Let's build a list, and recommend me a bike.

mattbass789

Well, it's been many a year since I posted here. But I want to use all your brilliant and nerdy minds to build a list.

I currently ride a 56cm (seat and top tube) with 13cm headtube, alloy. nothing special but I have enjoyed the long and low position and like the look of classic horizontal top tube. (The really nerdy amongst you will be able to figure out what bike this is, the same frame is sold under at least two brands I know).

After having a few bikes come and go in the meantime. I always come back to this one. I like its ride, its position is near perfect. and its super easy to maintain. Here's my question...

I am going to buy a new bike in the next 12 months, no rush, so I want to get something great. But I've ridden long enough now to know what features I am looking for. These are:

1. Alloy Frame (keep to keep cost down)
2. Disc brakes, just because, with Thru Axles.
3. Threaded Bottom bracket, after riding in a club with numerous creaking BB's having such on my own bike would stop me riding it.
4. A slightly short top tube than I currently ride, and slightly taller headtube.

Sadly, wanting these things limits me massively.
It rules out the CAAD12 for example.

The best thing I have found this far:
1. Isaac Graviton Disc (it helps that I live near where Isaac are based) this is so far my favourite. I like black bikes.
2. There's one from Rose that I believe fits the description
beyond that I'm not sure what else exists out there that fits this list...
3. Canyon Endurace I believe...

What am I missing?

BelgianBeerGeek

mattbass789 wrote:

Well, it's been many a year since I posted here. But I want to use all your brilliant and nerdy minds to build a list.

I currently ride a 56cm (seat and top tube) with 13cm headtube, alloy. nothing special but I have enjoyed the long and low position and like the look of classic horizontal top tube. (The really nerdy amongst you will be able to figure out what bike this is, the same frame is sold under at least two brands I know).

After having a few bikes come and go in the meantime. I always come back to this one. I like its ride, its position is near perfect. and its super easy to maintain. Here's my question...

I am going to buy a new bike in the next 12 months, no rush, so I want to get something great. But I've ridden long enough now to know what features I am looking for. These are:

1. Alloy Frame (keep to keep cost down)
2. Disc brakes, just because, with Thru Axles.
3. Threaded Bottom bracket, after riding in a club with numerous creaking BB's having such on my own bike would stop me riding it.
4. A slightly short top tube than I currently ride, and slightly taller headtube.

Sadly, wanting these things limits me massively.
It rules out the CAAD12 for example.

The best thing I have found this far:
1. Isaac Graviton Disc (it helps that I live near where Isaac are based) this is so far my favourite. I like black bikes.
2. There's one from Rose that I believe fits the description
beyond that I'm not sure what else exists out there that fits this list...
3. Canyon Endurace I believe...

What am I missing?

How much you want to spend?

mattbass789

Well considering alloy frames tend to top out around £1700, that makes a good upper limit.

Circa 105/ultegra groups too.

BelgianBeerGeek

Cool, thanks Matt. I wasn’t being facetious, it’s just the starting point for most of these threads. Sounds like a decent budget, someone will be along to help soon.

joe_totale-2

Seeing as you have some time, how about buying a frame such as this one which ticks all your boxes:

https://bowman-cycles.com/product/pilgrims-disc/

In terms of groupset, a 105-5800 disc groupset is currently £500 but as soon as R7000 comes out in a few months time the price will undoubtedly be reduced further:

https://www.vanillabikes.com/products/s ... e-groupset

Then do a big Chain Reaction order to grab wheels such as these:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/prim ... prod156950

You should have enough money left over to get the finishing kit from CRC as well, taking advantage of the BC discount. This probably isn't the cheapest way of doing things and it means putting a bike together but it does mean there's a level of customization that you have that you don't get from buying a complete bike.

surfercyclist

I have a Canyon Endurace and love it. Last years model with rim brakes, Di2, DT Swiss wheels etc. Superb. Best bang for buck I could find by miles. And it's light.

mattbass789

Thanks Joe, I'd certainly be willing to spend a little more and get the specific spec I want.

