removing SRAM 10 speed chain for cleaning - Advice please

champ222

Hi all

so i'm giving the bike a proper clean. It has an SRAM 10 speed chain, and i want to get it off for a proper clean. I want to use squirt, so its advised to fully degrease beforehand.

So ive done some research, and the SRAM 10 speed chains use the powerlock which are one time use. So i have some replacements here now.

So i have to break the chain, is it best to break it at the existing powerlock, and replace with new? or leave that alone and break the chain somewhere else and fit another powerlock?

Thanks

steve_sordy

I would split it at the Powerlock. You don't need to break the Powerlock with a chain splitter. You can push it open in the opposite way to closing it, but this can be tricky on 10-speed and above. So unless you have a proper tool for this, then you can use string. Yes, string! Wrap it around the Powerlock rollers and give the string a hard tug so that as the string contracts it squeezes the Powerlock together. That should do it. Google it if you have a problem.

"One time use"! I interpret that as one use per chain, not one connect/disconnect.

I break open and re-use Powerlocks all the time. Mostly because I need to remove the chain for whatever reason. I re-use the Powerlock. They become slightly easier to connect/disconnect the more times they are fitted. But when the chain is replaced, I always use a new Powerlock. I keep the old Powerlock in my pack for emergencies when out and about, for my use or that of others I meet along the way.

champ222

string.... interesting... yes i see what you mean, how hard should i be pulling the string? is it easy enough to do?

thanks

steve_sordy

champ222 wrote:

string.... interesting... yes i see what you mean, how hard should i be pulling the string? is it easy enough to do?

thanks

I have only seen the string technique used on YouTube, but it looked dead easy. I have no doubt that it would work if I had to use it on the trail (I don't carry the special pliers in my pack).

If you break the string, then double up and try again.

I don't carry string with me, but I do carry zip-ties, so a couple of those linked together should do the job.

champ222

thanks, i hadnt thought of that. I'll work something out.

Cheers

billycool

The Powerlink is designed to allow you to remove/attach the chain without having to destroy the rest of the chain. It sort of defeats the object of having them if you start taking the chain apart elsewhere.

One of these will help:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s?q= ... cat=direct

You can re-use Powerlinks, some people do, some don't.

How old is your chain? Have you measured it for chain wear?

02gf74

Why do you need to clean the chain

Any dirt can be hosed off, degreasing removes the factory grease inside the links which needs to be replaced, easier said than done. Ye older technique was to melt grease in a tin can and swish the chain about in it.

My experience of degreasig followed by regreasing was not good, I could feel grittiness when moving the links, basically grease was removed but the grit remained, new grease did not fully penetrate the links.

I'd recommend not to bother.

It is common error to overdo chain grease, it is only needed between the pins and rollers, any excess will hold grit which contributes to wear. When greasing a chain, apply spray to the links then run it through a cloth to remove excess.
.

champ222

02GF74 wrote:

Why do you need to clean the chain

http://www.squirtlube.com/wp-content/up ... ctions.pdf

02GF74 wrote:

Any dirt can be hosed off, degreasing removes the factory grease inside the links which needs to be replaced, easier said than done. Ye older technique was to melt grease in a tin can and swish the chain about in it.

My experience of degreasig followed by regreasing was not good, I could feel grittiness when moving the links, basically grease was removed but the grit remained, new grease did not fully penetrate the links.

I'd recommend not to bother.

It is common error to overdo chain grease, it is only needed between the pins and rollers, any excess will hold grit which contributes to wear. When greasing a chain, apply spray to the links then run it through a cloth to remove excess.
.

It seems everyone has a different idea about this, plenty of people are saying "the only way to clean a chain is to take it off the bike and soak it in this, then that" etc etc...

seemed like a good idea to me, and countless others, but plenty clean in situ, and probably plenty not at all.

champ222

BillyCool wrote:

The Powerlink is designed to allow you to remove/attach the chain without having to destroy the rest of the chain. It sort of defeats the object of having them if you start taking the chain apart elsewhere.

One of these will help:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s?q= ... cat=direct

You can re-use Powerlinks, some people do, some don't.

thanks, i'll check that out.

BillyCool wrote:

How old is your chain? Have you measured it for chain wear?

its a 2017 bike, it was 6 months old when i got it, and it was spotless. ive only used it about 4 times, and i'm a noob so ive probably only done 60 miles at most. so i cant imagine its too worn. but ive not measured it, nor do i know how to.

Thanks guys

steve_sordy

champ222 wrote:

............

its a 2017 bike, it was 6 months old when i got it, and it was spotless. ive only used it about 4 times, and i'm a noob so ive probably only done 60 miles at most. so i cant imagine its too worn. but ive not measured it, nor do i know how to.

Thanks guys

You can use a proper tool which is basically a go/nogo gauge. In other words it says the chain is either OK or not. I find this a bit too brutal. Most of the wear inflicted on the gears by a worn chain happens when the chain is worn above 0.75% length extension. I prefer to change the chain at about 0.65%.

How to measure?

I use a pair of vernier calipers to measure the new chain and then compare the dimension at regular intervals. I accept that most people won't have one, so another accurate technique is to remove the chain and measure it with a steel tape measure.

