Tiagra or 105 Groupset.

skooter

I'm looking at another bike and the main difference is the groupset

Bike 1... Tiagra and 405 deore hydro disc brake and is £850.
Bike 2.. 105 and 7000 hydro disc brakes and is £1250. ( Better disc but still hydro )
Question.. Do you reckon bike two is worth the extra £400.

What say you.

Matthewfalle

better discs, better groupset.

yeah, i'd spend the extra.

Vino'sGhost

if you can afford it the more expensive bike has a much more capable / enjoyable groupset.

If you cant afford it then go cheap but expect to want to change it

skooter

I hear what you saying guys I'm sort of fifty/fifty.

Cheers

lettingthedaysgoby

Would depend on what the bike is going to be used for in my choosing.

Best/main bike? Commuter?

Zendog1

I've always thought 105 hits the sweet spot. Quality but not eye watering expensive.

Current and previous bikes 105.

Go for it - you know you want to!

skooter

Its just a run about really so not too serious, I just had the idea to try something I've never tried before?
I have only ever had 105 10sp, 105 11sp, Ultegra and Dura Ace.
It would of course cost me more to change from Tiagra to 105 11sp than the £400 difference if I don't like it.

Matthewfalle

you'll only upgrade it to 105 and end up spending more money so may as well get the better groupset & brakes from the off.

lesfirth

Matthewfalle wrote:

you'll only upgrade it to 105 and end up spending more money so may as well get the better groupset & brakes from the off.

Yes,but if you go for 105 you will want to upgrade to Ultegra, even though blindfolded I can't tell one from the other.
If you go for Tiagra you will have the fun of upgrading to 105. Then again is it just me that constantly wants to mess with my N+1 bikes?

super_davo

R7000 is a recent release and is effectively a generation ahead of 4700. The biggest improvement in in the shifters, which aren't massive bulbous ugly things like the 505/405 shifters the 5800/4700 generation has (that also known to chew up cables). I've got a 5800 disk brake bike and I'm thinking of upgrading for this reason alone.
I'd get the 105 if I were you...

pottssteve

I have Tiagra on my cyclocross bike and 105 on the road bike. It's not a like-for like comparison as the rest of the bikes are very different from each other, but I slightly prefer the 105.

My advice is buy the best you can afford; as others have said you may well want to upgrade later anyway.

bendertherobot

One is good looking, the other is hideous.

Both will work just fine.

lettingthedaysgoby

Question for those in the know - Can the new 105 hydro shifters be used with an older 105 rear mech? Is the cable pull still the same or is it different for those new “shadow” derailleurs? I like the idea of upgrading the RS505 shifters on my current bike, for aesthetic reasons if nowt else.

timothyw

Tough call this one.

The rs405 shifters I suspect suffer from the same flaw as the rs505, where the cables can chew through their guides and break the shifters if these guides aren't replaced.

If you buy the cheaper one, you need to be aware of this and keep an eye on it.

The new 105 hydraulic groupset hopefully doesn't have any such flaws (and by all accounts is certainly a bit more refined) but £400 is a lot of money. It couldn't buy the 105 group outright, but if you sold the rs405 group new you could certainly upgrade to it for less (if you did the work yourself).

Then factor in that disc brakes are at their best in wet conditions... Conditions that are harder on kit, and that are less likely to justify an expensive groupset.

For me it'd have to be the cheaper one, but then I have a nice summer bike for good conditions already - for a jack of all trades it probably makes sense to have the better group.

Oh and yes, 5800 and r7000 are compatible.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

+£400 for simply the jump from Tiagra to 105 sounds a bad deal to me, might be more reasonable if getting better frame; fork; finishing kit etc.

For example...
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/cub ... 65625?mx=a is a great price for a Tiagra hydraulic disc brake bike for women or men who are approx 5'7" to 5'11", perhaps with a slightly longer stem and a switch of saddle for blokes. By default it isn't light at ~10.3Kg, but I suspect the in-house wheels are 2Kg+ and you can certainly get lighter and better performing tyres than Conti Ultra Sport 2s.

https://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m7b0s6p93 ... -DISC-2018 gets you 105 with in-house wheels.

https://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m7b0s6p83 ... -DISC-2017 gets you 105 with a carbon frame/fork upgrade, plus I suspect lighter stock wheels for +£110 and it's just over 1Kg lighter than the above (this 58cm is a newer version of my Cube in my size, I'm ~178cm with a longer torso).

skooter

The two bikes I was looking at were the Evans Pinnacle Dolomite 2 £840
https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle-do ... e-EV306252

and the other was there Arkrose R2 £1250
https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle-ar ... e-EV339951

Both come with mud guard mounts?

The one nitrousOxide is a bit cheaper but not sure if it has mud guard mount.

But both could be upgraded to 105..

Interesting thoughts from you guys cheers.

bendertherobot

So, first things first. Those are different bikes, so it's not about Tiagra v 105. One is a gravel bike and the other a disc equipped road bike. One is also reduced and the other normal price, making comparisons hard.

