Numb feeling in arms (now with images)

Mhrock86

Hi guys,

I have put in a couple of longer rides recently, and after 20k in, I seem to get a tingling/numb sensation in mainly my left arm.

Some questions, I guess:

- I am probably putting too much weight forwards on the handlebars? Can I raise my handelbars any further when they already have 4 x 5mm spacers underneath (none on top?). Someone on GCN said max should be 13mm - but unsure if this is true.

- Moving them in different positions during the ride doesn't seem to help much

- It doesn't seem to happen with my right arm? Does this mean I am putting too much weight on my left arm?

- I get pins and needles in my left arm for the remainder of the day, and sometimes a little pain in the elbow. Shouldnt it stop after I get off the bike?

Cheers!

Oli

shiznit76

Hi, I had this, actually moved my handlebars DOWN and it helped alleviate it.

Could be anything from angle of seat, is it sloping towards front causing more weight on wrists?

Are you subconsciously putting more strain on your left wrist? Is your seat slightly angled left or right rather than pointing straight ahead?
All minor things that could cause pain in your arm/wrist

Mhrock86

shiznit76 wrote:

Hi, I had this, actually moved my handlebars DOWN and it helped alleviate it.

Could be anything from angle of seat, is it sloping towards front causing more weight on wrists?

Are you subconsciously putting more strain on your left wrist? Is your seat slightly angled left or right rather than pointing straight ahead?
All minor things that could cause pain in your arm/wrist

Ah ok, I hadn't thought about moving them down as they seem pretty far down to me at the moment, as my saddle is relatively high. My leg is at the right length at the bottom of the stroke of the pedal (almost fully extended but with a slight bend in the knee), and I get no pain at all from the saddle in my hips or legs etc. I do feel as though I am leaning too far forward onto the front wheel.

Does this mean the handle bars need to come up?

Mhrock86

Mhrock86 wrote:

shiznit76 wrote:

Hi, I had this, actually moved my handlebars DOWN and it helped alleviate it.

Could be anything from angle of seat, is it sloping towards front causing more weight on wrists?

Are you subconsciously putting more strain on your left wrist? Is your seat slightly angled left or right rather than pointing straight ahead?
All minor things that could cause pain in your arm/wrist

Ah ok, I hadn't thought about moving them down as they seem pretty far down to me at the moment, as my saddle is relatively high, but no, the saddle is not sloping forward. My leg is at the right length at the bottom of the stroke of the pedal (almost fully extended but with a slight bend in the knee), and I get no pain at all from the saddle in my hips or legs etc. I do feel as though I am leaning too far forward onto the front wheel.

Does this mean the handle bars need to come up?

shiznit76

you said your bars were already as high as they could go?

oxoman

It could be your stem is to long, your best bet may be to ask an experienced rider to assess your position on the bike when riding. Another option is to get a bike fit with a professional. Is your stem sloping down ie slammed or rising gently up.

photonic69

Numbness in a limb is usually caused by compression or pinching of a nerve. For arms there are two options - first is at the wrist and could be caused by the Ulnar nerve being compressed by putting too much weight on your wrists and the fleshy part of your hand below the little finder side of your palm. The other possibility is the nerve bundles in your neck and shoulders. If you are allowing too much of your upper body weight to be supported through your arms, then after a while your shoulders tire and your shoulder blades come together causing pressure on the nerves.

Either way the best remedy is to strengthen your core muscles so your torso supports itself. Make sure your arms are bent slightly at the elbows and not locked out when riding. Also consider stretching to aid flexibility and should be included in your exercise routine.

Hope this helps.

Mhrock86

shiznit76 wrote:

you said your bars were already as high as they could go?

I'm not sure that they are - just asking if its true that I can only have 13mm max of spacers underneath the bars.

There are I think 4 x 5mm spacers currently underneath the handlebars at the moment, none on the top.

I was thinking whether or not to take them off and put another 5mm spacer on to bring them up to see if it makes any difference but unsure if I can actually do this in terms of stem length etc as I am a noob!

Any help greatly appreciated

Cheers

Oli

Mhrock86

oxoman wrote:

It could be your stem is to long, your best bet may be to ask an experienced rider to assess your position on the bike when riding. Another option is to get a bike fit with a professional. Is your stem sloping down ie slammed or rising gently up.

Thank you for your reply Oxoman. When you say its too long does that mean its too high?

Mhrock86

Mhrock86 wrote:

oxoman wrote:

It could be your stem is to long, your best bet may be to ask an experienced rider to assess your position on the bike when riding. Another option is to get a bike fit with a professional. Is your stem sloping down ie slammed or rising gently up.

Thank you for your reply Oxoman. When you say its too long does that mean its too high?

If I am honest I am not quite sure what you mean rising gently up but its not slammed. It seems in a pretty normal position, potentially a bit high compared to the aggressive stance I have seen on others bikes whilst on the road. The saddle is relatively high in comparison to the bars, but not aggressively so.

