there is a bit of false flat for kids and 2 big climbs for those who like sportives... it's really not that hard... find a weekend just before or just after Easter or in September when business is flat call it Keswick Cyclo, promoted by the local council, plenty of people will spend fortunes buying food, drinks and whatnot.

    https://www.strava.com/routes/17472057

    That's a towny attitude. I live in a place with far fewer than 100 residential dwellings and I would suggest that there would be plenty of opposition to any attempt to close a loop around here for a bloody bike ride.

    Not necessarily, because the benefit for the community would far outweigh the small disturbance to their routine. I wasn't talking about a "bike ride" where 10K men clad in lycra whizz past, but a day when bikes and pedestrians only are allowed on those roads... it's an opportunity for residents too... the local farm can open their doors and showcase (sell?) their produce, families can let their children loose on the roads and teach them to cycle without stabilisers, the cafe' will do a roaring trade and so will the pub... gardeneres will continue to do their gardening and life goes on.

    It's how you sell an idea and the "closed road sportive" unfortunately only appeal to one type of bod

    Don't get me wrong I like your sentiment, however, I find it all rather 'Darling Buds Of May'.

    Back in reality Farmer Joe just wants to get his ******* tractor down the road, and Mrs B just has to get her fags from the local shop, which happens to be a good drive away.

    Agree with Ugo.

    It's one day, or not even that, part of a day. Buy your fags the day before, farmer Giles can problem solve.
    Superstition sets the whole world in flames; philosophy quenches them.

    Voltaire
  • joe2008joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    meursault wrote:
    Agree with Ugo.

    It's one day, or not even that, part of a day. Buy your fags the day before, farmer Giles can problem solve.

    You don't know too many farmers do you? They stop work for no man, and they work every day of the year, or animals don't get feed etc.

    IIRC they didn't even close the roads for Tour of Britain, just a rolling road block, with cars being allowed through at very close times to the riders. Sucks I know.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
    10 AM to 4 PM... farmers will feed their cattle before that and put them back in the shed after that, so not a real issue. Mrs censored will stock up on the Saturday, most rural shops will be closed on a Sunday anyway.

    It's not an issue unless you are desperate to prove it is.
    The council writes a nice letter to the residents highlighting the benefits for the area. Most people round there are involved in hospitality to some extent and understand...

    It's when you try to fit an event in the extended London commuter belt that things get complicated
  • joe2008joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    10 AM to 4 PM... farmers will feed their cattle before that and put them back in the shed after that, so not a real issue. Mrs censored will stock up on the Saturday, most rural shops will be closed on a Sunday anyway.

    It's not an issue unless you are desperate to prove it is.
    The council writes a nice letter to the residents highlighting the benefits for the area. Most people round there are involved in hospitality to some extent and understand...

    It's when you try to fit an event in the extended London commuter belt that things get complicated

    But farmers don't just feed animals and put their feet up for six hours.

    Rural shops are most definitely open 7 days a week in the season - it's a long winter out here.

    I'm not desperate to prove anything, just pointing out that closing rural roads will always upset people, because that's just how people are these days.

    It would be interesting to try it, but not too many people would see the relationship between cycling and increased business, there just isn't the interest in cycling.

    Unrelated to what you're saying but still cycling related - the local sportive was cancelled last year through lack of entries, I think they got but a handful. The year before it ran with about 40 riders thanks to a local cycling shop selling most of the entries, that business went bust and any interest in the sportive (which had no affiliation with the shop) fell away.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 25,706
    joe2008 wrote:

    It would be interesting to try it, but not too many people would see the relationship between cycling and increased business, there just isn't the interest in cycling.

    Unrelated to what you're saying but still cycling related - the local sportive was cancelled last year through lack of entries, I think they got but a handful. The year before it ran with about 40 riders thanks to a local cycling shop selling most of the entries, that business went bust and any interest in the sportive (which had no affiliation with the shop) fell away.

    The relationship is pretty simple to work out... you look at the hospitality sector and their occupancy as compared to the previous year and you have a pretty good picture.

    I am not sure which sportive you are referring to, but firstly I am not advocating for a sportive and secondly the reasons why an event is successful or not are often too complicated to just sum up as "it doesn't work in that area"


    To give you an idea... I organise 2 Audax events this year

    BRUM 200 full fat £ 10 to enter, sold out in a week (about 90 entries)

    BRUM 200 self supported, £ 2 to enter has 8 entries after a week

    The route is the same, the format is different, one works better than the other, maybe the organisers of the sportive you mention got it all wrong
  • meursaultmeursault Posts: 1,433
    joe2008 wrote:
    10 AM to 4 PM... farmers will feed their cattle before that and put them back in the shed after that, so not a real issue. Mrs censored will stock up on the Saturday, most rural shops will be closed on a Sunday anyway.

    It's not an issue unless you are desperate to prove it is.
    The council writes a nice letter to the residents highlighting the benefits for the area. Most people round there are involved in hospitality to some extent and understand...

    It's when you try to fit an event in the extended London commuter belt that things get complicated

    But farmers don't just feed animals and put their feet up for six hours.

    Rural shops are most definitely open 7 days a week in the season - it's a long winter out here.

    I'm not desperate to prove anything, just pointing out that closing rural roads will always upset people, because that's just how people are these days.

    It would be interesting to try it, but not too many people would see the relationship between cycling and increased business, there just isn't the interest in cycling.

    Unrelated to what you're saying but still cycling related - the local sportive was cancelled last year through lack of entries, I think they got but a handful. The year before it ran with about 40 riders thanks to a local cycling shop selling most of the entries, that business went bust and any interest in the sportive (which had no affiliation with the shop) fell away.

    I understand where you are coming from, but as Ugo says, NOT a sportive. Those only attract one type of rider. Make it a festival, a party, all types of cyclists, kids and the like. That's what the Dolomite one looks like.
    Superstition sets the whole world in flames; philosophy quenches them.

    Voltaire
  • joe2008joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    meursault wrote:
    joe2008 wrote:

    Unrelated to what you're saying but still cycling related - the local sportive was cancelled last year through lack of entries, I think they got but a handful. The year before it ran with about 40 riders thanks to a local cycling shop selling most of the entries, that business went bust and any interest in the sportive (which had no affiliation with the shop) fell away.

    I understand where you are coming from, but as Ugo says, NOT a sportive. Those only attract one type of rider. Make it a festival, a party, all types of cyclists, kids and the like. That's what the Dolomite one looks like.

    Yeah, I know that it's not a sportive - that's why I said 'unrelated' before I mentioned 'sportive'.

    The festival type of thing might well work in the Lakes.
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