All bike chains are half inch pitch, meaning that the centre line of the pins are each 0.500" apart from each other. Therefore 100 links are 50" long. If you measure 100 links and you get 50.5" then it is 1% too long and is scrap and has probably already damaged your gears. Many say it is "stretched", but it just worn. If you get 50-3/8" (50.375) the chain should be replaced immediately. I would replace my chain at 50-5/16" (50.3125).

You can measure fewer links than 100 of course, but you reduce your accuracy proportionately.

champ222

Ahh, ok. I have a vernier so ill have a measure and see if i can tell how worn it is. Thanks for the info ☺

champ222

Over 12 links with my vernier, i measure 6.0120 inches. By my calculations, or rather that of an online calculator, thats about a 0.2% increase

steve_sordy

champ222 wrote:

Over 12 links with my vernier, i measure 6.0120 inches. By my calculations, or rather that of an online calculator, thats about a 0.2% increase

How can you measure accurately over 12 links with a vernier? The vernier should be pressing outwards, so you are measuring from inside a roller to inside another roller, but the opposite side of the roller, ie not from the same point each time.

Try this:
Set your vernier caliper to 5.700" and slot the internal tips in and then expand to take up the slack. Take the reading and compare to 5.700". You will get a larger reading; the difference is the wear, work it out as a percentage.

It works for up to 10-speed, but not for 11-speed and above. I suspect that the rollers are slightly larger diameters to 10-speed and below. So the thing to do is to measure a new chain and use that as your base line. Try measuring at different points around the chain, you may find quite different readings!

02gf74

champ222 wrote:

It seems everyone has a different idea about this, plenty of people are saying "the only way to clean a chain is to take it off the bike and soak it in this, then that" etc etc...

seemed like a good idea to me, and countless others, but plenty clean in situ, and probably plenty not at all.

I've yet to come across any real world tests that compare chain wear with differing maintenance methods. I will stick to what seems to work for me which avoids major chain degreasing/regreasing, who has got time to do that every after 4 hours of mtb riding like suggested in that pdf.... Well ofcourse they would suggest it since they want people to buy their gunk.

It probably works out cheaper to buy a new chain given the cost of the product and cost for my time.

champ222

Well, in the pdf it says to degrease it once, then it actually says that you wont need to do it again. It suggests reapplying the squirt lube after about 4 hours of mtb use which takes, what, 3 minutes?

In theory, i wont need to clean it now until i replace the chain. Just re apply the stuff, which for me whill probably be once a month if that.

Sounds good to me.

I know what you mean though, with no proof one way or the other, you just got to do what works for you.

Im just starting out, so i looked for advice on lubricating the chain etc, people recommended squirt, so i went with that and naturally followed the advice of the manufacturer.

champ222

steve_sordy wrote:

champ222 wrote:

Over 12 links with my vernier, i measure 6.0120 inches. By my calculations, or rather that of an online calculator, thats about a 0.2% increase

How can you measure accurately over 12 links with a vernier? The vernier should be pressing outwards, so you are measuring from inside a roller to inside another roller, but the opposite side of the roller, ie not from the same point each time.

Try this:
Set your vernier caliper to 5.700" and slot the internal tips in and then expand to take up the slack. Take the reading and compare to 5.700". You will get a larger reading; the difference is the wear, work it out as a percentage.

It works for up to 10-speed, but not for 11-speed and above. I suspect that the rollers are slightly larger diameters to 10-speed and below. So the thing to do is to measure a new chain and use that as your base line. Try measuring at different points around the chain, you may find quite different readings!

I measured from centre to centre, there are ways to do that accurately, without eye balling the centre of the pin. You can rest one side on the edge of the chain link, and line up the other side of the vernier so that its flush with the same point on another chain link further up. I did several measurements and the all came out much the same. I didnt measure with the chain off, since i was running out of daylight.

billycool

Or buy a chain measuring tool:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s?q= ... cat=direct

champ222

They look useful. They look to be about 12 links long, so no more accurate (how could you possibly measure over 12 links... etc) than a well used vernier (verniers do get longer, but get very expensive) but a useful tool indeed.

Thanks.

All done and clraned yesterday. Will apply the squirt today and go out tomorrow hopefully

☺

steve_sordy

BillyCool wrote:

Or buy a chain measuring tool:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s?q= ... cat=direct

Those are go/nogo gauges. They don't measure anything.

billycool

steve_sordy wrote:

BillyCool wrote:

Or buy a chain measuring tool:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s?q= ... cat=direct

Those are go/nogo gauges. They don't measure anything.

Sorry, I'll re-phrase that - "chain wear indicator".

For most of us mere mortals who don't have verniers (or wish to measure to exact micro-whatever), they are a useful tool to let you know when your chain is getting worn/stretched/tired and might be in need of replacement.

I hope that satifies the vernier wielding brigade! :shock:

FishFish

BillyCool wrote:

steve_sordy wrote:

BillyCool wrote:

Or buy a chain measuring tool:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s?q= ... cat=direct

Those are go/nogo gauges. They don't measure anything.

Sorry, I'll re-phrase that - "chain wear indicator".

For most of us mere mortals who don't have verniers (or wish to measure to exact micro-whatever), they are a useful tool to let you know when your chain is getting worn/stretched/tired and might be in need of replacement.

I hope that satifies the vernier wielding brigade! :shock:

I'm sure it will but there are infinite opportunities to apply pedantry to anything you say! This is the place for it!