Insurance replacement offer Specialized Pitch Expert for stolen B'twin Rockrider 580

mrbigbiker

My Rockrider 580 https://www.decathlon.co.uk/rockrider-580-mountain-bike-275-id_8336093.html original full price £600, has been stolen and the insurers first replacement offer is a Specialized Pitch Expert 27.5" https://www.wheelies.co.uk/shop/p200030/Specialized-Pitch-Expert-27-5.aspx also full price at £600 from wheelies.

Insurance policy says the replacement will be of 'similar quality'. I'm not into all the technical component stuff and don't know my SRAMs from my Shimanos but no Rockshox air fork and a Specialized at the same price as a Decathlon says 'not a good deal' to me, so could some helpful expert give me something concrete to go back with as to why this is not a worthy replacement.

Thanks guys

[edit] Or even give me an idea of a reasonable replacement so we can agree a value before I ask for cash to spend elsewhere!

cooldad

Basically, every component on the Rockrider is better than the Spesh.

CitizenLee

cooldad wrote:

Basically, every component on the Rockrider is better than the Spesh.

He'll be limited to Wheelies though... I know I was with my insurer.

The Pitch is still a good bike, and Spesh make great frames. I'd still maybe have a look at what else is available for £600 on their site though.

david7m

Can you add a bit to get different model?
Dave

cooldad

CitizenLee wrote:

cooldad wrote:

Basically, every component on the Rockrider is better than the Spesh.

He'll be limited to Wheelies though... I know I was with my insurer.

The Pitch is still a good bike, and Spesh make great frames. I'd still maybe have a look at what else is available for £600 on their site though.

There will be nothing in the policy restricting him to wheelies. The policy will say, at the option of the insurer, to replace or pay cash. The replacement has to be like for like. If they decide to replace, the cost is not the client's problem, unless the bike was specified at that value.

Insurers may argue, but if they insist on replacing, simply ask them to match components. So at a minimum, 10 speed, air forks and proper series brakes. Shimano (or Sram) shifters, not Microshift rubbish. A Deore or equivalent external bearing crankset, not square taper, etc.

A simple argument, if your 1CT diamond ring gets stolen, they can't decide to replace it with a .75CT stone.

Wheelies is a known rip anyway, they always 'charge' RRP, but insurers get at least a 20% discount.

"Wheelies are the UK's largest provider of insurance replacement bikes"

No normal punter would ever use them.

Quick Google brings up the same bike on numerous sites. £510 here:

https://www.leisurelakesbikes.com/14333 ... ckred.aspx

ETA 15p cheaper at Tredz.

mrbigbiker

What cooldad says sounds right to me. I only paid £400 for the RR and they have seen the receipt so I'm expecting them to offer a replacement of 'similar quality', however much that may cost. My problem is spotting when what they offer is of inferior quality, and so far it sounds like we're very much in inferior territory.

cooldad

Legally, if they decide to replace, the contract becomes one of reinstatement, which means putting the person in the position they were before the loss. Cost is not a factor.

steve_sordy

cooldad wrote:

Legally, if they decide to replace, the contract becomes one of reinstatement, which means putting the person in the position they were before the loss. Cost is not a factor.

So therefore they could offer a second hand bike that would put the person back into the position they were in before the loss. unless you have a "new for old" policy, you cannot expect "betterment".

By all means keep them honest by choosing difference sources for your replacement bike, but don't expect to get a brand new bike of the same value that you paid for years ago.

cooldad

Most policies are replacement value, but he really needs to check the wording. That's what it's for. Reading.

joebristol

Could you see if they could source a Voodoo Bizango? Similar cost but probably the best bike available for around £600.

cooldad

Generally, the insurer will agree to a cash settlement of a % of the replacement value, basically less whatever discount they would get from Wheelies. Which would normally be about 20%.

I'd be tempted to negotiate around £500 and shop around. But I basically buy second hand bikes. Nice condition year old hardly ridden bike at half of RRP is my kind of deal.

CitizenLee

@Cooldad, not saying you're wrong but when I had my Cube Hyde nicked Lloyds insisted on me getting the replacement from Wheelies. My policy was new for old so I got 900 to spend despite only paying 400 for the Cube (used).

You're right though, I would never use Wheelies through choice.

cooldad

Depends how hard you argue, and insist they replace like for like. And ask for it in writing that you have no choice, so you can have it confirmed by the ombudsman. Exceptions can be made.

I would list components on the original and replacement offered and ask them to justify the difference. Or I might not because life is too short. Who knows. But I do know that they have their 'systems' and that the poor overworked clerk handling the claim needs to get things done the easiest, quickest way. They can only settle once you've agreed, so being a pain (without being a dick) can get results.

Again, using my ring example, could they insist the replacement came from H.Samuel if the original came from Cartier?

mrbigbiker

Just to answer a previous point, cover is new for old, unspecified bicycles up to £1,000 each.

steve_sordy

MrBigBiker wrote:

Just to answer a previous point, cover is new for old, unspecified bicycles up to £1,000 each.

Sorted then!

Nothing to do with price of the old or price of the new.

If you did an absolutely cracking deal when you got your £1000 bike for £450, that is no reason to fob you off with a £450 bike!