I have looked at the pilgrims disc, and I love what Bowman do. I guess it would have similar tyre clearance to the endurace. I think its a nice looking frame too. and has that "rare" factor.

mattbass789

I was more wondering, if we could compile a list of all high end disc, alloy, road bikes that have threaded bb's...

joe_totale-2

mattbass789 wrote:

Thanks Joe, I'd certainly be willing to spend a little more and get the specific spec I want.

I have looked at the pilgrims disc, and I love what Bowman do. I guess it would have similar tyre clearance to the endurace. I think its a nice looking frame too. and has that "rare" factor.

Yep, it appears that both bikes can fit 32mm tyres. According to Bowman you can get 30mm tyres and mudguards on the Pilgrims which makes it a fantastic all year bike, I always felt that not having mudguard mounts was a glaring omission on the Endurace.

wotnoshoeseh

Whta am I missing? Does the latest Kinesis Aithein Disc not fit the OP's list of requirements?

https://www.kinesisbikes.co.uk/Catalogue/Models/Racelight/Aithein-DISC

Plus there's discount available on it at present. Frameset for just over £550.

mattbass789

wotnosheseh ... kinesis has no thru axles. I don't see QR wheels as future proof on discs. Look at MTB's for example. But you are right, a stunning bike and I did consider it. Until i decided if I go disc it has to be hydro and thru axle.

thistle_

What do you want to use the bike for? Racing or just riding around?

I have the CAAD12. Hydro discs are great, but the wheels are rubbish and the paint scuffs really easily.
I think 9mm will be around for a while yet and a lot of wheels allow you to convert axles. How long were you planning on keeping the bike for?

When do the 2019 models start coming out? Maybe there will be more thru axle options on existing models if you can wait a couple of months - or you'll get a good deal on a 2018/17 model.

mattbass789

Bike will be spot of racing, shorter course stuff crits etc. Nothing too long distance.
Outside of that racing around lanes with mates.

I tend to keep bikes for min 6 years. That said, I tend to strip off parts, keep the frames. and have rebuilt these at later dates. Whether to sell or use my self. The current bike I ride is in its second incarnation.

So far the isaac graviton is the best for what I want, geometry somewhere between race and endurance, (I don't need wide tyres or mudguards, I have a winter bike I'm reasonably fond of) and its threaded BB, looks good, just need to change bars, saddle and such.

I'm happy to wait, I was more curious that there doesn't seem to be a lot out there with regards to the spec I wanted. So wondered what I may have missed.

Camcycle1974

Enigma Elite disc. Probably out of budget but you could get a frameset and build it yourself. Ticks all the other boxes and it's bloody lovely.

froze

I would highly recommend Shimano 105 if racing or not, but in racing if...reword that to when you crash, because in amateur racing you will crash, and when you do you might damage parts and 105 would be less expensive over the long haul to fix or replace then going with Ultegra. Sure you'll lose about 250 grams going with Ultegra but you'll also spend about $350 more as a groupset price, but individually as parts are broken and need replacing the cost will go up more with Ultegra. You would be better off if you're thinking of spending the additional $350 to save those 250 grams is to buy a lighter wheelset with that money instead. HOWEVER, I would use the Ultegra rear derailleur, it shifts a tad smoother, but on rough roads is where Ultegra shines brighter, Ultegra is better at taking up the chain slap as the rough road pounds at the bike than 105 does which allows Ultegra to shift noticeably better on rough terrain. You can actually see this being demonstrated in this fantastic video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcogHlmAwPk If you do a component swap BEFORE you ride the bike the Ultegra rear derailleur should only cost you about $36 difference. I knew about this situation between the two rear derailleurs back in 2013 when I bought my last new bike, so I had the 105 rear derailleur swapped out for the Ultegra because where I live the roads are rough, but because you race a little if you need to make a fast shift while bouncing on a rough street the Ultegra will do that far better than the 105. But everything else on the 105 is superb and very durable and there no need to go with Ultegra on anything else if you want to save money. Also the Ultegra rear derailleur will save you 30 grams, not a whole lot, but that will bring your total groupset weight difference to 220 grams.