If you were prepared to spend £1250 on the Arkose JUST to get 105 then have a look at this Dolomite which is way way better (for road riding):https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle-dolomite-ltd-road-bike-EV294855

If it was the Arkose you were after then I'd be looking perhaps at this one:

https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle-ar ... e-EV306247

But if you were doing that a Vitus Energie at Wiggle is much better value.

So, it really depends, what bike is it that you want?

skooter

Well my first choice was the Pinnacle 4 on offer for £1060 which I put a £50.00 deposit on it ( which they still have) only to be told that someone beat me too it because they only had one left, so what was is left was the two above.
The reason one is different from the other didn't bother me as 10 kilo road bike is the same weight as a 10 kilo gravel bike.
One is Tiagra for £840 the other a 105 for £1250..

That Arkose 4 you linked looks nice but never had a 1x11 but I will have another look at it the Vitus too my concern would be is the front chain big enough round about the 40 mark perhaps.
Cheer Paul

skooter

PS.. What would the Sram 1x11 be in Shimano terms.

bendertherobot

There are some notable differences in geometry and tyre clearance (etc) between the road and gravel bikes so it's difficult to say which is better suited to you. So deciding on gearing etc is just part of that choice. Hence the throwing in of the SRAM as, if you're doing off roading, paths, calm stuff, touring, that might be a better choice. The equivalent there is 105 in terms of the brakes (and speeds). But, of course, no small ring.

So, it's probably worth finding out what you want to do with it, and work from there. There are some good road bikes linked to on thread, unless you're wedded to Evans.

So, (and all these random bikes are ultimately meaningless if you don't like them, or they are the wrong size) here's a stellar bargain on 105 disc.. (well RS785 but that was Ultegra level anyway)

https://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m7b0s6p69 ... PRO-3-2016

N0bodyOfTheGoat

https://www.paulscycles.co.uk/m7b0s197p ... d-Pro-2018 is a good deal for 105 hydraulic adventure bike, the 56cm would almost certainly work for me, perhaps with a +10mm stem.

All depends what you want.

I tried SRAM double-tap gearing for the first time on a Boardman CX Team in early 2017, I found it very alien during a ~1 hour turbo test ride in-store, it would probably feel more natural if given more time but it stopped me from paying ~£720 there and then. Then bought the Cube a couple of months later.

skooter

No I'm not married to evan's lol. But they are on my door step they do a bike change if you don't like it and you can have a test ride first. As much as I like wiggle too they can't offer the same,
Paul's bike was good but no mud guard mounts.
I have seen on evans a Arkose 3 2018 for a £1000 and the Arkose 4 1xll that you suggested for £1080 so they are looking into there stock to see if they have medium frames left..should know next week.
Plus a Vitus Venon that would suit if the others don't but a tad higher in price at £1200..

Laters mate

super_davo

If you do go to Evans make sure you join British Cycling to get 10% off before you buy the bike. A £24 membership would save you £125 if you get the most expensive bike. It would have saved you the same on CRC a few months ago but they've changed it to a stingy £10 off now...

wasp707

skooter wrote:

No I'm not married to evan's lol. But they are on my door step they do a bike change if you don't like it and you can have a test ride first. As much as I like wiggle too they can't offer the same,
Paul's bike was good but no mud guard mounts.
I have seen on evans a Arkose 3 2018 for a £1000 and the Arkose 4 1xll that you suggested for £1080 so they are looking into there stock to see if they have medium frames left..should know next week.
Plus a Vitus Venon that would suit if the others don't but a tad higher in price at £1200..

Laters mate

What about this 105 offering from Decathlon?

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/triban-rc-5 ... 54421.html

N0bodyOfTheGoat

wasp707 wrote:

What about this 105 offering from Decathlon?

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/triban-rc-5 ... 54421.html

That front brake mounting won fugly bodge bike setup of 2018 for me, it's ridiculous! :shock:

Spoiled an otherwise nice spec bike, they should either have stayed similar price for full Tiagra with proper hydraulic caliper that sits within six inches of the fork, or 105 hydraulics for ~£900-1000.

skooter

NitrousOxide wrote:

wasp707 wrote:

What about this 105 offering from Decathlon?

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/triban-rc-5 ... 54421.html

That front brake mounting won fugly bodge bike setup of 2018 for me, it's ridiculous! :shock:

Spoiled an otherwise nice spec bike, they should either have stayed similar price for full Tiagra with proper hydraulic caliper that sits within six inches of the fork, or 105 hydraulics for ~£900-1000.

I hate cable disc I had one before on a Defy and it was dire.. good value bike though.

skooter

super_davo wrote:

If you do go to Evans make sure you join British Cycling to get 10% off before you buy the bike. A £24 membership would save you £125 if you get the most expensive bike. It would have saved you the same on CRC a few months ago but they've changed it to a stingy £10 off now...

Just joined.. thanks for the info.
Paul.