As some one else suggested, just itemise the components, but be careful that you don't end up with a crap bike that just happens to have the components you listed.

littleandy0410

Years ago (over 10 yrs now :shock: ) I had my Giant Trance 4 stolen. I had receipts showing that even though rrp was £1100, I had paid less than £600 at Pauls Cycles. I had upgraded the forks, and had receipts for that too.

I had new for old on my insurance policy but the bike had to come from Halfords. They tried to offer me a full sus GT, but it wasn't what I wanted. At the time, the Specialised FSR XC Expert had just had great reviews, and Halfords said they could order in any brand at RRP, so I went for that. So they ordered it in for me at £1099, and gave me vouchers to cover the rest (lock, lights, bottle cage, etc)

Long story short - it's worth arguing the toss if you're not happy, and the insurance company at the time were content with paying out £1300 for a bike I had openly admitted cost me £600 (+£200 in extras/mods).

If you have to go through Wheelies, but can find another bike you like, it's worth finding out if they can order it in for you.

cooldad

What he said ^^^^^^^^

steve_sordy

littleandy0410 wrote:

.............

I had new for old on my insurance policy but the bike had to come from Halfords. ..........

Unbelievable! Halfords don't supply Santa Cruz, Whyte, YT,.. and many many more brands. So why does the insurance company expect you to replace your bike from someone that doesn't supply them. They wouldn't expect you to replace your Mercedes from a Kia garage would they?

Actually I do know why. Two things, 1) they don't understand bikes and 2) it is cheaper for them to do a deal with one company that saves them money.

littleandy0410

steve_sordy wrote:

littleandy0410 wrote:

.............

I had new for old on my insurance policy but the bike had to come from Halfords. ..........

Unbelievable! Halfords don't supply Santa Cruz, Whyte, YT,.. and many many more brands. So why does the insurance company expect you to replace your bike from someone that doesn't supply them. They wouldn't expect you to replace your Mercedes from a Kia garage would they?

Actually I do know why. Two things, 1) they don't understand bikes and 2) it is cheaper for them to do a deal with one company that saves them money.

Things may have changed recently, as I say it was 10 years ago, but even then I wasn't particularly impressed! They would've been able to order in Whyte or SC, but not YT, at a a guess. (I only had £1100 to spend so that wasn't an issue I had to deal with!)

The Rookie

The master of ill informed statements is back.....hi.

Yes it is right that it is, Spesh make some shockingly bad lower end bikes to cash in on the name andTHAT Rockrider is better than THAT Spesh.

mrbigbiker

Something slightly more useful to add to the thread, I'm currently waiting for an offer of a better replacement, so I'll be back for more help when the offer comes!

The Rookie

Good luck!

mrbigbiker

So at last I have another offering, a Boardman MHT 8.6 https://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/mountain-bikes/boardman-mht-8-6-mountain-bike-blue .
Although this isn't really what I want as I don't want a 1x10, can I reject it on 'not of similar quality' grounds as well or is the quality OK compared with the Rockrider https://www.decathlon.co.uk/rockrider-580-mountain-bike-275-id_8336093.html (link repeated from top of thread).

Thanks in anticipation etc.

joebristol

I think I’d prefer to have the Boardman personally. I think the Raidom could edge out the to RockShox for stiffness and they have a little more travel. The geometry on the Boardman frame is a little bit more modern and trail rather than full Xc. The rockrider might have better brakes I guess though.

I’d prefer 1x10 over 3x10 definitely - you tend to get less noise from chainslap and it is nicer not having to fiddle about with a front derailleur.

mrbigbiker

So you're saying the quality is OK but I'm still concerned about the gearing at the bottom end. I'm 16.5st/105kg and on one of my rides often find myself in bottom gear on centre chainring (0.89) with only the small chainring in reserve (which would go down to 0.67). The Boardman bottoms out, so to speak, at 0.81.

The problem here is that I'm not a MTB rider but got one for the perceived bike strength for my weight and the value for money of the Rockrider at the time. Riding is a mix of road, seafront, railway lines, bridleways, forest tracks, footpaths and fields. I now want to get the best I can for me as a replacement. Once a bike is agreed, cash is an option!

How does this Cube Attention SL compare with the Rockrider and Boardman?

Thanks

joebristol

If you’re not using this on steep off-road uphills I’d have thought the 34/42 lowest gear (Boardman) would have been spinny enough - if not you could change it to a 32 tooth chainring or maybe even a 30 (depending on crank compatibility). However on the road that gives you a problem at the top end where you’ll spinout very quickly.

For your use that cube has a lower gear and a higher gear than the boardman so would be better for you from what you’ve said.

The fork being a Recon is better than the rockrider you had and I’d guess is a similar level to the Raidon but from a better brand. It may last longer as a result as long as you service it when required.

Other kit is much of a muchness I’d say. Although the cube is a 29ersnd think the Boardman is 650b. In which case the cube is likely better for your use as it’ll smooth things like forest tracks out more and roll faster once moving.

I’d guess the cube has more xc geometry but there isn’t a chart so can’t really comment.

trek_dan

Take the Boardman - its better than what you had. If you really want 2x10 you could sell the crank/ring on Ebay, buy some different ones and a FD/shifter and probably come out even. I don't think a bike not suiting your gearing preference would be reason to reject it on quality.