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casatikidcasatikid Posts: 229
edited August 2018 in Road general
Hi, I have a fantastic Casati bike that I’ve had for several years now and it’s currently equipped with Ultegra 6600 ten speed and it’s got Mavic Kyserium sl wheel set.
I am suffering from a long term knee condition ( not cycling related) and I’m thinking of changing from 53x39 10 speed to either a compact or semi compact 11 speed.
Is this possible with these wheels or will I need to change to 11 speed wheels?
Thanks

Posts

  • fenixfenix Posts: 5,437
    Just go compact. I don't think the benefit of 11 speed would be worth the costs.
  • BeatmakerBeatmaker Posts: 1,092
    Well assuming the drive train is worn and you're replacing the chainset, bottom bracket, chain and cassette (and perhaps cables), I'd say its the best time to upgrade to a new groupset. Casati's are nice bikes.

    Apparently Mavic wheels can be converted to 11 speed pretty easily:

    "An old M10 freehub will run 11spd shimano, by simply removing the Mavic 1.75mm spacer. "

    https://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=12941313
  • svettysvetty Posts: 1,904
    Modern groupsets have much improved shifting but the thing you'll really notice are the brakes. The new Ultegra and 105 are backwards compatible with 10 speed wheels if you go for the 11-34 cassette - which is also kind to knees.....
    FFS! Harden up and grow a pair :D
  • trek_dantrek_dan Posts: 1,366
    If your Mavic wheelset has the 'wobble spacer' fitted with the 10 speed cassette then they will be compatible with 11 speed.
  • LiamWLiamW Posts: 358
    All Mavic wheels were future proofed from the mid 2000s to take 11 speed cassettes.
  • frozefroze Posts: 147
    While getting compact gears will help but also getting a new crank that has shorter arms will help probably a lot more than getting compact gearing, and changing the gear rings to a 46-36 range would help a bit too, but getting both would be even more so helpful for your knees. Also for a lot people getting pedals with more float seems to help, Speedplay even has pedals that has full float.

    Also a 10 speed or a 11 speed cassette will DO NOTHING for your knees health, it's the gear ratio you have to be more concerned about, a 12x30 10 speed cassette will be a tad easier on the knees than a 11x28 11 speed cassette

    Now I know some are going to be screaming about the shorter crank arms, but realize this, in fact try this at home, find some stairs and take two steps at a time, in other other words skip every other step and see how your knees feel, then do it again except this time take every step and see how your knees feel. Taking shorter steps is less strenuous on your knees and the same rule applies to cycling with shorter crank arms. A 165 mm long crank arm will be a lot easier on the knees than a 175 mm crank arm, in addition to that the shorter crank arm will help you to ride at higher RPM's better than longer crank arms which is better for your knees.

    If I could only afford to change one thing due to bad knees I would change the crank arms! Later I would change the ring gears next, then after that change the cassette. Keep in mind that changing your gears as I have outlined will decrease your top speed...but it's your knees you have to be concerned with not your top speed.

    The full float pedals is a iffy thing, not sure, because I don't have bad knees, if the gearing or the full float pedals would be 2nd priority over the crank arms. I do use full float pedals but again because I don't have bad knees I can't feel the difference with my full float pedals vs my regular float pedals. When looking up the full float thing on the internet it seems that the jury is still out, some say full float is better for bad knees, some say partial float is better and some say no float is better! This is where experience comes in from those here that have knee issues and tried various pedals can comment on what they think.
  • pbt150pbt150 Posts: 338
    froze wrote:
    Now I know some are going to be screaming about the shorter crank arms, but realize this, in fact try this at home, find some stairs and take two steps at a time, in other other words skip every other step and see how your knees feel, then do it again except this time take every step and see how your knees feel. Taking shorter steps is less strenuous on your knees and the same rule applies to cycling with shorter crank arms. A 165 mm long crank arm will be a lot easier on the knees than a 175 mm crank arm, in addition to that the shorter crank arm will help you to ride at higher RPM's better than longer crank arms which is better for your knees.

    If I could only afford to change one thing due to bad knees I would change the crank arms! Later I would change the ring gears next, then after that change the cassette. Keep in mind that changing your gears as I have outlined will decrease your top speed...but it's your knees you have to be concerned with not your top speed.

    Not sure the stairs analogy is correct. You’re right that it’s harder to do stairs two at a time, but that’s because you’re doing more work by moving a mass (you) through a greater distance whilst applying a similar force through the step. Combined with muscles finding it harder to generate force at extremes of movement (e.g. quads if a knee is very bent).

    For crank arms, a longer crank allows you to generate the same torque using a lower force as the distance between the pedal axle and the B.B. is increased (like a longer lever). The bigger effects of longer cranks is positional - you’ll be moving the knee through a greater range of motion for a longer arm than a shorter arm, and bending the knee more at the 12 o’clock position if you use a longer crank arm than you would if you use a shorter crank arm.

    So a shorter crank arm may be more comfortable on dodgy knees but this is likely to be because of a better setup.
  • pbt150pbt150 Posts: 338
    I’d consider looking at your cleat position and alignment (I’m very pigeon-toed on my left foot due to a dodgy knee), saddle height and saddle fore/aft position relative to the B.B.

    And then look at buying shiny new things :-)
  • casatikidcasatikid Posts: 229
    Thanks to all for your replies. I will be giving them all considerasation.
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