brand new clincher rims w/o a clincher?

zendoflex

First I was super impressed by the wheels I received today but then I realized that there is no clincher. Am I missing something or are the rims useless? Should I try to get a refund? :shock:

I cannot really believe that someone forgot the clincher on an 800 USD wheelset... Can anyone give advice on this?

ugo.santalucia

Nothing at all?
Stan's rims have very tiny hooked edges

zendoflex

nothing at all. I am shaking, I just lost so much money

whyamihere

They're hookless rims, they're becoming fairly common on MTB and gravel rims where you'll be running tubeless at low pressures. What rims are they, and what's the intended use?

zendoflex

these are used for a road bike. I need to put 28c tires on it, at least with 6 bar.

zendoflex

so I can ride them with normal tires such as the Schwalbe One and also with tubeless tires such as the Schwalbe Pro One? I am so confused. It looks so dangerous to me...

Ben6899

I'd only use hookless rims at low pressure. Not sure what I mean by low, to be honest, but certainly not 6/7 bar 90/100psi.

whyamihere

zendoflex wrote:

these are used for a road bike. I need to put 28c tires on it, at least with 6 bar.

You can't do that, going to that pressure will likely blow the tyre off the rim. Unfortunately, these rims aren't going to work for you. It depends on the rim/tyre, but the max pressure for hookless rims tends to be significantly lower. What rims are they?

zendoflex

these wheels where sold as road rims. it's a 25mm wide rim, what else should it be used for? does not make any sense for gravel or cyclocross. Are you sure about blowing off the tire? Maybe the diameter of the rim is significantly higher? i will measure it now. I am afraid that I won't get any money back because it seems that this is not completely uncommon and for sure no manufacturing issue.

The wheels where assembled by a small company but the rims are produced by ODIN Bikes, a huge and well known manufacturer in Xiamen.

whyamihere

Maybe they won't blow off. Maybe you'll get lucky. I wouldn't want to risk it.

Enve produce a set of hookless road/gravel rims, the 4.5AR. They're 25mm internal, and with a 28mm tyre, the absolute maximum they recommend is 4.59 bar, for a 114kg rider (pressure chart about halfway down). Your rims are significantly narrower, which wouldn't help.

zendoflex

any scenario that you can recommend to use them safe?

first i guess tubeless is a must now, because those low pressures won't allow anything else ... but whats safer? going smaller to 25c or going up to 30/32c?

I still am wondering why a manufacturer would even build the molds for such rims if they weren't safe. There must be a company they copied from, i mean it's China...

Moonbiker

Why don't you link to the info on wheel/rim you bought so people can see the spec?

ODIN website only has carbon rims?


Why 800USD for some random chinese alu rim?

Matthewfalle

why can't you send them back for a refund?

redvision

Matthewfalle wrote:

why can't you send them back for a refund?

I'm wondering the same thing

shiznit76

send them back, no brainer. If you paid by credit card you will be covered by miss selling by that too

Matthewfalle

shiznit76 wrote:

send them back, no brainer. If you paid by credit card you will be covered by miss selling by that too

its not misselling if he ordered the wrong thing.

just send them back its no drama-lama

shiznit76

even if he did make a mistake, distance selling means he has cooling off period and can return with 14 days, in UK anyway

Matthewfalle

shiznit76 wrote:

even if he did make a mistake, distance selling means he has cooling off period and can return with 14 days, in UK anyway

yes, he did make a mistake. he ordered the wrong wheels then made a mountain out of a molehill.

#sendthemback

zendoflex

@Moonbiker: it's carbon, not Alu. Who said Alu?

The description shows measurements and pictures of another rim. So it won't help anyone if I post it here. I will try to use AliExpress buyers protection but I am afraid it won't work because I cannot proof that it is unsafe. Regarding the charge back: It's not legal to do a credit card charge back if it was me who used the credit card no matter if it was fraud or not.

BTW, the ENVE psi recommendations for the 4.5 disc rims are the same as for all other enve hooked rims. They never recommend above 90 on any carbon rim on their website. I am afraid that the vendor will argue that hookless is state of the art technology and no reason for a 100% refund. The product was bespoke, so refunding is not as easy as you all might think. But sure I will try. I didn't sleep the whole night, I am really afraid but will keep you posted once I am able to open a dispute (3 days left of the waiting period).

webboo

That first picture looks like an Aluminium rim.
You haven’t mentioned where you are based. Here in the UK you are able to return online purchases if they are not what you want.

zendoflex

even if ordered from China?

Here the link:
https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/UDGwLTF

It clearly shows a hook , this is my only lever that I can use for the dispute. It never says anything about a hook, I just expected it from the drawings and measurements. But if it is enough for a 100% refund ... In EU it would but in China I don't know, I guess not

timothyw

Assuming you aren't particularly heavy and your bike can accommodate 28mm tyres I think it'll be fine.

The traditional test is to put on your tyres, overinflate them by 20 psi then leave it for a few hours and see if they come off. Different tyres will have a tighter fit and so be better suited.

Or as stated, you could send them back or resell them.

shiznit76

you paid $800 for a pir of wheels from china off aliexpress? I've some magic beans if you want to buy them too

sungod

screenshot the page, it clearly shows clinchers

what they sent is not what's on that page

return policy says...

