Cervelo S5 Quandry

phil485

So old bike is up for sale and I've got my sights set on an S5.
Was planning on getting the dura ace specced model but then I got a bit side tracked...

Do I get the ultegra 8000 and with the money saved by one of the di2 upgrade kits and fit that.

Yes ultegra di2 will be slightly heavier than a mech DA, but I do like di2. Less wire in the wind which with this sort of bike must be a benefit.

Also have a quark which fits current ultegra which from memory doesnt work with new DA.

So what would you do and I'm fully expecting to get told neither, get a venge vias. I just for some reason really want the cervelo.

cougie

You'll never notice the aerodynamic benefits of di2...

Get etap and then there's no cables.

singleton

Personally I'd go with mechanical, but if you want electronic isn't etap the way to go?
Also, I think there are other differences in the spec to consider - such as wheels.

fixedgeartester

Get SRAM Etap, lighter than Dura Ace and more aero by virtue of not having nasty cables at all. Please don't even think about a Venge Vias if you ever want to stop quickly! The brakes are dreadful unless you go for the Disc models and there are no significant aero gains over the S5.
I've built lots of S5's for customers and without exception they have all been blown away by their performance. I personally use Etap on a Cervelo and it is by a mile the best groupset I have ever used. My only bit of advice for Etap is DON't use the SRAM Red/Etap one piece cassette as the gear shifting on these is quite poor and they are very noisy. Any Shimano cassette is better and way cheaper as well. Etap cassette: £230, Dura Ace cassette: £179 and only a few grams heavier.
This is my advice for what it's worth!
Graham

philbar72

get the frameset, and build it with whichever build kit you like, bought separately..... it'll be cheaper than a retail bike.

ryan_w-2

Please enlighten me how eTap is more aero than Di2?...

I have a single 6” wire than follows the stem and goes into the frame behind the steerer.

Di2 derailleurs are smaller and more ‘aero’ than eTap and the weight different is a swig of water between the two, in eTaps favour.

Having used both, I would pick Di2 everytime over eTap. The shifting is far faster and more precise.

sloppyschleckonds

Yes its nonsense Ryan
A bit like aero bikes, when its the fat lump in the saddle that makes the biggest difference

svetty

Quark won't work with new Ultegra if it doesn't with new DA.....

ryan_w-2

SloppySchleckonds wrote:

Yes its nonsense Ryan
A bit like aero bikes, when its the fat lump in the saddle that makes the biggest difference

Good job I’m flexible and powerful as fcuk then!

In regards to Quark, just buy some non Shimano 4 bolt chainrings (Rotor?) and no need for a new PM.

Matthewfalle

Best mate has an S5 with Ultegra di2. I personally can't see the point which is why my S5 is mechanical. Mechanical is also lighter.

As above, get the frameset and buy a full Red mechanical group set. The frameset is too nice for Shimano but not cool enough for SR.

They are a stupid design to build though but nothing drastic - just take a large glass of wine in the workshop with you.

ryan_w-2

I built mine up with no issues at all.

Full internal wiring / cabling. Absolute doddle.

Di2 is also lighter than DA mechanical...

stueys

Sigh, Di2 v Etap (100gram diff in total)-
Shim derailleurs - lighter
Shim shifters - lighter
Shim battery - heavier by 50g
Sram cassette - ligher, but you won't use the Shim one is better
Sram crank - lighter, but you won't use, S5 is bbright so stick a rotor in
Sram brakes - lighter, but shim ones are better.

If you factor in the bits you actually will use then it's a wash. Pick the one you like the most, I quite like syncro shift on shim but it's all personal.

fixedgeartester

philbar72 wrote:

get the frameset, and build it with whichever build kit you like, bought separately..... it'll be cheaper than a retail bike.