I also believe you are 100% correct about using an alloy frame for racing because of the potential for crashes it will be cheaper to replace than carbon fiber and will actually hold up better than CF in a crash. What frame to go with is another issue I'm not well versed on because you want disk brake capability and thru axle capability. Not sure if this frame I'm going to recommend is compatiable with those two requirments but it is rather inexpensive and that's the Kinesis Racelight Aithein EVO (my god could they add more names to it?) frame, and it has an old school look to it, it also has clearance for at least 28 mm tires which is a good thing. Kinesis did relax the headtube a bit because the previous models got complaints about it being too twitchy, so now it has a more relaxed handling to it but it's also crisp and sharp but the twitchy lively handling of the previous model was preferred by crit racers, but if you're going to use it for other stuff besides racing only than this new geometry change would be better for all around use. The bike is lightweight, and low cost, plus a lot of European amateur racers have bought into this frame, so there must be something good going on with it.

I've heard horror stories on other forums of Canyon CF bikes breaking (no accidents involved) and Canyon having very slow and negative response to fixing or replacing those frames, I don't think their customer service is something I would want to mess with.

Wheels are guaranteed to get damaged racing, again due to the high frequency of crashes in amateur racing I would not spend a lot of money on wheels. One wheelset that's gotten high reviews on the amateur racing circles is the Specialized Roval SLX-24 Disc, this wheelSET cost about $750 but it's built so durable that it can take on off road riding as well! If you want something even lower costing (or maybe a set of backup wheels?) then the Shimano RX31 is a very good wheelset for just under $200 for the SET!

Now of course I'm showing you the tightwad way to racing, if you have endless supply of money well than the sky is the limit, but if you were like me when I use to race and had to pay for ALL my own stuff, plus entrance fees, car expenses, lodging, food, medical, USA racing license, etc, etc, etc, that stuff wasn't cheap, in fact I was one of the few guys either on my team or others that DID NOT have a spare bike or spare wheels...that could have been a major issue if I crashed destroyed something and couldn't race the following week or day, depending on the race, and I would be out of the running for points. While I did have some spare parts like tires, tubes, and even a front and rear derailleur and pedals (pedals can break if you go down hard) but those parts were cheap. I did eventually (about 4 years into racing) buy another set of wheels and even later still another bike, but that bike came along a bit late in my racing "career" and retired about a year after I got the bike. I was lucky...EXTREMELY LUCKY, in that I never had a crash while racing, but everyone else I knew had several, I did have a couple of crashes training which destroyed the front wheel several times though, but since I had relatively inexpensive wheels I just used the spare and bought rims and spokes and had them built with the old hub. Today's wheels you have to be careful because a lot of factory wheels you cannot have them rebuilt with off the shelf parts from the bike store, you have to order the parts which could take months to get, not something you want to be waiting around for if that's your only wheelset and you're trying to do a race in a week or so.

mattbass789

Froze you make some very insightful comments.
As ever I take a long time to make a decision. But by the time I do the NEW 105 will be what I go for... this will have the same rear mech design as the ultegra you mention, would that negate the need to change this component do you think?

You talk my kind of language, it's not that I'm anti carbon, I just don't think it's the best choice for a lot of people.
I would love the kinesis, another side project is building up a new winter bike, after using a cross bike for a few seasons, it doesn't really work for me on the road anymore. And will be trying to find a kinesis frame with all the mounts.

The Aithein evo disc, is nearly perfect, but its the QR wheels. Like i say, if you go the whole way to discs, get thru axles for the added assurance. if not I'd probably just stick rim brake.

keef66

https://masoncycles.cc/products/definition-frameset

Spend most of the budget on this and then buy the exact wheels, groupset and finishing kit you want. OK, you'll likely go over budget, but you'll end up with a great bike which ticks all your boxes.

Not sure I'd risk racing on one though...

philbar72

mattbass789 wrote:

Thanks Joe, I'd certainly be willing to spend a little more and get the specific spec I want.

I have looked at the pilgrims disc, and I love what Bowman do. I guess it would have similar tyre clearance to the endurace. I think its a nice looking frame too. and has that "rare" factor.

a few in my club have bowmans and the tyre clearances are a bit off (poor QC). having seen the bikes (palace), its such a shame...