Returns accepted if product not as described, buyer pays return shipping fee; or keep the product & agree refund with seller.

...stop wasting time, trigger the process

Matthewfalle

zendoflex wrote:

@Moonbiker: it's carbon, not Alu. Who said Alu?

The description shows measurements and pictures of another rim. So it won't help anyone if I post it here. I will try to use AliExpress buyers protection but I am afraid it won't work because I cannot proof that it is unsafe. Regarding the charge back: It's not legal to do a credit card charge back if it was me who used the credit card no matter if it was fraud or not.

BTW, the ENVE psi recommendations for the 4.5 disc rims are the same as for all other enve hooked rims. They never recommend above 90 on any carbon rim on their website. I am afraid that the vendor will argue that hookless is state of the art technology and no reason for a 100% refund. The product was bespoke, so refunding is not as easy as you all might think. But sure I will try. I didn't sleep the whole night, I am really afraid but will keep you posted once I am able to open a dispute (3 days left of the waiting period).

its not fraud. you ordered the wrong thing.

zendoflex

I was at one of Berlins best wheelbuilders today, he was impressed by the wheels checked spoke tension, we inflated to 9 bar, jumped and sat on the wheel again and again. he recommended to push the bike in curves uphill to see if the tire jumps off. I still want that refund because I will feel better with hooks but i think those wheels are pretty good at least for low pressure tubeless.

@shiznit76: I used aliexpress to buy because of the buyers protection. It seems you don't have an understanding of China so you should better not buy there. I know the factory, I contacted DT Swiss and Sapim, checked everyone who was part of the process, found out who imported the hubs, who assembled them, I know the european bike brands who order there too. There is chinese new year over there right now why I can't do anything but I am sure the vendor will try to convince me on monday that hookless is superior to normal rims and that it's some kind of upgrade and that they now only build like that. But it doesn't change the fact that I feel uncomfortable and that it is not what i ordered, yeah... But don't blame China or my stupidity for it. It's none of it. It just happened. It's a different way of doing business over there.

"...stop wasting time, trigger the process" - I don't waste time. I can start the process 10 days after shipment. But they were shipped 7 days ago with express, i got them early. So i still have to wait for three more days to start the aliexpress dispute.

shiznit76

zendoflex wrote:

I was at one of Berlins best wheelbuilders today, he was impressed by the wheels checked spoke tension, we inflated to 9 bar, jumped and sat on the wheel again and again. he recommended to push the bike in curves uphill to see if the tire jumps off. I still want that refund because I will feel better with hooks but i think those wheels are pretty good at least for low pressure tubeless.

@shiznit76: I used aliexpress to buy because of the buyers protection. It seems you don't have an understanding of China so you should better not buy there. I know the factory, I contacted DT Swiss and Sapim, checked everyone who was part of the process, found out who imported the hubs, who assembled them, I know the european bike brands who order there too. There is chinese new year over there right now why I can't do anything but I am sure the vendor will try to convince me on monday that hookless is superior to normal rims and that it's some kind of upgrade and that they now only build like that. But it doesn't change the fact that I feel uncomfortable and that it is not what i ordered, yeah... But don't blame China or my stupidity for it. It's none of it. It just happened. It's a different way of doing business over there.

"...stop wasting time, trigger the process" - I don't waste time. I can start the process 10 days after shipment. But they were shipped 7 days ago with express, i got them early. So i still have to wait for three more days to start the aliexpress dispute.

It's the fact you spent $800 on something from China on alixpress, Big Don will have you punted out the Good ol US of A, Personally, i wouldn't buy anything direct from China via alixpress costing more than $10. See, if you bought from your own country or local sjop you wouldn't have had nearly as much stress as you;re now having. Have fun sending them back and getting your refund

cougie

What did Berlin's best wheel builder say about you spending so much on Chinese wheels and them asking him to sort them out ? I'm sure for that price he could have made you a nice set.

Pross

zendoflex wrote:

I was at one of Berlins best wheelbuilders today, he was impressed by the wheels checked spoke tension, we inflated to 9 bar, jumped and sat on the wheel again and again. he recommended to push the bike in curves uphill to see if the tire jumps off. I still want that refund because I will feel better with hooks but i think those wheels are pretty good at least for low pressure tubeless.

@shiznit76: I used aliexpress to buy because of the buyers protection. It seems you don't have an understanding of China so you should better not buy there. I know the factory, I contacted DT Swiss and Sapim, checked everyone who was part of the process, found out who imported the hubs, who assembled them, I know the european bike brands who order there too. There is chinese new year over there right now why I can't do anything but I am sure the vendor will try to convince me on monday that hookless is superior to normal rims and that it's some kind of upgrade and that they now only build like that. But it doesn't change the fact that I feel uncomfortable and that it is not what i ordered, yeah... But don't blame China or my stupidity for it. It's none of it. It just happened. It's a different way of doing business over there.

"...stop wasting time, trigger the process" - I don't waste time. I can start the process 10 days after shipment. But they were shipped 7 days ago with express, i got them early. So i still have to wait for three more days to start the aliexpress dispute.

And yet you are the one with an expensive set of wheels that don't match the description and seem to think you won't get refunded. Have you considered it may be a genuine mistake on their part and they'll happily refund / replace them? Sorry if I've missed it but I didn't see anything about you contacting the seller and querying it.