No it won't b. Cervelo quite deliberately price their framesets very high to encourage buyers to purchase full build stock bikes (I know this as I work in the trade with Cervelo) so it will always be more costly to build a bike from frame up. It may however, be the only way to get the exact spec you require.
There has been an awful lot of utter nonsense written in this thread, particularly in relation to the relative merits of SRAM Etap over Shimano Di2 etc. I would suspect that most of those comments are from people who have not extensively used both options to make a comparison or may not have even used either! Working in the trade I have been priviledged to have extended use of both types and they are both exceptional. For me SRAM Etap gets the vote for numerous reasons and if it is as one poster commented 'slower and less precise' than Di2 then the difference is so minutely small that it is impossible to detect in normal on road use and furthermore it will have no detrimental effect on your ride experience.
Points in favour of Etap:
1. Can be fitted and set up in 15 minutes (No cables to run)
2. If you're daft enough to let your battery run flat you can simply swap the one from the other derailleur
3. Battery is the size of a box of matches so you can easily carry a spare in your pocket (and fit in seconds when needed)
4. No missed or incorrect shifting when wearing winter or thicker gloves (unlike Di2)
5. Lighter overall weight than Dura Ace Di2
6. Cleaner neater and quicker build due to lack of cables / wires - very relevant on many of the recent crop of fully integrated aero road bikes like the Trek Madone, Venge Vias, Canyon Aeroad and several more.

Ultimately it's your choice but don't be swayed by opinions of people who have read something of have a mate who's had a bad experience when in reality they have never properly experienced all the options themselves. Thanks to my job, I have and these are honest unbiaised opinions.

phil485

Thank you all for your inputs.
I think the thing to take away at this price point nothing is bad and its all very marginal differences.
Ive got a lot of thinking ro do and will have a proper look at the kit thats on the various options. will also price up a frame only build but I cant see me getting it cheaper.

Tje nice thing is nobody has said Im crazy to want an S5 Will let you know how I get on.

964cup

I do wish people would stop believing nonsense about crank set compatibility. Your Quarq will work with DA. Or eTap. Or Ultegra. Or Super-bloody-Record. By what fantastic magic does anyone think the derailleurs know which brand of chainset or rings you have? Not only that, no one I know (including me) has ever had a problem running 11-speed chain (and therefore derailleurs) on a notionally 10-speed chainset. And if you do, for some bizarre reason, you just get some 11-speed rings for the existing chainset (from Praxis, or Extralite, or whomever).

Before you buy an S5, I suggest you try one. Mine is the older frame before they dropped the headtube, so won't be perfectly representative, but it's both uncomfortable (no vertical compliance) and doesn't handle all that well (lack of fork stiffness, AIUI). In the end I replaced it with a new S3, which while not an armchair from a comfort point of view, is at least usable for general road riding on UK roads.

phil485

Problem I believe is that latest DA has a closer releationship between the 2 chain rings than previous.
May be able to tune out if I run the quark but it would be a compromise.

Would love to try an S5 before I buy, just struggling to find a size 56 in the midlands. There is no official test fleet as yet.

JakeJ

If it were me..

I'd get a new S3 and use Sram Etap.

If it were me..

philbar72

Phil485 wrote:

Problem I believe is that latest DA has a closer releationship between the 2 chain rings than previous.
May be able to tune out if I run the quark but it would be a compromise.

Would love to try an S5 before I buy, just struggling to find a size 56 in the midlands. There is no official test fleet as yet.

Just adjust your front mech then. pretty easy.

meesterbond

964Cup wrote:

Before you buy an S5, I suggest you try one. Mine is the older frame before they dropped the headtube, so won't be perfectly representative, but it's both uncomfortable (no vertical compliance) and doesn't handle all that well (lack of fork stiffness, AIUI). In the end I replaced it with a new S3, which while not an armchair from a comfort point of view, is at least usable for general road riding on UK roads.

Having owned an old S5 and now riding a new one I’d say they pretty much fixed everything that was wrong with the first one. You can fit 25mm tyres, the head tube is a lot shorter (lower than the R series now), it also handles way, way better. The R5 is about the best handling bike I’ve owned and the new S5 is not too far off.

That said, whilst the comfort has improved that’s probably because you can run wider rubber rather than the frame itself.

Captain Fagor

Another old S5 owner here (2013) who isn't blown away by it. Not too keen on the BBRight bottom bracket standard and whilst the bike is good in some conditions, it's also a bit of an oddity in terms of compliance and handling as 964Cup says. Could possibly be tempted by the R series in the future, but for me the S series itch has been scratched.

ryan_w-2

Captain Fagor wrote:

Another old S5 owner here (2013) who isn't blown away by it. Not too keen on the BBRight bottom bracket standard and whilst the bike is good in some conditions, it's also a bit of an oddity in terms of compliance and handling as 964Cup says. Could possibly be tempted by the R series in the future, but for me the S series itch has been scratched.

It hasn't been itched if you've owned the sh!t old version...