I thought maybe they were still too low, which was causing me to lean forward onto them.

Need to think a little more about how outstretched my arms are when on the handlebars - perhaps I need to bring my saddle forward a little?

cougie

Also what pressures and tyres are you running ?

Mhrock86

cougie wrote:

Also what pressures and tyres are you running ?

I am running 622 x 35 700c 28" Schwalbe CX Tyres @ 60psi as I am 91kg and they have a 100kg max (including the bike I am around 99kg)

figbat

Mhrock86 wrote:

There are I think 4 x 5mm spacers currently underneath the handlebars at the moment, none on the top.

I was thinking whether or not to take them off and put another 5mm spacer on to bring them up to see if it makes any difference but unsure if I can actually do this in terms of stem length etc as I am a noob!

If you have nothing poking up above the stem, then you can't (safely) raise the stem any further. If you do want to try raising the bars you could flip the stem over, assuming it is currently fitted in a downwards angle.

On both my road bikes I have gone for shorter stems which improved their comfort significantly, with little apparent effect on handling.

And for clarity, your steering comprises:

- the fork; this bit holds the front wheel - the steerer comes up from the fork legs, through the frame and pokes up above the headset by a set amount. Steerers are cut to length, which limits the maximum height you can mount the stem.
- the headset; this is the bearings in that allow the fork to swivel in the frame
- the stem; this attaches to the top of the fork (the steerer), with spacers beneath it to set the stem height. Stems are usually defined by their length (eg 100mm) and their angle (eg -6°). This is the angle between the stem and the steerer, most road bikes have the stem angled downwards relative to the steerer, hence the negative angle. The stem is what holds the fork in the frame - with the stem bolts loosened you use the bolt on the top cap to preload the bearings until they are free to move but without any play, then you tighten the stem bolts to hold it all in place.
- the handlebars; these are bolted to the front of the stem

darkhairedlord

bend you elbows- thats that fixed.

oxoman

Most stems are angled and are reversible so they can slope down ie slammed or rising. A stem in the raised position is sometimes frowned upon by some, but comfort comes first. The darkhairedlord also has a valid point your arms should be bent slightly to act like a spring. Stems come in different lengths on both road and mountain bikes, they're also available with different angles as well.

Hooptie

Is your seat very far forward? Sounds counterintuitive, but when I had this problem, I moved my seat back and down (for every 3mm you move back, move 1mm down). My point being, the force you put against the pedals reduces the amount of weight placed on your seat and handlebars. With the crank further in front of your hips, you change your center of gravity slightly and increase the leverage used to relieve weight from your hands.
If your reach is too long after doing that, you'll need a shorter stem. I did. I'm not a bike fitter, but this idea came from one.

On the other hand.. maybe your reach and seat are fine. If you sit in the saddle more to one side or the other or have one hip slightly forward of the other, it throws your weight distribution off and the arm of the side you lean or twist to has to carry more weight--which can cause hand numbness on one side. The correction for that can be as simple as checking your cleat position. If one cleat is positioned too far fore or aft, it can cause your whole body to compensate for the effective disparity in leg lengths by twisting itself into a misaligned position and throwing more weight to one side.

Check your cleats first. That doesn't cost anything.

yiannism

I had a similar problems, i was putting 2 much weight on my arms, and affected my shoulder. Then ive changed my saddle to a prologo scratch 2, and now everything is fine, so my advice is to find a saddle that can support your body, and adjust it accordingly.

Mhrock86

oxoman wrote:

Most stems are angled and are reversible so they can slope down ie slammed or rising. A stem in the raised position is sometimes frowned upon by some, but comfort comes first. The darkhairedlord also has a valid point your arms should be bent slightly to act like a spring. Stems come in different lengths on both road and mountain bikes, they're also available with different angles as well.

Hey Oxoman - here is a photo of how it's looking.

I feel like it needs to be ever so slightly higher - does it look like I am able to reverse the stem round?

URL=https://s1327.photobucket.com/user/machineheadrock/media/headset2_zpsoed6ducv.jpg.html][/URL]

Cheers!

darkhairedlord

take some spacers out and bend your elbows.
WTF is that thing suck on the front?
If the pain is in your left arm, it could be a heart problem.

Vino'sGhost

darkhairedlord wrote:

take some spacers out and bend your elbows.
WTF is that thing suck on the front?
If the pain is in your left arm, it could be a heart problem.

figbat

darkhairedlord wrote:

take some spacers out and bend your elbows.

Also, to be clear, if you remove some spacers from beneath the stem you will need to either:

- replace them above the stem, meaning you will have a small amount of protusion above the stem, or
- cut the steerer down by the amount that you remove.

Probably best, at this stage at least, to go for the first option where you can test out various positions before making any permanent, irreversible alterations.

step83

Your stem is actually on its downward angle at the moment so you couple flip it, or maybe even rotate the bars slightly both will give you more height.

Also do you find yourself gripping more tightly with the left? I suffer with this on my right side mainly because I over grip, and I think the levers are not quite level but thats a whole other story.

Id try the stem flip and bin that front flappy thing

DeVlaeminck

Couple of suggestions already made,
- is your saddle level ? If you sit up no hands (assuming you can ride no hands) do you feel yourself sliding forwards. Maybe try tilting the saddle back a touch.
- try sliding the saddle back a bit, and down. Moving it back a bit can take some weight off your arms.

Mhrock86

DeVlaeminck wrote:

Couple of suggestions already made,
- is your saddle level ? If you sit up no hands (assuming you can ride no hands) do you feel yourself sliding forwards. Maybe try tilting the saddle back a touch.
- try sliding the saddle back a bit, and down. Moving it back a bit can take some weight off your arms.

Great stuff, thanks DeVlaeminck I am going to try this! I definitely have my saddle in the forward and down position.

I put a spirit level on it yesterday and thought that it was not perfectly horizontal.

I know which bolts I need to loosen to change the rake/forwards backwards, but how do I change the tilt?

Cheers,

Oli

Mhrock86

Step83 wrote:

Your stem is actually on its downward angle at the moment so you couple flip it, or maybe even rotate the bars slightly both will give you more height.

Also do you find yourself gripping more tightly with the left? I suffer with this on my right side mainly because I over grip, and I think the levers are not quite level but thats a whole other story.

Id try the stem flip and bin that front flappy thing

Wonderful stuff, I got the tools from CRC and going to flip the stem tonight, and if that doesnt work, start removing the spacers to see how we go!

Thank you!

keef66

Mhrock86 wrote:

I know which bolts I need to loosen to change the rake/forwards backwards, but how do I change the tilt?

Cheers,

Oli

Depends entirely on the kind of saddle clamp your seat post has. Most of mine if you loosen 2 bolts one each side everything goes loose and you can slide the saddle back and forth, and also alter the angle. Often when you're trying to do one you inadvertently do the other.
Son's pub bike has a USE post which has a bolt in front and a bolt behind the seatpost. You loosen one and tighten the other to adjust the tilt. Quite clever once you've managed to assemble it from its loose component parts...

Mhrock86

keef66 wrote:

Mhrock86 wrote:

I know which bolts I need to loosen to change the rake/forwards backwards, but how do I change the tilt?

Cheers,

Oli

Depends entirely on the kind of saddle clamp your seat post has. Most of mine if you loosen 2 bolts one each side everything goes loose and you can slide the saddle back and forth, and also alter the angle. Often when you're trying to do one you inadvertently do the other.
Son's pub bike has a USE post which has a bolt in front and a bolt behind the seatpost. You loosen one and tighten the other to adjust the tilt. Quite clever once you've managed to assemble it from its loose component parts...

Thanks so much Keef! I managed it in the end, it was one bolt for both as you say, with a bit of fettling and using the string pendant method thing from the bottom of my kneecap to the centre of the pedal crank end (when pedals are horizontal), everything now lines up. I have also dropped the handlebars by removing spacers from underneath and placing on top. I also used a spirit level to ensure it was straight at the front. I noticed it was definitely pitching upwards when I was doing that!

Bike looks a lot more aggressive but before I post final picks of my set up, Im going to take it out tonight and tweak it some more.

CRC torque wrench set was a life saver for all those!

kayakerchris

The commonest cause for numbness is having your wrists bent backwards and the elbows locked straight.

StillGoing

It could also be medical related. My left hand would go numb on long rides to the point of making it difficult to change gear on the front. For years I put it down to bad positioning or maybe even CTS. Moved the position around several times to try and alleviate it without success. Years later after a medical emergency, they discovered that the blood pressure in my left arm was way lower than the right. This is a classic symptom of subclavian occlusion (blocked artery). Unfortunately, my blockage is due to a tear on the inside of the artery from a motorcycle crash, causing a clot to form and can't be operated on without risk of mortality. But, fortunately, my body has worked out for itself how to divert a limited blood flow from the circle of willis down to the left arm, effectively a DIY bypass. More commonly, it is caused by a build up of fatty substances that can be treated with stents and statins. Anyone that suffers left hand numbness should check the BP in both arms to rule out vascular disease.

andyh01

I recently had something similar new bike, longer ride pins and needles after few hours mainly right hand , maybe as right handed more dominant subconscious putting more weight through, however, thinking logically if wrong position, I would have thought if fatigued induced then the weakest side or left should react first but also the f positional I would of thought both sides be effected.

I found actually my sdp cleat was slightly out, no leg or knee pain or anything but adjusting the position of the right cleat /foot has made a difference to me and I've not had as much issue since